Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens (USE SPOILER TAGS!)

[nst7]

Originally Posted by Dr_Bedlo

I have a question that I'd like anyone with experience seeing the film multiple times and venues to respond to. I've seen the film twice myself so far. First time on a standard digital IMAX 3D presentation, and the second time at a Cinemark XD Real 3D. I liked the IMAX presentation the best of the two.

I've recently discovered that a little further south east of my area is a theater that has it in Dolby Atmos. I am toying with the idea of making a drive to the theater to see it. However I wonder if the difference, sonically, will be all that remarkable to make the 2.5 hour trek? Any thoughts (other than I'm more than a bit touched)???

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I have this note also in the spoiler version of this thread.

I specifically went to see this in Dolby Atmos after seeing it in a normal theater. The experience was a pointless waste of money.

This was my second time going to see a movie in Atmos (the first was Guardians of the Galaxy). Both times I could hear hardly anything different, other than that both times it was louder (too loud in my opinion).

I am completely sold on Atmos for the home as I have heard great demos in home theater stores. But something seems to get lost in translation at the commercial theater. Perhaps it's the fact that it's such a big room, or maybe there are not standards being applied to make the experience consistent from theater to theater. I know others have had great experiences in the theater, so I'm not sure what's going on.

It could also be that these two particular movies had very non-agressive Atmos mixes.

So based on my experience, I wouldn't make that kind of drive. But I am looking forward to setting up Atmos in my home, and hope that the Blu Ray of this movie is encoded with it.

[CrazyBlu-RayFan]

Originally Posted by JamesKurtovich

They likely wanted to play it safe with common elements everyone associates with the franchise.

That's the problem, they played it too safe and now it seems like this new trilogy won't have a lot of promise. I agree that Rey isn't a Luke copy, she is way more powerful and intelligent than Luke. Kylo Ren isn't a Vader copy, but he is a copy of Anakin from the prequels.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by YoungCrazyBlu-RayFan

There's similarities and then there's just rehashing.

[Show spoiler]Han Solo replaces Obi-Wan as the hero's (Rey) mentor figure who is killed by the villain while they watch. The new Death Star (that's what I'm calling it) makes the same mistake as the first one, weak point at the end of a trench. Also this whole plot started because Rey found a droid with important information to help the rebels, which is almost exactly how Luke got thrown in the plot in A New Hope. Plus the role reversal of Empire's twist, this time one of the heroes is the father of the villain.

The film doesn't have original bone in it's story structure.

.

[aiman04]

Kindly not judge our taste on films based on our blu-ray collection. Some of mine were bought for my wife, some for my kids. Some just for the great sound and picture quality, you know home theater enthusiasts do that. But all are bought by me so that's why they're in the list.

Originally Posted by rickah88

I've seen IV
I've seen VII

Sure there are some subtle similarities. As a fan of both, I welcomed them.
What film series doesn't have similarities? Isn't the crux of a film series?

Originally Posted by Ross Douthat

Walk with me here: You've got an orphaned Force adept unaware of her powers living on a desert planet near an old man played by a famous British actor who probably holds secrets to her past; she then meets up with a droid carrying secret plans that its Rebel Alliance — sorry, Resistance — owner hid inside it just before she — sorry, he — was captured and tortured by the Empire — sorry, the First Order. You've got teams of stormtroopers scouring said planet in search of those plans, killing innocents along the way. You've got a Grand Moff Tarkin figure who wants to rely on a planet-destroying superweapon instead of the Force and who’s in a rivalry with a masked Darth Vader figure for the trust of a strange deformed Emperor — sorry, Supreme Leader. You’ve got the stop at a Mos Eisley cantina-style watering hole filled with smugglers and crooks. You’ve got the destruction of a planet(s) crucial to the Resistance effort midway through the movie, and then you’ve got the threatened destruction of a rebel base on a verdant planet by the same superweapon, which can only be averted by an X-Wing attack on a single weak point. You’ve got a confrontation between the Darth Vader figure and an older, wiser force for good who knew him intimately before he fell, which ends with the older wiser figure being killed by the Vader figure while our young hero — sorry, heroine — looks on in horror. And then you’ve got the X-Wing attack itself, which succeeds in blowing up the entire enemy super-base literally seconds before the superweapon is scheduled to fire on the base where Princess — sorry, General — Leia and a group of Resistance leaders are watching the attack unfold.

