The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug Extended Edition - November 4, 2014

[captveg]

Sorry, but while there's less consensus, that's hardly a "majority" disapproving. That's still a truckload of box office. Especially when you look at the international audience.

As for Oscars - when it comes to genre films, the Oscars need it to be something they haven't seen before. LOTR was new to them, so they embraced it. (One could argue that after 11 Oscars for ROTK they meant that as a "Don't ever expect us to give you any award ever again, so go play in your nerd corner and make us money, but no more awards. Those are for the "serious" movies again"). The Hobbit to them is actually the OPPOSITE of what you're claiming. To them it's all more of the same but just 10 years later. They traditionally don't embrace that for genre films. It's why The Silence of the Lambs can sweep the awards but no matter how good a psychological thriller was that came after it they would largely ignore it as "been there, done that." It's simply their MO. You really think Oscar voters give a crap if Tauriel is from the book or not?

In any case, you don't like these movies much, I do. We're never bridging that gap. I'm sorry you didn't get the Hobbit films you always wanted. Personally I was interested in Jackson's films of The Hobbit and that's what I've got. So we're not even approaching the films the same way, in truth.

[Kryptonic]

Tauriel is fantastic and one of the highlights of Desolation, as was Legolas. I applaud Jackson on how effortlessly he fit these two into the story.

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by Taikero

The numbers show the majority don't approve.

When Jackson stuck closer to the source material, Oscars and acclaim happened. Tickets were bought en masse!

Fellowship - 4 Oscar wins, 13 total noms
$313,364,114

Two Towers - 2 Oscar wins, 6 total noms
$339,789,881

Return of the King - 11 Oscar wins, 11 total noms
$377,027,325

The farther he steps away from that source material, the less we've seen that happening.

Hobbit 1 - 0 Oscar wins, 3 total noms
$303,003,568

Hobbit 2 - 0 Oscar wins, 3 total noms
$258,366,855

Cause and effect. No more, no less.

The Hobbit was not as popular a book as Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit films are also coming nearly a decade after Return of the King. Also, An Unexpected Journey crossed $1 billion and Smaug fell just short of that. I seriously doubt anyone at WB/NL/MGM is concerned about the box office success considering the franchise will pull in around $3 billion by the end, nearly the same as LOTR, and not to mention the hundreds of millions in merchandizing, pay-per-view, cable, DVD/BD, etc.

[GenPion]

Speaking of oscar nominations for this film series... given that the first two Hobbit films didn't win anything, I don't expect for much to change in that regard. At least, I don't expect major awards to be won.

However, given that the third could end up being the best in the series, does anyone else think there is a possibility it might at least garner a lot more nominations and a few technical award wins? I could see it being a contender for score, editing, visual effects, costume design, etc. if the film is tremendously well received. Maybe a few other award nominations specific to the technical awards ceremony. Maybe more than a few...

What does everyone else think about the possibility of a Best Picture nomination? I feel that it might actually stand a chance at a nomination if people (including film critics) respond with great enthusiasm for the final entry. I doubt it will win, as the Oscars traditionally always go for more "serious" films and the awards sweep of Return of the King was unprecedented. I also remember the number of people who described it as the worst and most boring ceremony ever as every award was practically handed out to them and a lot of the same speakers (including Jackson) kept going up on stage.

However, it was one of my favorites. Even with the first two entries winning a few awards and some recognition, I never would have though Return of the King would win the most Academy Awards in motion-picture history (well, it's a tie technically, but that still amazes me).

[captveg]

It's simply not on the Academy's radar. They're over it. 2-4 noms is probably the case no matter how good the film is.

[Kryptonic]

They basically gave Jackson the Oscar for ROTK due to overwhelming demand given how they passed the previous two films over for the last two years. There's not a chance this gets anything more than some technical nominations.

[Geoff D]

I've always seen ROTK's Oscar haul as more of a catch-all for the entire trilogy, even though the first two got several awards of their own. Calling it a sympathy vote is definitely the wrong phrasing but that's kinda how I look at it, like what the cap'n said about the Academy basically saying "you did good kid, real good, but it's never gonna be as good as this again, see?".

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I've always seen ROTK's Oscar haul as more of a catch-all for the entire trilogy, even though the first two got several awards of their own. Calling it a sympathy vote is definitely the wrong phrasing but that's kinda how I look at it, like what the cap'n said about the Academy basically saying "you did good kid, real good, but it's never gonna be as good as this again, see?".

They didn't want to give it to this silly fantasy movie in the first place. They basically had to give it to him considering all of the pressure from critics, fans, and audiences.

[prkprkprk]

Originally Posted by Taikero

The numbers show the majority don't approve.

When Jackson stuck closer to the source material, Oscars and acclaim happened. Tickets were bought en masse!

Fellowship - 4 Oscar wins, 13 total noms
$313,364,114

Two Towers - 2 Oscar wins, 6 total noms
$339,789,881

Return of the King - 11 Oscar wins, 11 total noms
$377,027,325

The farther he steps away from that source material, the less we've seen that happening.

Hobbit 1 - 0 Oscar wins, 3 total noms
$303,003,568

Hobbit 2 - 0 Oscar wins, 3 total noms
$258,366,855

Cause and effect. No more, no less.

Worldwide, though...

LotR1 - $871.5mil
LotR2 - $926.0mil
LotR3 - $1,119.9mil

Hobbit1 - $1,017.0mil
Hobbit2 - $958.4mil

Not so much a case of cause and effect.

