Cable Cards

[BobS]

I'm in the market for a 32 inch LCD TV for the bedroom. I was close to buying the new Sony 32 inch XBR model but then I saw on the Circuit City website that Sony just came to an agreement with the major cable TV companies and will soon begin selling tvs that use a new two way cable card. Naturally I want to hold off now because it doesn't make any sense to me to take a nice LCD TV and mount it on the wall only to have a huge cable box to deal with. Anyway, I wrote to Sony and asked for more infomration and they refused to tell me anything about any new products coming out. Has anyone else heard this and is there any other infomration around about these new TV's?

[Beta Man]

Haven't heard about it.... but if you're willing to wait, I'd expect 6 months MINIMUM if they won't even give you info from your inquiry..... basically means it's not being publicized, so street date is gonna be awhile.

[meckel]

I would say 6-12 months away from Sony (I could be wrong but, Sony was rather late to 2way party). CableLabs is still in the early phases of testing. There have been some rumors that the 1st test did not very well at all.

Panasonic is still planning to have thier 1st tru2way set out this year

http://crave.cnet.com/8300-1_105-1.h...rch=cablecards

on rumored issues

http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9966972-1.html

Not that this is a bad sign I'm sure thety will get it right. I would very much like to ditch my cable boxes and only use my TivoHD boxes and not give up VOD and PPV.

Keep in mind you will still need to a cable card from your cable co. it's very possible that they may be only in "test" areas to start. Their are sets that can be used with the current cable cards (but you give up VOD and PPV).

[tmok2000]

Yes, I have heard of it. It is called tru2way. If it works, it will be great. However, I think it will be a while before those TVs are available, and it will be even longer before your cable company can work with it. In my opinion, don't wait. Buy the 32" now, and by the time the new technology arrives, it will be time to replace the TV.

On a side note, those TVs will only work with cable. If you switch to satellite or IPTV, a box is still required. In a way, they kind of restrict you to cable service only (like CableCard today). Cable companies love it, but what about consumers? Personally, unless the standard is widely adopted by all of the industries, I wouldn't put too much emphasis on it. Do what I do -- hide the cable box somewhere else (like in a nearby closet or in the basement), and run an inwall HDMI cable to the TV. Use remote IR to control your cable box. This solution will work with satellite and IPTV as well.

[tmok2000]

Good point meckel. I forgot about the DVR. I doubt that those TV manufacturers are going to build in the DVR as well. Right? That's way too many components inside a TV that can fail. On a cheapo TV, that's not much of an issue. On a large LCD TV, I hate to have to replace it if the hard drive goes bad. That's why we don't see too many large screen TV with built-in DVD players.

[Mr. Joshua]

Uh what's the big deal with all this Tru2Way? I remember when we first had cable in 1982 and we had HBO and Showtime coming over just a coaxial cable no cable box needed. I wish I could go back to '82...

I guess all those filters to scramble channels just messed us all up.... They make billions so what if a few people steal it. Just go to a flat 10% sales tax and everything will be right as rain.....

[meckel]

Originally Posted by tmok2000

On a side note, those TVs will only work with cable. If you switch to satellite or IPTV, a box is still required. In a way, they kind of restrict you to cable service only (like CableCard today). Cable companies love it, but what about consumers? Personally, unless the standard is widely adopted by all of the industries, I wouldn't put too much emphasis on it. Do what I do -- hide the cable box somewhere else (like in a nearby closet or in the basement), and run an inwall HDMI cable to the TV. Use remote IR to control your cable box. This solution will work with satellite and IPTV as well.

Verizon Fios uses cable cards currently. I would expect them to support tru2way. Not sure about AT&T, but I thought the FCC ruling that forced what is now cable cards applied to them as well (couild be wrong). Satellite will never use them.

Also keep in mind that in household that paid for TV 85% of them have cable, 12% use satellite and 3% other (IPTV, Fios ect.) These numbers are from mid last year so they may have shiffed a little. So while I do understand your arguement keep in mind a larger % of TV watches could benifit from tru2way as they may see it as a way to break away a little from the cablecos.

[meckel]

Originally Posted by tmok2000

Good point meckel. I forgot about the DVR. I doubt that those TV manufacturers are going to build in the DVR as well. Right? That's way too many components inside a TV that can fail. On a cheapo TV, that's not much of an issue. On a large LCD TV, I hate to have to replace it if the hard drive goes bad. That's why we don't see too many large screen TV with built-in DVD players.

I would think it could help Tivo in some ways, but, could get Sony and Panasonic back in the DVR game. Somebody did try a built in DVR/TV years and years ago it did very poorly. It was around the same time they tried a TV with a build in DVT tuner (the issue was it only worked with DTV)

[meckel]

Originally Posted by wsciv123

Uh what's the big deal with all this Tru2Way? I remember when we first had cable in 1982 and we had HBO and Showtime coming over just a coaxial cable no cable box needed. I wish I could go back to '82...

I guess all those filters to scramble channels just messed us all up.... They make billions so what if a few people steal it. Just go to a flat 10% sales tax and everything will be right as rain.....

