How Toshiba Could Exit with Class - Blu-ray Forum

TheRealBob · 01-05-2008, 02:42 PM

Here's how Toshiba can get out of this mess without looking like a villain:

They should announce that they will continue to support HD DVD plackback on a new, cheap dual-format player they will be releasing, so people will not need to lose the investment in their investments. Also announce they will find ways to license HD DVD playback technology cheaply to third parties so they can add it to their players.

Simultaneously with that, they make it unambiguously clear that HD DVD is done as a living format. Release Paramount, Universal, and anyone else from their contracts and outright ask people to stop making HD DVDs.

This way the format war is over, there are no more victims buying the wrong format, but there is a way for people to preserve their existing HD DVD collections. Some Blu-ray players supporting HD DVD playback would be similar to the way that some DVD players support Video CD playback since that format had some popularity in some areas.

While people have stated "there is no dual-format future" and hinted that the powers-that-be didn't want to see it go that route and put up obstacles to production of cheap combo players, I think a lot of the objections go away once it's bundled with Toshiba killing the HD DVD format. Would Sony or anyone else in the BDA care if Toshiba released a BD player with HD DVD playback capability in that scenario? I can't see why they would.

As for patents, etc., these would essentially be Blu-ray Disc players, so all the normal patents would apply there, and for the HD DVD playback option if the patent holders on that technology were smart they would get a smaller amount of money out of those patents rather than the nothing they'd get otherwise.

mystiksuicide · 01-05-2008, 02:48 PM

I think Toshiba should make a combo player but the other companies (LG and Samsung) need to discontinue the players immediately. J6P will continue to have doubt as long as those exists. There has to be absolutely no doubt of a so called "comeback"

radagast · 01-05-2008, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealBob

How Toshiba Could Exit with Class

Impossible at this point.

glenn22 · 01-05-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radagast

Impossible at this point.

I don't think it's impossible. Toshiba fought for their product, I don't see how that's a bad thing. They lost now and just have to accept defeat as graciously as possible.

TheRealBob · 01-05-2008, 06:34 PM

OK, I can see why this got moved to off-topic, even though I think it still relates to Blu-ray as it's about how Toshiba could gracefully end the format war by making Blu-ray players with HD DVD playback ability. Anyway...

I don't see why there should be a problem with any company making a combo product as long as production of HD DVD discs is discontinued and the player is sold as a Blu-ray player that also has a feature where it plays HD DVD discs. That should not introduce any confusion with J6P.

I agree that it does create confusion if HD DVD is seen as still viable, and I understand why the Blu-ray people didn't want it. But if HD DVD dies, it's just a nice add-on feature for people who already invested in HD DVD libraries, and it doesn't hurt anybody going forward.

sj001 · 01-05-2008, 06:36 PM

I think Toshiba should just concede defeat at CES and get this over. It will be less painful for everyone, especially them, and they will get some respect from people for not being sore losers and/or being delusional.

TheRealBob · 01-05-2008, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sj001

I think Toshiba should just concede defeat at CES and get this over. It will be less painful for everyone, especially them, and they will get some respect from people for not being sore losers and/or being delusional.

Yep. We can only hope there are some intense negotiations going on that will bring this to an end, while possibly allowing Toshiba some sort of face-saving move.

I think it's a good sign that HD DVD events at CES have been cancelled. Toshiba had to know Warner was up for grabs, since it was an open secret, so the fact that they didn't just immediately switch to Plan B makes me think there might not be any Plan B. Toshiba is not a stupid company, and if they conclude that there's no money in going forward, then they're probably not going to go forward.

181 · 01-05-2008, 07:56 PM

sepuku. it's the only way...

JimPullan · 01-05-2008, 08:06 PM

IMO there is no graceful position Toshiba can take, continuing their quest for the HD DVD format. They have the manufacturing capability to produce Blu-ray DVD Players. Continuing this is foolish, and NO dual format player, ONE ONLY . . . Blu-ray - PERIOD. Either join us of get out of the way. No middle ground, no concessions, no more trick plays. Join us or go back to just making TV's. That's my take on all this, and I am not bitter with Toshiba or what the attempted, but now its over. Move on. [Jim]

TheRealBob · 01-05-2008, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimPullan

IMO there is no graceful position Toshiba can take, continuing their quest for the HD DVD format.

I think everyone agrees with that the quest for HD DVD should end, including me in my posts in this thread. The idea is that Toshiba could support an HD DVD playback option for the dead HD DVD format in the context of the Blu-ray player.

I could see the BDA and its allies agreeing to that as long as the final nail is put in the coffin of HD DVD first (manufacturing stops, no more titles, Paramount and Universal released from their contracts, etc.).

I could not see the BDA and its allies agreeing to this while HD DVD movies are still being made. No way, and that's not what I was suggesting.

