RGB or Limited for PS3?

[Porfie]

Just wanted to see what you guys thougt. I like the deeper colors og RGB but in dark movies it can sometimes look too dark. What do you guys prefer?

[gandley]

I wrote this out on another forum for the Sony 40w3000 bravia TV but it holds true pretty much for other screens.

Calibration via the PS3 can be tricky, you have to get certain settings right to work correctly with the TV. so i'll try to explain what i mean.

right, if you set the PS3 to output in 'display settings' RGB FULL, you must set the TV for RGB DYNAMIC RANGE=FULL. if you leave the TV setting on auto it will default to RGB limited, and show the image with cliped whites and blacks. However if set to FULL on the TV you cannot set the PS3 'BD settings' to either limited or Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. if you choose the latter you will get a green cast. So if you use RGB full, all setting must be set to 'RGB full' to get correct colours and no black level clipping.

out of interest the BD setting Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr looks the best, so leave the tv's RGB dynamic range set to AUTO and In the PS3 DISPLAY SETTINGS set RGB level as LIMITED, and as said the BD settings as Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr.

So to recap with the PS3 you have 3 main options.

PS3 'BD settings' and 'display settings' set to RGB Full=TV must be set to RGB dynamic range full.

PS3 'BD settings' and 'display settings' set to RGB Limited= TV can be set to Dynamic range AUTO or LIMITED.

and third and best,

PS3 'BD setting' Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr and 'Display Setting' RGB Limited= TV set to AUTO dynamic Range.

now the rest after the ps3 is correctly displaying its video levels.

[Porfie]

How would i set the RGB settings on my SONT lcd? No where in the manuel did i see anything about RGB

[gandley]

it should be in the menus under somthing like RGB dynamic range. if it dosent have this setting then RGB limited is the setting that most likly should be used.

If you set the to full and you lose shadow detail then thats the incorrect setting to use.

Full in reality dosent add anything over limited.

[Porfie]

Cool! Thanks for all your helpful info. Im going to try it when I get home tonight !

[vektar]

i dont get any of that it went right over my head... but ill try to read it again later

[SixAxiS]

I can't tell the difference with that feature.

[BTBuck1]

RGB Full works best on Samsung sets, On Sony's stay Limited or it will crush your blacks.

[gandley]

well you can use full RGB on a sony, but ithe PS3 has to be set to full RGB on both the PS3 and the TV. Sonys TV in my case tends a to default to limited in the auto setting, even when it should be going to full RGB.

the source output must match the display or else black gets clipped/crushed.

[Porfie]

Originally Posted by gandley

well you can use full RGB on a sony, but ithe PS3 has to be set to full RGB on both the PS3 and the TV. Sonys TV in my case tends a to default to limited in the ato setting, even when it should be going to full RGB.

the source output must match the display or else black gets clipped/crushed.

gandley

Do you mind me asking what model of SONT tv you have?

[gandley]

Sony 40w3000.

[JAGUAR1977]

Are crushed blacks when the shadow detail is VERY dark, clearly noticeable compared to the same picture when using 'limited' RGB.

On my Sharp TV I find the PS3 XMB menu looks better with 'Full' RGB, the black background is very deep, with 'limited' RGB it looks a little greyish.

However when you look at a picture or game with 'Full' RGB, the shadow detail and general picture can be very dark.

For the BD settings I use Pb/Cb Pr/Cr, so the issue is only for games which use RGB.

[gandley]

Originally Posted by JAGUAR1977

Are crushed blacks when the shadow detail is VERY dark, clearly noticeable compared to the same picture when using 'limited' RGB.

On my Sharp TV I find the PS3 XMB menue looks better with 'Full' RGB, the black background is very deep, with 'limited' RGB it looks a little greyish.

However when you look at a picture or game with 'Full' RGB, the shadow detail and general picture can be very dark.

For the BD settinsg I use Pb/Cb Pr/Cr, so the issue is only for games which use RGB.

yep thats correct, it will kill shadow detail and you will clip Below black info.
Dont set it to get a deeper black, that would be a mistake, as all your doing is setting incorrect video levels for your display.

again if you set the PS3 for RGB full, your display must either be set to RGB full or have an auto option that can correctly display RGB full.


Should also note if you set the display/TV for full RGB and then use Pb/Cb Pr/Cr it can throw a green vail to the image as the TV is forcing RGB full while the PS3 BD settings is trying to send Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. Now some TVs will handle this correctly others go into a head spin.

[Porfie]

Originally Posted by gandley

yep thats correct, it will kill shadow detail and you will clip Below black info.
Dont set it to get a deeper black, that would be a mistake, as all your doing is setting incorrect video levels for your display.

again if you set the PS3 for RGB full, your display must either be set to RGB full or have an auto option that can correctly display RGB full.


