7.1 dolby true hd ?

[aussiepete]

just wondering ive got a 7.1 set up onkyo sr 605 7.1 amp brand new sony 360 bluray player the problem is when im watching a bluray movie with dolby true hd should the rear surrounds dont have sound coming out of them .They dont seem to be all cables are hdmi my amp has on display dolby true hd 5.1 am i missing a setting some where just watched hulk bluray with this sound format any help would be great thanks

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by aussiepete

just wondering ive got a 7.1 set up onkyo sr 605 7.1 amp brand new sony 360 bluray player the problem is when im watching a bluray movie with dolby true hd should the rear surrounds have sound coming out of them .They dont seem to be all cables are hdmi my amp has on display dolby true hd 5.1 am i missing a setting some where just watched hulk bluray with this sound format any help would be great thanks

on A 5.1 sound track the rear surround will not come on unless you matrix the signal to the speakers ! you're receiver should have A setting called PLIIx . If you set the receiver to PLIIx it will matrix the sound so you're rear speakers work .

[BIslander]

Very few discs have 7.1 soundtracks. Most are 5.1. DSPs such as PLIIx, DTS Neo:6, and DD-EX can be used to matrix the surround channels into the rears so that all of your speakers are active.

However, you need to make sure that your Onkyo 605 can apply a DSP when it is decoding the HD sound itself. I seem to recall that 605s cannot do that. However, they may be able to apply a DSP if the player does the decoding and outputs PCM.

[Rob J in WNY]

Originally Posted by BIslander

However, you need to make sure that your Onkyo 605 can apply a DSP when it is decoding the HD sound itself. I seem to recall that 605s cannot do that. However, they may be able to apply a DSP if the player does the decoding and outputs PCM.

Aussiepete,

If the above is true, then you are in luck. Your Sony S360 player decodes both Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio internally, so you can send lossless multichannel audio to your receiver over HDMI.

Nice setup you have, by the way!

[aussiepete]

Originally Posted by Rob J in WNY

Aussiepete,

If the above is true, then you are in luck. Your Sony S360 player decodes both Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio internally, so you can send lossless multichannel audio to your receiver over HDMI.

Nice setup you have, by the way!

thanks for the help im still not sure how to apply these settings lol ill keep trying

[callas01]

Originally Posted by aussiepete

thanks for the help im still not sure how to apply these settings lol ill keep trying

in the blu-ray players menu screen under audio you want to switch the output priority from Direct(BITSTREAM) to mixed(PCM).

[Rob J in WNY]

Originally Posted by aussiepete

thanks for the help im still not sure how to apply these settings lol ill keep trying

That's the spirit!

I can't speak for your Onkyo's specific process for getting PLIIx operation (or other audio matrixing options), but a quick peek at your instuction manual will reveal it. Usually, there are surround mode buttons on most receivers' remote control.

Assuming you have your Sony BD player connected to your receiver using HDMI, check out the "BD Audio Setting" in your player's menu. For internal decoding (in the player) of lossless audio, make sure it is set to the "Mix" option (your receiver will display "PCM" or "LPCM" or something of that nature). For "bitstreaming" your audio (letting your receiver do the decoding), make sure it is set to the "Direct" option (your receiver will display the native audio stream type - Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD Master Audio).

As previously mentioned, there is not a great deal of BD titles out with full, discrete 7.1 channel audio, and some BDs don't even contain lossless or otherwise uncompressed audio, forcing you to settle for lossy Dolby Digital or lossy DTS sound.

[BIslander]

There's a problem with using Mix. (I know this is the case with the S550 and I think it's true with the S360 as well.) The Mix setting uses the lossy DTS core instead of dts-MA because the player lacks the processing power to decode dts-MA and mix secondary audio at the same time. TrueHD is decoded, though, when the player is set to mix. So, you may not be able to get 7.1 with dts-MA tracks. Now, that may not be a problem given the high quality of the DTS core. But, I thought it worth pointing out.

[solarrdadd]

hey pete, the hulk, both iterations of it are 5.1 DTS-HD-MA so to begin with you would only get straight 5.1, now, Hulk vs Thor/Wolverine is in 7.1 DTS-HD-MA; sounds great too! I, am not a big fan of matrixing to get sound out of my two surround back speakers. i understand what the 5 & 7 mean and i accept it. yes, you could set your receiver, if it has that function to matrix sound to your two surround back channels. there are movies that have 7.1 in the lossless flavor to begin with, there are threads on this forum that list them. new line cinema and lions gate are big 7.1 studios when it comes to blu. Just yesterday, i picked up "Fire & Ice" on blu with guess what, a 7.1 DTS-HD-MA track. Knock, Knock Neo, what is the matrix?

best of luck!

[Yeha-Noha]

Originally Posted by Rob J in WNY

...there is not a great deal of BD titles out with full, discrete 7.1 channel audio, and some BDs don't even contain lossless or otherwise uncompressed audio...

As of 2009-09-06, there are 105 BDs with 7.1 audio. Of those, 103 are lossless (and 2 DTS-HD High Resolution). By audio format, only 6 are DD TrueHD. Source.

[Rob J in WNY]

Originally Posted by BIslander

There's a problem with using Mix. (I know this is the case with the S550 and I think it's true with the S360 as well.) The Mix setting uses the lossy DTS core instead of dts-MA because the player lacks the processing power to decode dts-MA and mix secondary audio at the same time. TrueHD is decoded, though, when the player is set to mix. So, you may not be able to get 7.1 with dts-MA tracks. Now, that may not be a problem given the high quality of the DTS core. But, I thought it worth pointing out.