Downhere · 01-05-2008, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mystiksuicide

I think Toshiba should make a combo player but the other companies (LG and Samsung) need to discontinue the players immediately. J6P will continue to have doubt as long as those exists. There has to be absolutely no doubt of a so called "comeback"

This is not wise in my opinion. There are many people who have HD DVD's and to bridge the gap it would make sense for manufacturers to continue making combo players. Not only that, but I have a feeling we will see a rise in sales for combo players.

ESUNintel · 01-06-2008, 03:39 AM

Here's an article from CNN...

Apparently this captured HD-DVD by surprise, and maybe they have plans??

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...5_FORTUNE5.htm

TheRealBob · 01-06-2008, 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESUNintel

Here's an article from CNN...

Apparently this captured HD-DVD by surprise, and maybe they have plans??

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...5_FORTUNE5.htm

Heh. Liars. Both sides were heavily courting Warner, who they both thought was ready to make a move one way or the other, so this could not have been a total surprise for Toshiba. I would expect both companies to have a Plan B if the other side got Warner. The fact that Toshiba seems to have no Plan B and is cancelling HD DVD CES events suggests to me that they knew that if they didn't get Warner it was game over.

turboedguy · 01-06-2008, 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 181

sepuku. it's the only way...

agreed, its the only way.

01-05-2008, 02:42 PM	#1
TheRealBob Expert Member Member since:Dec 2007 Blu-ray reviews:1	How Toshiba Could Exit with Class Here's how Toshiba can get out of this mess without looking like a villain: They should announce that they will continue to support HD DVD plackback on a new, cheap dual-format player they will be releasing, so people will not need to lose the investment in their investments. Also announce they will find ways to license HD DVD playback technology cheaply to third parties so they can add it to their players. Simultaneously with that, they make it unambiguously clear that HD DVD is done as a living format. Release Paramount, Universal, and anyone else from their contracts and outright ask people to stop making HD DVDs. This way the format war is over, there are no more victims buying the wrong format, but there is a way for people to preserve their existing HD DVD collections. Some Blu-ray players supporting HD DVD playback would be similar to the way that some DVD players support Video CD playback since that format had some popularity in some areas. While people have stated "there is no dual-format future" and hinted that the powers-that-be didn't want to see it go that route and put up obstacles to production of cheap combo players, I think a lot of the objections go away once it's bundled with Toshiba killing the HD DVD format. Would Sony or anyone else in the BDA care if Toshiba released a BD player with HD DVD playback capability in that scenario? I can't see why they would. As for patents, etc., these would essentially be Blu-ray Disc players, so all the normal patents would apply there, and for the HD DVD playback option if the patent holders on that technology were smart they would get a smaller amount of money out of those patents rather than the nothing they'd get otherwise.

01-06-2008, 03:39 AM	#12
ESUNintel Senior Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Colorado	Surprised? Here's an article from CNN... Apparently this captured HD-DVD by surprise, and maybe they have plans?? http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...5_FORTUNE5.htm

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01-05-2008, 02:48 PM	#2
mystiksuicide Blu-ray Guru Member since:Sep 2007 Location:Miami Blu-ray collection:305 Blu-ray reviews:27	I think Toshiba should make a combo player but the other companies (LG and Samsung) need to discontinue the players immediately. J6P will continue to have doubt as long as those exists. There has to be absolutely no doubt of a so called "comeback"

01-05-2008, 06:34 PM	#5
TheRealBob Expert Member Member since:Dec 2007 Blu-ray reviews:1	OK, I can see why this got moved to off-topic, even though I think it still relates to Blu-ray as it's about how Toshiba could gracefully end the format war by making Blu-ray players with HD DVD playback ability. Anyway... I don't see why there should be a problem with any company making a combo product as long as production of HD DVD discs is discontinued and the player is sold as a Blu-ray player that also has a feature where it plays HD DVD discs. That should not introduce any confusion with J6P. I agree that it does create confusion if HD DVD is seen as still viable, and I understand why the Blu-ray people didn't want it. But if HD DVD dies, it's just a nice add-on feature for people who already invested in HD DVD libraries, and it doesn't hurt anybody going forward.

01-05-2008, 06:36 PM	#6
sj001 Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Rochester, NY Blu-ray collection:317 DVD collection:17 Trading Score:5	I think Toshiba should just concede defeat at CES and get this over. It will be less painful for everyone, especially them, and they will get some respect from people for not being sore losers and/or being delusional.

01-05-2008, 07:56 PM	#8
181 Active Member Member since:Dec 2007	sepuku. it's the only way...

01-05-2008, 08:06 PM	#9
JimPullan Senior Member Member since:Jun 2006 Location:Ocala, FL	IMO there is no graceful position Toshiba can take, continuing their quest for the HD DVD format. They have the manufacturing capability to produce Blu-ray DVD Players. Continuing this is foolish, and NO dual format player, ONE ONLY . . . Blu-ray - PERIOD. Either join us of get out of the way. No middle ground, no concessions, no more trick plays. Join us or go back to just making TV's. That's my take on all this, and I am not bitter with Toshiba or what the attempted, but now its over. Move on. [Jim]

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