Should also note if you set the display/TV for full RGB and then use Pb/Cb Pr/Cr it can throw a green vail to the image as the TV is forcing RGB full while the PS3 BD settings is trying to send Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. Now some TVs will handle this correctly others go into a head spin.

Any idea how the Sony XBR3s and XBR5s handle the RGB correctly because like the other person said the PS3 screen looks like a richer blacks and the movies seem to have an eye popping color, but I have to turn up the brightness otherwise the black is just too black. I will mess with my Sony tv settings tonight to see if that helps.

[gandley]

Originally Posted by Porfie

Any idea how the Sony XBR3s and XBR5s handle the RGB correctly because like the other person said the PS3 screen looks like a richer blacks and the movies seem to have an eye popping color, but I have to turn up the brightness otherwise the black is just too black. I will mess with my Sony tv settings tonight to see if that helps.

well the extra colour is just an eye trick as you have moved to incorrect video levels. the black looks better because its clipping any below black info. sadly an LCD display does not do a true black, so getting a deeper black is fooling you and is incorrect. you have to then raise brightness to again see the below black info that is being clipped by the Full RGB setting.
Dont adjust the RGB level just to see a better black on the PS3 desktop, your just incorrectly displaying video levels.

Whers DarinP when you need him.

[JAGUAR1977]

My Sharp TV has HDMI input options for Pb/Cb Pr/Cr 4 4 4, Pb/Cb Pr/Cr 4 2 2 and RGB.

I set the TV to Pb/Cb Pr/Cr 4 2 2 and 'Dynamic range' normal for Blu-ray playback. BD settings on the PS3 are obviously Pb/Cb Pr/Cr.

For games I've decided to set the TV to RGB and 'Dynamic Range' normal. PS3 settings RGB limited.

Previously RGB Full gave me crushed blacks.

Re. the green veil if your TV and PS3 settings conflict, I found my TV to be fine, even when I left the TV's HDMI input as Pb/Cb Pr/Cr 4 4 2 and played games with RGB limited/Full, it sorted itself out.

From now on however I'll simply change the HDMI input from Pb/Cb Pr/Cr 4 2 2 or RGB for Blu-ray and games respectively, afterall it's only a quick and simple option change.

[PS34EVER]

I have a 1080p Samsung HL-T5687s LED DLP. To me, RGB Full looks better than limited (I just changed it to Full when it was on limited, and my picture looks a little bit sharper I haven't played a game or watched a movie yet, so I am not sure if that will make a difference). Under Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr Super-white (HDMI), my setting is off. Should that be changed?

Does anyone have any ideas as to what, if anything, I can do do tweak my picture and make it look a little bit better? Thanks!

[JAGUAR1977]

Under Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr Super-white (HDMI), my setting is off. Should that be changed?

Select Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr and choose super white on for the best Blu-ray playback.

With RGB Full it does initially look a little sharper (especially the menu), but once you play games or view pictures, it soon becomes clear that shadows are a little too dark, even more so if you don't change the TV/Display to support RGB Full/Enhanced.

Also look at your TV/HDMI settings and see what options there are.

If it's similar to my TV there may be a Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr and RGB input option, some also have an Auto option. If you can be bothered switch the TV/HDMI input to Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr for Blu-ray and RGB for games, or just leave it on Auto if you can.

Finally you can sometimes change the 'colour matrix' to ITU709 in the TV/HDMI options, which is the correct option for HD content. ITU 601 is for SD content.

[Deciazulado]

*sigh

computer levels = 0-255, Black = 0 White = 255
video levels = 16-235, Black = 16 White = 235

Full = 0-255, Black = 0 White = 255
Limited = 16-235, Black = 16 White = 235


Select Full if your display expects computer levels on its RGB input
Select Limited if your display expects video levels on its RGB input

No matter which goes in which, in both:
Black = no light output and White = maximum light output if you want to get your display's full dynamic/ansi contrast ratio.
So there won't be any below black or above white if you want that.
And both after being calibrated correctly should look the same. (Have the same blacks, whites, and greys.)

[secret]

The PS3's RGB full makes Resistance Fall of Man look pleasing and easier on the eyes. Everything just looks more solid and 3D.

However, alot of the gun's details are lost in this setting, so I leave the PS3 setting at limited, which makes everything look flat and diluted and milky or washed out, but at least I can see the details on the gun.

It's so unfortunate that Sony and Toshiba are taking so long to come out with their OLED or SED televisions. My television is acceptable, but it's old technology.