There isn't really a right or wrong answer to that...... a lot depends on your room, placement issues, etc.
I totally agree but got majorly slammed by so-called pro's here who feel it makes no difference whatsoever and have the anechoic chambers to prove it. I said I didn't know anyone who has an anechoic chamber in their house even if all that is true. Personally, I prefer bottom firing, elevated about 3 inches but Beta man is correct.
I totally agree but got majorly slammed by so-called pro's here who feel it makes no difference whatsoever and have the anechoic chambers to prove it. I said I didn't know anyone who has an anechoic chamber in their house even if all that is true. Personally, I prefer bottom firing, elevated about 3 inches but Beta man is correct.
Actually that wasn't what was said AT ALL and that's a total misrepresentation of what was said.
Allow me to recap:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavePS3
It's all about what a person can hear or detect. He stated a person cannot hear frequencies below 80hz.
No he did not. This is what he said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Terrence
No, your ears cannot pin point bass below 80hz, and that has been proven over and over again. You may be able to FEEL the pressure wave, but you will not be able to pin point which direction that bass is coming from with your ears. Our ears get less and less sensitive to direction and amplitude as the frequency drops. So your claims that you can detect direction flies in the very face of proven science, which makes your claims not so believeable.
You are confusing directionality with hearing Dave.
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Originally Posted by DavePS3
]He stated that a subwoofer sounds the same no matter where it is in a room and the shape, acoustics of a room make no difference
Wrong again - that wasn't said at all. Placement makes a different, driver orientation does not.
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Most sub manufacturers suggest best positioning for their sub's. Right in the owners manuals, plus suggest reasons for optional phase selection and crossover. Why do you think they do that?
Because subs carry information from under 20Hz to over 150Hz, that's why.
They don't want you to put your sub behind a wall anymore than your speaker. If you just want to cross it over at 30Hz, different story. They're writing manuals for joe schmoe who doesn't have a clue, not av-philes.
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If you take aa hardwood floor, in a hard room and place the sub in the middle, the characteristics are totally different if you cover the floor in broadloom and hide it in a corner.
Which is just what was said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Terrance
Subwoofer position within the room may be king, but not the position of the driver
In your case the position of the subwoofer is changing, but you make no mention of the driver position. Hence whether it's a side-firing, down-firing or forward firing is not important, only the location is, which no-one is arguing.
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If you as well as he, believe that bass is totally non-directional... you are dead wrong. It is MORE non-directional than mids or highs but unless you're down to 20 or 18hz... most people I know agree that it is not totally non-directional despite what a course tells you.
Way to clearly undefine bass. 200Hz is bass and yes it's directional.
60Hz is bass and no it is not directional.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavePS3
I'm not talking about chambers... I'm talking about customers rooms. I'm not saying I can tell everytime where the sub is, but I've been able to do it 75% of the time. When I can definately hear frequencies below 80hz... whan I can usually pick out where a sub is in a persons room, that suggests to me that the facts - scientifically speaking, are not always correct in every situation. No one I know, has an anechoic chamber in their house. Therefore, what works in a chamber... where conditions are perfect... where they write the laws of physics... does not always translate to to real world environment. To me, it's like a car that states MPG. In perfect conditions, yes but they always include 'your mileage may vary'. Same idea in audio I believe.
Again, no-one is saying you can't hear frequencies below 80Hz, geez.
As for the anechoic chamber, what it does is shows you that the reasons why you "hear" these low frequencies you think you do with directionality has nothing to do with the actual sound, but everything else...because when you're in an anechoic chamber with no reflection points the subsonic bass cannot be placed.
Which type of subwoofer performs better? Bottom firing or front firing?
get a monitor sub and you have them both .. I have a FB-210 and 1 is bottom and the other is front firing .......There is a FB-212 F/S on Audiogon 2 12s instead of my 2-10s and a 500 watt amp 895 bux...Its an incredible sub
There are no major performance differences between down-firing and front-firing subwoofers. Some people like the idea of looking at the big bad woofer of a front-firing sub. However, the down-firing subwoofers may also have a few advantages:
They can be constructed more cheaply as you do not need a grill.
If designed properly, they can look like a coffee table and may have more WAF appeal. See the picture of my down-firing sub below.
If you have children, you definitely need down-firing. Who needs a little child poking a hole into the woofer?
A rug under a down-firing sub can absorb some of the port noise and the noise from poorly-designed subwoofers.
This is what Dr. Hsu said in an interview:
Quote:
Q: I've noted that many subwoofers with good reputations for music applications use down-firing rather than front-firing drivers. Is this just coincidence or does it reflect a particular design philosophy?
Dr. Hsu: I feel that's just a coincidence. In the case of the VTF-2, the down-firing design was chosen to save money. A down-firing woofer doesn't need a grill to protect it. The upcoming VTF-3 will have a forward-firing woofer because the box is larger. We feel it would look too plain and large without a grille.
The performance issue where it doesnt matter may be right, but the way your room is setup and the type of flooring you have also come into play.
For example my sub has the option of being a front firing or down firing. When I positioned it to be front firing and sat in my sweet spot it wasnt the deep low bass that I was looking for...it sounded tighter. But then when I switched it to down firing, wow! It hit every bass note that it was supposed too, deep and low. I guess the way my room is setup and having it being front firing I was sitting in what they call "standing waves" or something like that.
However what I do know is that by putting my sub as down firing made a world of a difference and you would just have to experiment with it on your own.
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