The issue is most TV can not decode a digital signal. That is way you need a cable box it has nothing to do with them scrabling channels. If your TV has a Clear QAM tuner than you can get all non-scrambled channels (pay channel like HBO, Starz, PPV channels) but on whacked out channel like 85.45 for ESPNHD or 103.7 for SciFi. In 1982 we had 32 channels now we have 600+ analog delivery can not handle that many channels.

The current cable cards will take the place of a cable box and give your channels on thier normal spot, however you lose all PPV ordering (other then by calling) and all VOD and guide. Tru2way still allows for you to order PPV, watch VOD and have the same interactive guide with out your cable box (that they charge $10 or more for HD a month for).

[tmok2000]

Originally Posted by meckel

keep in mind a larger % of TV watches could benifit from tru2way as they may see it as a way to break away a little from the cablecos.

Don't get why you think tru2way could help consumers break away from cable companies. They will still need to obtain the service from cable companies. If it is anything like CableCard today, the consumers will still have to lease the card from cable companies. How do they break away? On the contrary, I think tru2way will tie the customers closer to the cable companies, as the customers will now be exposed to all sorts of two-way services (such as EPG, one-click purchasing, PPV, VOD, ad listings, etc) that were not possible with one-way CableCard before.

[meckel]

Originally Posted by tmok2000

Don't get why you think tru2way could help consumers break away from cable companies. They will still need to obtain the service from cable companies. If it is anything like CableCard today, the consumers will still have to lease the card from cable companies. How do they break away? On the contrary, I think tru2way will tie the customers closer to the cable companies, as the customers will now be exposed to all sorts of two-way services (such as EPG, one-click purchasing, PPV, VOD, ad listings, etc) that were not possible with one-way CableCard before.

OK, maybe break away was a poor choice of words. I just ment that for those who are renting a box now, they would be able to get rid if it. I see a lot of other issues coming up for customersm without boxes and the cablecos, so, I'm leaving them out for now. Comcast currently does not charge for the 1st cable card per outlet. The most I've seen the rental fee on a cable card is 2.95 v. 9.95 and up for a digital cable box. So if you currently are on Comast with and HD box you could save 12.95 a month by having a 2way card. This could also lead to some very, very cool DVR options in the near future. I mean the Tivo monthly fee is less then the cableco charges for their "clunky" DVR, downside you have to buy the DVR. I'm I a little more clear?

I also know poeple who do not want the current cable cards for their TV or something like a TivoHD becasue they would give up VOD and PPV click and order. Personally I don't use VOD (have blus to watch) and until I can get MLB extra innings on Verizon I don't really use PPV, but for some it is an issue.

I also think the cablecos will find a way to use tru2way to screw the customer (it's kinda what they do). The only industry rated lower for customer satisfaction is the Credit Card industry

[Chevypower]

I have the 37XBR6 in my living room at the moment, we only pay for analog cable, but we have quite a lot of the digital/HD channels being picked up directly by the TV. I called the cable company to find out if they could add more, they told me they can't prevent us from accessing the digital channels, and what we get is what we get.

[meckel]

Originally Posted by Chevypower

I have the 37XBR6 in my living room at the moment, we only pay for analog cable, but we have quite a lot of the digital/HD channels being picked up directly by the TV. I called the cable company to find out if they could add more, they told me they can't prevent us from accessing the digital channels, and what we get is what we get.

your TV has a Clear QAM tuner built in. Do they come in on odd channels? Yes thney can not prevent you by law (FCC that is) they have to pass any channels in HD or digital that they pass in analog. Like all your local channels, or ESPN and USA (they are analog on most services). You could add more by changing you package.

[Chevypower]

the digital channels seem to be on 71.490-78.492 which include Universal HD, ESPN HD and others and 102.452 for TBS and 102.454 for TNT. I have some music channels on 100.xxx - 101.xxx

[meckel]

Originally Posted by Chevypower

the digital channels seem to be on 71.490-78.492 which include Universal HD, ESPN HD and others and 102.452 for TBS and 102.454 for TNT. I have some music channels on 100.xxx - 101.xxx

That's you QAM tuner at work. It amazes me that neither the TV makes or retailers talk about the QAM tuner or what it does.

[Chevypower]

Yeah that's why i was confused before I tried it, i knew it didn't have a cable card slot, so didn't know if I would pick anything up, and I didn't want to plug in rabbit ears to get some digital transmission.

[tmok2000]

Originally Posted by meckel

Comcast currently does not charge for the 1st cable card per outlet. The most I've seen the rental fee on a cable card is 2.95 v. 9.95 and up for a digital cable box. So if you currently are on Comast with and HD box you could save 12.95 a month by having a 2way card.

Pricing is a totally separate issue. Just because they charge $2.95 for a one-way CableCard does not mean that they will only charge a nominal increase for a two-way CableCard. It all depends on how much the customers are willing to pay, and what other alternatives the customers have. I would not be surprise to see the rental fee for tru2way card to be higher than or comparable to that of a cable box. Cable companies will find ways to screw you one way or another. The only way to keep prices down is to have competition. That's why we need satellite, FiOS, IPTV, TiVO, Netflix, Blockbuster, and Apple TV. The more access avenues that we have for Live TV, DVR, and VOD content, the less likely that any one provider will be able to hold us hostage.