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by JamesKurtovich

I like the theory that Abrams went with a story structurally similar to the original Star Wars because it's Star Wars for a new generation. They likely wanted to play it safe with common elements everyone associates with the franchise. I can understand this and I believe that Episode VIII and IX will be a little less conspicuous with the callbacks to the OT.

I was fine with the similarities I noticed and I think this is one of the worst complaints as the two films aren't as similar as most would have you believe. The movie was very enjoyable. The characters were charismatic, funny, and interesting. Rey is not a Luke copycat and the same can be said for Kylo Ren and Vader.

Agreed.
Side by side, even if the story is a cycling "motif" as Lucas often mentions of his films in interviews and commentary, Star Wars New Hope and Star Wars Force Awakens are two different movies with the theme of the cycle renewing itself. Besides, what

[Show spoiler]better weapon could the First Order have created other than one that is indestructible, regarding the new Death Star planet destroyer

?

Daily life is a cycle, so maybe that's one more reason people don't like seeing a similar story recycled again but with new characters and situations.

Film history shows few stories are truly original if we research the deep history of human civilization's literature. Something Lucas relied heavily on with the theme of the reluctant Hero's Journey when creating Star Wars IV.

herojourney.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monomyth

[Packerfan75]

Originally Posted by JamesKurtovich

I like the theory that Abrams went with a story structurally similar to the original Star Wars because it's Star Wars for a new generation. They likely wanted to play it safe with common elements everyone associates with the franchise. I can understand this and I believe that Episode VIII and IX will be a little less conspicuous with the callbacks to the OT.

I was fine with the similarities I noticed and I think this is one of the worst complaints as the two films aren't as similar as most would have you believe. The movie was very enjoyable. The characters were charismatic, funny, and interesting. Rey is not a Luke copycat and the same can be said for Kylo Ren and Vader.

It's actually as much of a reboot as it is a sequel. I can't think of any other franchises that have done this. It's usually one or the other.
Considering how this contrasts with Lucas' idea, I can't help but wonder what he had in mind for a sequel. I hope he lets us in on it someday.

[Gamma_Winstead]

Originally Posted by YoungCrazyBlu-RayFan

There's similarities and then there's just rehashing.

[Show spoiler]Han Solo replaces Obi-Wan as the hero's (Rey) mentor figure who is killed by the villain while they watch. The new Death Star (that's what I'm calling it) makes the same mistake as the first one, weak point at the end of a trench. Also this whole plot started because Rey found a droid with important information to help the rebels, which is almost exactly how Luke got thrown in the plot in A New Hope. Plus the role reversal of Empire's twist, this time one of the heroes is the father of the villain.

The film doesn't have original bone in it's story structure.

Gee. Sure reminds me of something else.

[Show spoiler]Qui-Gon, the mentor to Obi-Wan, is killed while he watches. Anakins sequence where he blows up the droid control ship has him flying inside a trench like structure to fire on the weak spot. It's implied that the villain, Palpatine or Plagueis, is the father of Anakin, the hero. The plot progresses because a droid does something that allows them to proceed forward. Let's go even further, Phantom Menace also ends with a celebration, and everyone staring happily into camera while standing on steps and an alien shouts in joy. There's a conversation at a dinner table about getting involved in something you shouldn't. There's C3PO shoe horned in for fan service when he doesn't really serve the plot. There's a junk dealer that the hero works for. The hero lives on a sandy planet.

[Rodney-2187]

All stories show some similarities to something else. Some can it a tribute, some call it a parody, some refer to it as classic form, others call it symbolism ... etc ... etc.
Call The Force Awakens whatever you want. I call it awesome. It's a fun movie that gives me enough of the old Star Wars while setting up new characters for continued adventures.
Some say its too similar to the OT. Others say it doesn't even feel like a Star Wars movie. I say JJ hit the sweet spot and made a perfect movie for starting the next trilogy.
Bring on Episode VIII !

[frogmort]

Originally Posted by Gamma_Winstead

C3PO shoe horned in for fan service when he doesn't really serve the plot.

