HD-DVD fails as a viable media

[Kinmui]

It's sad all the focus and support for HD-DVD is so movie centric. When was the last time anyone saw news about HD-DVD rewriter / recordable HD-DVD discs? If CD or DVD market penetration and success is any indication, wouldn't the lack of development of HD-DVD as a storage solution is a clear indicator the format is not going anywhere.

Seriously, when you put the next-generation HD drive in your computer, would you rather buy HD-DVD which writes 25 GB, or Blu-ray which has a potential to go up to 8 layers at 200GB?

And another thing, the electronic manufacturers are backing up Blu-ray overwhelmingly. If you care about home theatre, wouldn't it be a rather obvious choice to choose a format which includes Pioneer & Denon? Honestly, HD-DVD is nothing but a cheap HD solution, at least that's how they are positioning themselves. I'm into premium home theatre systems, and they don't even have a decent high-end player in sight (yes, the Integra one, but I'll take Denon over it any day. The one I want is actually McIntosh, whenever they announce it...)

I just hate to see why Blu-ray should not get the recognition it deserves, and the thin arguments HD-DVD stands on.

Rants from a Blu-ray fan

[slaizer2000]

Originally Posted by Kinmui

It's sad all the focus and support for HD-DVD is so movie centric. When was the last time anyone saw news about HD-DVD rewriter / recordable HD-DVD discs? If CD or DVD market penetration and success is any indication, wouldn't the lack of development of HD-DVD as a storage solution is a clear indicator the format is not going anywhere.

Seriously, when you put the next-generation HD drive in your computer, would you rather buy HD-DVD which writes 25 GB, or Blu-ray which has a potential to go up to 8 layers at 200GB?

And another thing, the electronic manufacturers are backing up Blu-ray overwhelmingly. If you care about home theatre, wouldn't it be a rather obvious choice to choose a format which includes Pioneer & Denon? Honestly, HD-DVD is nothing but a cheap HD solution, at least that's how they are positioning themselves. I'm into premium home theatre systems, and they don't even have a decent high-end player in sight (yes, the Integra one, but I'll take Denon over it any day. The one I want is actually McIntosh, whenever they announce it...)

I just hate to see why Blu-ray should not get the recognition it deserves, and the thin arguments HD-DVD stands on.

Rants from a Blu-ray fan

HD DVD has the potential for more layers as well. I believe they have done a triple layer at 45MB. Still blu-ray wins out but your stating actual product for HD DVD and potential for blu-ray.

[Ascended_Saiyan]

I believe the max POTENTIAL of HD DVD is 60GB. That's NOT lab proven from what I understand...just theory.

At least, Blu-ray has proven 200GB in the lab and has announced their arrival to consumers in 2009.

[gvortex7]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

I believe the max POTENTIAL of HD DVD is 60GB. That's NOT lab proven from what I understand...just theory.

At least, Blu-ray has proven 200GB in the lab and has announced their arrival to consumers in 2009.

According to Paramount's CTO Alan Bell in an interview with PC World, he stated that HD DVD is indeed developing a triple layer 45GB HD DVD disc (and has been at it for about 2 years now), but was unsure whether or not it would work with the current HD DVD players available on the market today. Thus giving a reason for it's long development.

[jorg]

its been stated from several insideres that the current player will not be able to handel it

[Kinmui]

Thanks for correcting me on HD-DVD capacity, and it only confirms its weaknesses. There are probably people who argue against the extra space available on Blu-ray, but at 45GB/60GB, it's probably not enough for many to backup their data. I surely don't want to swap disc when backing up...

[SKRUhddvd]

Originally Posted by slaizer2000

HD DVD has the potential for more layers as well. I believe they have done a triple layer at 45MB. Still blu-ray wins out but your stating actual product for HD DVD and potential for blu-ray.

that sounds about right!

[Blu Tiger]

Originally Posted by SKRUhddvd

WOW! a 3 layer hd-dvd at 45mb! that sounds about right!

It's funny that our double layer disc is bigger than their triple layer.

[dBock]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

I believe the max POTENTIAL of HD DVD is 60GB. That's NOT lab proven from what I understand...just theory.

At least, Blu-ray has proven 200GB in the lab and has announced their arrival to consumers in 2009.

Incorrect. They are both lab proven at 150 for HD and 200 for Blu.

[Proteus]

Show me a link that shows HDDVD's 150gb 'lab proven'.

In fact, I'm fairly certain you won't even find one for a 'lab proven' triple layer. It doesn't exist.

Until it is submitted to the DVDForum for approval, it isn't 'lab proven'. As far as I'm concerned the 200gb Blu-ray isn't fully 'lab proven' yet either.

Finally, if they can't play in current players, including new releases, who cares? They are essentially pointless then because they are, in essence, creating a new format.

From the things I have read the Toshiba TL51 is actually a PC media disc at this time and never intended to replace current HDDVDs for HDM. Yet, it still is FAR from 'lab proven'. I think they need a burner capable of burning an HDDVD faster than 1x before they can even talk.

[dBock]

Originally Posted by slaizer2000

HD DVD has the potential for more layers as well. I believe they have done a triple layer at 45MB. Still blu-ray wins out but your stating actual product for HD DVD and potential for blu-ray.

Triple layer is 51G.

[gvortex7]

Originally Posted by dBock

Triple layer is 51G.

Well originally it wasn't 51GB. Here is the link:
http://www.physorg.com/news4052.html

It's only been a recent development (2007) that they're trying to expand to 17GB per layer.

[gvortex7]

I seriously doubt that the laser available in current HD DVD players can read these 17GB layers. The HD DVD specs would have to drastically change in order for that to become the standard. That's why those discs are still in a lab somewhere.

[dBock]

Originally Posted by Kinmui

Seriously, when you put the next-generation HD drive in your computer, would you rather buy HD-DVD which writes 25 GB, or Blu-ray which has a potential to go up to 8 layers at 200GB?

And another thing, the electronic manufacturers are backing up Blu-ray overwhelmingly. If you care about home theatre, wouldn't it be a rather obvious choice to choose a format which includes Pioneer & Denon? Honestly, HD-DVD is nothing but a cheap HD solution, at least that's how they are positioning themselves. I'm into premium home theatre systems, and they don't even have a decent high-end player in sight (yes, the Integra one, but I'll take Denon over it any day. The one I want is actually McIntosh, whenever they announce it...)

I just hate to see why Blu-ray should not get the recognition it deserves, and the thin arguments HD-DVD stands on.

Rants from a Blu-ray fan

Well you mention the 200G, but don't forget that HD DVD can do 150, and honestly, I think in the future it will matter but with 1T external drives getting under $400 dollars I don't think it's needed to go above 50G media, maybe in 5 years, but not at the moment.

Also if you're so into premium maybe you'd pick the format that overwhelmingly chooses VC1 over MPEG2? Or that has standardized it's format rather than a product that isn't even market ready. Blu-ray has the potential to be better, but it still has some major kinks. The question is will it fix those in time without upsetting customers.

[TruBlu2]

You are right. their arguments are flimsy at best. They are spoiled little Toshiba brats, crying for nothing.

hddvd will not survive.

[blubyyou]

Actually I remember reading that the TL disk was 51GB not 45 I do quite a bit of backing up of data so I am looking for a fairly large capacity I am just waiting for it to get to a real world price before converting from DVD storage. I like the Ridata positioning of apparently a 10 layer disk that will be up to 250 GB that can be used for both formats.

http://blogs.pcworld.com/staffblog/archives/003423.html

http://forum.mwave.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=486

http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/12/r...blu-ray-discs/