Superman: The Movie 4K UHD (1978)

[slask]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

It's a shame that Snyder dumped Williams' iconic theme music for Superman.

You know Man Of Steel was a reboot, do you?

Williams's main them was not "dumped", the movie needed a new score because it was a new, different, version of Superman.

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

I'll post 2 samples here and 1 in the 2001: A Space Odyssey thread later...

I got the Blu-ray, so the picture below is not lossy, it's lossless just like the UHD-HD.

At least in my PC the Matroska from both look like this...

UHD:



Blu-ray:



UHD:



Blu-ray:



UHD:



Blu-ray:



Has anyone checked in a PC?

Warner was accused in the past of inserting a green tint in the Lord of the Rings Blu-ray.

LOTR - Green Cast Comparison (Extended Left vs Theatrical Right) - YouTube

If this isn't the case then please tell me what I must do to improve this picture. I checked the 2001: A Space Odyssey 4K Blu-ray in my PC and it doesn't look it has been altered this way.

The UHD doesn’t look like that on my tv. You’re making this up.

[brian9229]

looks like the blind leading the blind around here.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

[Show spoiler]This is what it looks like:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=16U...nYnxKmo6uGD6Uq

#2:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=117...eezD3--ITBlJiL

And this is from the Blu-ray:

#1:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1bi...KHTMGK0w5lpVE5

#2:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-i...9kmXlF_nvdJqpA

Don't try to stream. Download all files and then try playing them.

I knew there was something fishy going on...

Felt like I was watching Dracula (1979)

Where can I find some real caps from this 4K disc? If they look OK then the problem is here.

You can't have two different screenshots from the same disc, unless you are either altering the photos or not using the same source. With screenshots captured from this 4K disc anyone will know for sure how this movie looks like.

Why? Are you working for Warner?

[Mocorongo]

Originally Posted by Bourne1886

The UHD doesn’t look like that on my tv. You’re making this up.

I am making what up? I even posted 2 samples in this thread.

Next thing you are going to say is that I created these files myself.

[nick4Knight]

Those look like RAW caps not converted to SDR in any way. Stop posting them. You don't understand the mechanism for showing good representations of UHD transfers.

[Mr. Forest]

Those UHD screencaps is what my copy looks like on my screen, when I’m playing the disc on my HDR-less TV. The film looks great on my 4K tv.

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

I am making what up? I even posted 2 samples in this thread.

Next thing you are going to say is that I created these files myself.

You did didn’t you or did you get those screenshots from someone else then?

Don’t roll your eyes at me. Those screenshot examples are what’s wrong. The actual 4k disc doesn’t look like that at all in motion. You’ve been told that by others on here.

[Purploros]

Can someone explain why the 4K disc played on an SDR display would look like that when the VUDU digital copy of the new transfer streamed in HDX on my SDR television doesn’t? Makes me reluctant to shell out the half the grand I was planning to set aside for a Panasonic DP-UB820 . . .

[Croweyes1121]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

I am making what up? I even posted 2 samples in this thread.

Next thing you are going to say is that I created these files myself.

It isn’t that you’re “making them up”, but posting RAW images that need an HDR panel to display correctly and using those to COMPARE the UHD to the blu-ray captures that are in the correct color space is just plain useless, not to mention apples to oranges. The fact that the disc looks that way on a TV with no HDR is equally useless information. You may as well say “these look wrong when displayed incorrectly”. Well...yeah.

[HeavyHitter]

I compared some scenes last night (between the UHD BD and accompnaying BD) and was surprised at just how much contrast boost was on the BD. Sure, the UHD BD might look somewhat flatter, but still preferable to the BD. As far as color, I'll admit sometimes the BD color looked a little more appealing especially with skintones.

[Croweyes1121]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

As far as color, I'll admit sometimes the BD color looked a little more appealing especially with skintones.

Yeah, my one and really only gripe with this UHD is that skin tones seem too yellowish much of the time. Take a look at Superman in Luthor’s lair. He looks like he has jaundice or something. Things were so warm, in fact, that I had to pop in another DV movie just to make sure it wasn’t my panel. Overall, though, the UHD is clearly the best possible way to watch the film - especially with the 5.1 track.

[HeavyHitter]

On my set-up, I noticed more of a salmon'ish, dull kind of tone on faces (at times). Re-watching it, I'm kind of questioning it a little more. But with many other scenes, the color looks very good and a more natural, typical balanced reddish look one would expect.