Sorry, but I love having C-3P0 shoe horned in there. Some of his one-liners in Ep.II do go too far though.

[gates70]

Saw the movie this weekend. It was good but nothing earth shattering. As it's been well criticized, it felt like A New Hope 2015. They want to make one of these movies every other year and I can just see this series heading the way of the Fast and Furious franchise, especially with the upcoming directors. I enjoyed it but don't see what all the hype is about.

[Gamma_Winstead]

Originally Posted by frogmort

Sorry, but I love having C-3P0 shoe horned in there. Some of his one-liners in Ep.II do go too far though.

I thought he was hilarious in VII.

[Eye Candy]

YouTube

[steev210]

Originally Posted by Gamma_Winstead

I thought he was hilarious in VII.

I did too. C-3PO needs more screen time in Episode VIII than he got in VII, as well as R2-D2. I thought BB-8 was cool but he'll never take the place of 3PO and R2.

[bsweetness]

Originally Posted by Packerfan75

It's actually as much of a reboot as it is a sequel. I can't think of any other franchises that have done this. It's usually one or the other.
Considering how this contrasts with Lucas' idea, I can't help but wonder what he had in mind for a sequel. I hope he lets us in on it someday.

Abrams did the same thing with Star Trek. It was focused more on being a reboot, but it is a sequel as well.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by bsweetness

Abrams did the same thing with Star Trek. It was focused more on being a reboot, but it is a sequel as well.

No it isn't a sequel, it is an origin story that shows how the classic crew first came together aboard the Enterprise.

For it to be a sequel, it would have to show events that came after the last movie with the old cast.

[bsweetness]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

No it isn't a sequel, it is an origin story that shows how the classic crew first came together aboard the Enterprise.

For it to be a sequel, it would have to show events that came after the last movie with the old cast.

This isn't the thread to get into a ton of specifics, but the 2009 Star Trek is very much a sequel. Events that happen after the last Next Generation movie are what cause the older Spock (Prime Spock) to be present.

Edit: And here's where the movie shows "events that came after the last movie with the old cast."

Mind Meld-Star Trek 2009 - YouTube

[Al_The_Strange]

Originally Posted by Packerfan75

It's actually as much of a reboot as it is a sequel. I can't think of any other franchises that have done this. It's usually one or the other.

Evil Dead II and The Evil Dead are both reboots/sequels (requels?) in the Evil Dead series. Just about all of those movies are loved, I never see anybody complaining about rehashed plots there.

The James Bond movies are full of sequels that are always rebooting themselves with each new actor. Plots gets recycled all the time. Doesn't bother the fans that much.

And, yeah, Star Trek, arguably. Mad Max: Fury Road could count as one too. It may not be common, but it happens.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by bsweetness

This isn't the thread to get into a ton of specifics, but the 2009 Star Trek is very much a sequel. Events that happen after the last Next Generation movie are what cause the older Spock (Prime Spock) to be present.

Edit: And here's where the movie shows "events that came after the last movie with the old cast."

Alright, fine, it's been a while since I saw it. But the point still remains that it also works as an origin story for the original crew, especially for viewers who didn't know much about the characters

[bsweetness]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

Alright, fine, it's been a while since I saw it. But the point still remains that it also works as an origin story for the original crew, especially for viewers who didn't know much about the characters

Which is why I mentioned it. It gets to the point Packerfan75 was making above about a movie simultaneously being a sequel and a reboot. While it definitely would be helpful to know more about the history of some of the characters in The Force Awakens before watching it, it's not entirely required either. It works somewhat as a reboot on that level too (although not as well as Star Trek did, which required virtually no understanding of the characters).

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by bsweetness

Which is why I mentioned it. It gets to the point Packerfan75 was making above about a movie simultaneously being a sequel and a reboot.

Well, sure, I can understand wanting to have the cake and eat it, too.

I mean, the worst criticism I could make of TFA is that it plays it safe - usually the last thing Lucas liked to do.

But Lucasfilm is now the property of a major studio, it isn't an independent company any more, so it totally makes sense that they are playing it safe and try to give audiences exactly what they want, to make it as predictable as can be.

It doesn't mean it can't be any fun, and indeed for some viewers, it might be the only thing that is fun.