The previous-generation Sony BDP-S350 and S550 do not internally decode DTS-HD Master Audio, but the recent the Sony BDP-S360 and S560 do (the logo does appear on the chassis as well), making the "Mix" setting usable for sending decoded PCM down to a receiver (over HDMI). Just make sure you choose the DTS-HD Master Audio option in your movie's menu audio settings, as a few discs will not default to it.

Originally Posted by rwojtalewicz

As of 2009-09-06, there are 105 BDs with 7.1 audio. Of those, 103 are lossless (and 2 DTS-HD High Resolution). By audio format, only 6 are DD TrueHD. Source.

Interesting! 105 movies still isn't a lot (by comparison), but the number is increasing! Very cool site! Nice that it has a filtering feature.

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by Rob J in WNY

The previous-generation Sony BDP-S350 and S550 do not internally decode DTS-HD Master Audio, but the recent the Sony BDP-S360 and S560 do (the logo does appear on the chassis as well), making the "Mix" setting usable for sending decoded PCM down to a receiver (over HDMI).

Sorry, but that is not correct. While the S350 does not decode dts-MA, the S550 does. And, as I explained in my post, it uses the lossy DTS core track instead of the dts-MA version when set to Mix. I do not know whether that design flaw/weakness was carried over to the S360/S560 line.

[Rob J in WNY]

Originally Posted by BIslander

Sorry, but that is not correct. While the S350 does not decode dts-MA, the S550 does. And, as I explained in my post, it uses the lossy DTS core track instead of the dts-MA version when set to Mix. I do not know whether that design flaw/weakness was carried over to the S360/S560 line.

My bad. I thought for sure the S550 did NOT decode DTS-HD Master Audio internally, but the new S360 and S560 do.

[BigAl87]

Originally Posted by BIslander

Sorry, but that is not correct. While the S350 does not decode dts-MA, the S550 does. And, as I explained in my post, it uses the lossy DTS core track instead of the dts-MA version when set to Mix. I do not know whether that design flaw/weakness was carried over to the S360/S560 line.

Hehe indeed you are right about the 550, it does decode the True HD and DTS HD MA 3/4.1 when set to Analog.

I use it trough analog on my part

[progers13]

Originally Posted by BIslander

Very few discs have 7.1 soundtracks. Most are 5.1. DSPs such as PLIIx, DTS Neo:6, and DD-EX can be used to matrix the surround channels into the rears so that all of your speakers are active.

However, you need to make sure that your Onkyo 605 can apply a DSP when it is decoding the HD sound itself. I seem to recall that 605s cannot do that. However, they may be able to apply a DSP if the player does the decoding and outputs PCM.

I apologize if this has been asked before, but I can't seem to find a thread on it. Is there a discernible difference between the DSPs that are available? In other words, we've all seen the argument that DTS-HD MA = TrueHD = Uncompressed PCM. But is one of these soundfields better than another, or do they matrix the sound all the same? I must admit, I just added my rears this past weekend to fill out my 7.1. I am running my PS3 to my stereo via HDMI (with PS3 decoding the audio as I have a fat model). The lossless audio with 5.1 was great even before I hooked up the rears. But then I set it to PLIIx to get sound from the rears, and the whole soundstage seems to have more presence. Even the sides seem more alive than before. I watched Pitch Black and Chronicles of Riddick and the difference was unbelievable. Why are some people against matrixing when it enhanced the sound so drastically for me?

[VinnAY]

The Onkyo 605 does not allow matrix'ing of TrueHD/DTS HD-MA...I know, I own one and it makes me want to upgrade.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by VinnAY

The Onkyo 605 does not allow matrix'ing of TrueHD/DTS HD-MA...I know, I own one and it makes me want to upgrade.

I was reading through this thread with the intention of posting this very fact. I'm glad someone finally put it out there though.

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by progers13

Is there a discernible difference between the DSPs that are available? In other words, we've all seen the argument that DTS-HD MA = TrueHD = Uncompressed PCM. But is one of these soundfields better than another, or do they matrix the sound all the same?

PLIIx, DTS Neo:6, Logic7, and the others are all different. Is one better than another? It's usually a matter of personal taste. PLIIx produces stereo rears while some of the others do a mono rear channel fed to both speakers.

The lossless audio with 5.1 was great even before I hooked up the rears. But then I set it to PLIIx to get sound from the rears, and the whole soundstage seems to have more presence. Even the sides seem more alive than before. I watched Pitch Black and Chronicles of Riddick and the difference was unbelievable. Why are some people against matrixing when it enhanced the sound so drastically for me?

Some people are purists and feel that a 5.1 mix should only be output as 5.1. Others simply may not like 7.1 or may have rooms that don't work very well for rear channels. I'm sure there are other reasons as well.

[progers13]

Originally Posted by BIslander

PLIIx, DTS Neo:6, Logic7, and the others are all different. Is one better than another? It's usually a matter of personal taste. PLIIx produces stereo rears while some of the others do a mono rear channel fed to both speakers.

Some people are purists and feel that a 5.1 mix should only be output as 5.1. Others simply may not like 7.1 or may have rooms that don't work very well for rear channels. I'm sure there are other reasons as well.

Thanks BIslander. I added the 2 rear speakers expecting just 2 additional channels of discrete audio but the rest of the soundstage to sound the same. I didn't expect the overall presence to increase through the rest of the speakers, particularly considering I was already running the lossless audio formats. If anything I expected PLIIx to be less impressive than AFD. Glad to know it seems to be a matter of taste.