Terminator 2: Skynet Edition

[LordCrumb]

I've been trying to figure out this title for a little while now... on the back it says 6.1 DTS HD Master Audio right, and from other threads here, some people say its 6.1 DTS HD Master Audio ES.

What is the difference? I just put it into BDInfo expecting it to come up 6.1, but it only comes up 5.1-ES?

Is something wrong? a misprint? or is it 6.1, but only displays as 5.1? I have never been able to make it come up 6.1 on my Onkyo 605, and have always thought it was my amp, but now im thinking its my BD60, or maybe even the disc itself?

Has anyone got a photo of their amp displaying 6.1 DTS HD MA ES while playing this?


Codec Language Bitrate Description
----- -------- ------- -----------
DTS-HD Master Audio English 0 kbps 5.1 / 48 kHz / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1-ES / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
DTS-HD Audio Italian 3840 kbps 5.1 / 48 kHz / 3840 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
DTS-HD Audio Spanish 3840 kbps 5.1 / 48 kHz / 3840 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
DTS Audio Portuguese 768 kbps 5.1 / 48 kHz / 768 kbps / 24-bit
Dolby Digital Audio English 224 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 224 kbps / Dolby Surround
Dolby Digital Audio English 224 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 224 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio English 224 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 224 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio Spanish 224 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 224 kbps
DTS Express English 192 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 192 kbps / 24-bit
DTS Express English 192 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 192 kbps / 24-bit

[ADstv]

It is 5.1 ES Matrix so it's 5.1 with the ES extension. If it was discrete then it would be 6.1 Alot of titles do refer the ES as 6.1 though.

My amp last time I watched T2: said ES Matrix on it with the DTS and ES light aswell as HD MASTER light showing.

[LordCrumb]

So because its 'ES Matrix' and not 'ES Discrete' I shouldn't worry about it not coming up '6.1'?

I don't get the 'ES' light showing up on my 605, but I do get the usual DTS HD MA, I have emailed both Onkyo and Panasonic to see which one needs an update... I think its the Panasonic myself, as a previous reply from Panasonic told me the latest firmware actually addresses an issue with T2, but he couldnt tell me exactly what particular issue.

I have forwarded this to my contact in Japan.
I don’t know if it is related but there is a firmware update available that fixes, amongst other things, an issue with Terminator 2.
The unit can be updated by connecting to the internet or you can download it from this link http://panasonic.jp/support/global/c...0_oceania.html
Or if you send your address I will make a disc for you.
If you haven’t already and have broadband try that, it is quite easy.
Please let me know if this fixes your problem.

Best regards

Steve Tonkin
Technical Representative
Blu-Ray, DVD and Camera Products
Panasonic New Zealand Ltd

I will have to read up more about 'ES Matrix' and 'ES Discrete'.

[ADstv]

Onkyo x05 do have the ES issue with DTS-MA. It doesn't see the ES flag in the DTS-HD MA stream. Not sure if there was a fix for it though, maybe someone with a x05 can confirm.

T2 will always show as 5.1 on any receiver as its only 5 discrete channels while the 6th one is matrixed and is only a extension of the surround channels.

[LordCrumb]

Interesting. I know there is a firmware update for the 605... and it was described to 'fix' a 'dts' issue. I might have to get it done and see if it fixes it. Just means shipping it down to Auckland.

[LordCrumb]

I did a search and couldnt find the original side by side comparison shot of the Terminator smiling, so I will just put these here.

The first capture is the first shot of T-800 smiling, the second two are from the next shot after John. Hopefully these are full quality images, seems a bit small in file size though. Either way you cant say this Blu-ray looks bad.



Next shot after John;



One frame further;

[Suntory_Times]

It does have a lot of DNR applied though.

[gettodamoofies]

Yeah, it has DNR. Funny though, as I really hate that overly processed look but when you watch the film it is IMHO not really noticeable. Anyone who has owned previous releases on DVD and has done a side by side comparison can see a clear improvement. Colour rendition, contrast and detail are all much better than the Ultimate Edition DVD I own. It isn't the best possible looking release ever as I'm sure if they went back to the original they could strike a new master, but I've seen it projected on a 106" screen and truthfully it's not as bad as some make out. A lot of people seem to have made a noise about the fact that it looks bad, yet the noise reduction doesn't even come remotely close to the insane levels seen in films like Star Trek 6 etc.

All in all it looks pretty damn good in HD and the sound is awesome.

[Sky_Captain]

Originally Posted by KaiGusto

Either way you cant say this Blu-ray looks bad.

Mmmmkay.

[LordCrumb]

Originally Posted by Sky_Captain

Mmmmkay.

That added nothing of any value. Are you really saying T2 looks bad compared to the DVD? give me a break.

[Suntory_Times]

Originally Posted by KaiGusto

That added nothing of any value. Are you really saying T2 looks bad compared to the DVD? give me a break.

It does look better, but it is fair from a good transfer. It's very average.

[Darth Tallis]

I recently picked up a copy of the Japanese Premium Edition Version 2.0. I bought the locally released Skynet Edition earlier in the year. I took caps from the smiling scene for comparison.

[LordCrumb]

Thanks. Fair enough then, Japanese is indeed better. Over $NZ140 for the Jap one though...

[Darth Tallis]

That's about the only problem this set has. The price. That and the bit about it being a Limited Edition item. I know CD Japan has it listed as out of print.

[LordCrumb]

Can you see any difference in these two shots? your one of Skynet is on the left, mine is on the right. I used 'Media Player Classic - Home Cinema' to take my shot. Captured in PNG format. I think the one on the left looks like it has slighty more detail...?

[Darth Tallis]

I use Media Player Classic Home Cinema and save to PNG format myself. Both my scenes were done prior to the cut of John telling Arnie he should practice with a mirror.

Here's another comparison pic of the Skynet and Premium V 2.0 I just put together.

[LordCrumb]

Cool. I'll capture that frame tomorrow (Watching Star Trek TOS). Did you zoom in on that one, or is it just a regular shot? What shot is that from? when she first picks up the phone? i'll try and get the same one.

[Darth Tallis]

It's after the part where John says "There's something wrong. She's never this nice." As she's saying "Where are you?" No zooming. Just regular size.

[LordCrumb]

ahh yeah I thought it was that shot, her expression is great.

[LordCrumb]