Though there's a slight drop, I doubt it's because it wasn't true to the source material. The first two Hobbit films have still managed to outgross the first two LotR films.

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by prkprkprk

Worldwide, though...

LotR1 - $871.5mil
LotR2 - $926.0mil
LotR3 - $1,119.9mil

Hobbit1 - $1,017.0mil
Hobbit2 - $958.4mil

Not so much a case of cause and effect.

Though there's a slight drop, I doubt it's because it wasn't true to the source material. The first two Hobbit films have still managed to outgross the first two LotR films.

But 3D and inflation and blah blah blah. That's going to be the counter argument. Yeah, those movies sold more tickets, but eh...the Hobbit movies have been enormous earners for everyone involved.

[punisher]

Originally Posted by Kryptonic

The Hobbit was not as popular a book as Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit films are also coming nearly a decade after Return of the King..

The Hobbit book is far more popular than the LOTR trilogy....We've seen it all done before by Jackson and his brutality and violence in films has worn thin especially for a great book that myself and others read as kids. The Hobbit films are more sci fi and special effect horror films that is based on the book and overextended into 3 films. Great at the box office but not a great achievement in film as the LOTR. Lots of film fans but those familiar with the book and having read it know this is not The Hobbit as it should have been but purely a money making project .

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by punisher

The Hobbit book is far more popular the the LOTR trilogy....We've seen it all done before by Jackson and his brutality and violence in films has worn thin especially for a great book that myself and others read as kids. The Hobbit films are more sci fi and special effect horror films that is based on the book and overextended into 3 films. Great at the box office but not a great achievement in film as the LOTR. Lots of film fans but those familiar with the book and having read it know this is not The Hobbit as it should have been but purely a money making project .

Lord of the Rings has sold over 150 million copies since it's been in print. The Hobbit has sold 100 million copies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books

[Jbug]

As for enjoying the movies, I do. I wish we would not always wind up battling each other over this or that. I'm saving watching the EE version till after Thanksgiving dinner. Just the kind of movie for such a holiday and let's remember to give thanks for what we are thankful for.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by punisher

The Hobbit book is far more popular the the LOTR trilogy....We've seen it all done before by Jackson and his brutality and violence in films has worn thin especially for a great book that myself and others read as kids. The Hobbit films are more sci fi and special effect horror films that is based on the book and overextended into 3 films. Great at the box office but not a great achievement in film as the LOTR. Lots of film fans but those familiar with the book and having read it know this is not The Hobbit as it should have been but purely a money making project .

I cannot remember if it was middle school or high school, but some students were reading The Hobbit I recall depending on the teacher and English class.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I cannot remember if it was middle school or high school, but some students were reading the The Hobbit I recall depending on the teacher and English class.

We had to read it in 7th grade at my school.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I've always seen ROTK's Oscar haul as more of a catch-all for the entire trilogy, even though the first two got several awards of their own. Calling it a sympathy vote is definitely the wrong phrasing but that's kinda how I look at it, like what the cap'n said about the Academy basically saying "you did good kid, real good, but it's never gonna be as good as this again, see?".

Fellowship should have won in 2001. Mystic River should have won in 2003 (especially for screenwriting), but that's what happens when you give out awards based on "who is due" rather than the actual achievements.

[Ernest Rister]

Oh...just for my own curiosity, I used Box Office Mojo to adjust the LOTR films into 2014 dollars.

THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING (domestic, 2014 $8.12 average ticket price)
$442,294,400

THE TWO TOWERS (domestic, $8.12 ticket price)
$465,270,000

THE RETURN OF THE KING (domestic, $8.12 ticket price)
$499,689,700

THE HOBBIT: AN UNEXPECTED JOURNEY (domestic, $8.12 ticket price)
$307,221,700

THE HOBBIT: THE DESOLATION OF SMAUG (domestic, $8.12 ticket price)
$258,366,855

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Fellowship should have won in 2001. Mystic River should have won in 2003 (especially for screenwriting), but that's what happens when you give out awards based on "who is due" rather than the actual achievements.

That's what I mean, I've always thought Fellowship was the best film of the trilogy anyway and the avalanche of golden baldies for ROTK was more for the saga as a whole than for that one film.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

That's what I mean, I've always thought Fellowship was the best film of the trilogy anyway and the avalanche of golden baldies for ROTK was more for the saga as a whole than for that one film.

Shoot -- in 2002, Academy voters said they were waiting for Return of the King to reward the series as a whole, which is why they broke for Chicago. In 2001, they passed on Fellowship because "Ron Howard was due", then in 2002, passed on The Two Towers knowing they could vote for Return of the King. But then here comes 2003, a very strong year, and Philippa "I improved Tolkien" Boyens wins a screenwriting Oscar for the weakest film in the series over Mystic River, which THEN leads to Million Dollar Baby getting sympathy votes for Mystic River getting shafted the year before, which THEN leads to Scorsese finally winning an Oscar for The Departed because The Aviator got snookered by Million Dollar Baby.

[punisher]

Originally Posted by Kryptonic

Lord of the Rings has sold over 150 million copies since it's been in print. The Hobbit has sold 100 million copies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books

a lot of that was due to the movies..be curious to see what the pre filming sales numbers were. Either way the Hobbit is superior to the other 3 IMO and I am sure I am not alone.Also, the book is superior to the film. You can let your kids read the book and I would encourage them to do so,but would you really let them watch the Hobbit movies?