[INdetectableMAN]

Originally Posted by Purploros

Can someone explain why the 4K disc played on an SDR display would look like that when the VUDU digital copy of the new transfer streamed in HDX on my SDR television doesn’t? Makes me reluctant to shell out the half the grand I was planning to set aside for a Panasonic DP-UB820 . . .

It is simple. We are seeing UHD HDR without converting to SDR, hence the washed and non-contrast aspect of the image. When the monitor does not transform (convert) PQ 2084 to EOTF traditional gamma SDR, you see that, a crap image.

[INdetectableMAN]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

I'll post 2 samples here and 1 in the 2001: A Space Odyssey thread later...

I got the Blu-ray, so the picture below is not lossy, it's lossless just like the UHD-HD.

At least in my PC the Matroska from both look like this...

UHD:



Blu-ray:



UHD:



Blu-ray:



UHD:



Blu-ray:



Has anyone checked in a PC?

Warner was accused in the past of inserting a green tint in the Lord of the Rings Blu-ray.

LOTR - Green Cast Comparison (Extended Left vs Theatrical Right) - YouTube

If this isn't the case then please tell me what I must do to improve this picture. I checked the 2001: A Space Odyssey 4K Blu-ray in my PC and it doesn't look it has been altered this way.

[Mocorongo]

Did some digging and found out a link explaining what was wrong with these caps.

The samples provided are truly lossless. So there's nothing wrong with the files. I was even thinking I didn't have the original material.

The issue was described here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/htpc/commen..._enabled_with/

And it has to do with the filter used for MPC-HC (the video player). Once I installed this madVR this is what the picture now looks like:





So I wasn't spreading false information, this is what it looked like without the proper settings. That's why from the start I questioned why the image looked like c.rap.

What is amusing is the fact no one here in this forum seems to be using a PC for viewing 4K content. Of course it would look normal in your TV, but I was using a PC all along. Or no one here noticed that? If not how did you think I took these screenshots?

If any of you had downloaded these samples and tried to find out what was wrong with them you would have told me ages ago.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Purploros

Can someone explain why the 4K disc played on an SDR display would look like that when the VUDU digital copy of the new transfer streamed in HDX on my SDR television doesn’t? Makes me reluctant to shell out the half the grand I was planning to set aside for a Panasonic DP-UB820 . . .

see below ▼

Originally Posted by Geoff D

What you have to understand is that HDR uses a different transfer function to turn electrical signals back into optical ones (EOTF) than what SDR does. This transfer function has very specific differences in the way that light can be encoded in the image, for instead of having 100-ish nits of brightness be the standard it can go all the way up to 10,000 nits. The major difference is that whereas regular SDR can rebuild itself to best match the brightness of the display, what's called relative luminance, HDR is encoded using a system that defines specific code values (brightness, colour etc) for any given shot, this is called absolute luminance.

The problem with remapping these 'absolute' values into a display medium that can't deliver the same brightness etc is that there is nothing there in the HDR stream to define how this function should work, so when matey at capsaholic is doing these SDR conversions he's using the software to output an arbitrary transform of the image that quite often retains very little of the nuance of the HDR image. Compromises must often be made between delivering a cap with high brightness and blown-out highlights, or one with lots of highlight detail but very low brightness, and these are challenges faced by anyone seeking to watch HDR in SDR, as well as people whose HDR televisions don't meet the proper criteria for brightness, colour gamut etc as well.

Might sound like a mouthful of Greek salad but this is at the heart of why SDR-converted HDR caps can still have their uses but should not be regarded as the ultimate arbiter of how things look in their native HDR environment. We all want/expect such a thing, of course we do, we've never had these problems before with the likes of capsaholic so we just expect that their UHD caps are gospel as well. They are not, not always. As mentioned above, member andreasy69 has produced sets of UHD screencaps that take these factors into account and shows different caps of the same scene with different luminance levels.

That was in reference to someone questioning the look of SDR converted screenshots at capsaholic, but what matey is doing in this thread is even worse: He's not applying any kind of transform (HDR or SDR) to the image AT ALL so they are fundamentally incorrect representations of what STM's 4K disc actually looks like in HDR.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

Did some digging and found out a link explaining what was wrong with these caps.

The samples provided are truly lossless. So there's nothing wrong with the files. I was even thinking I didn't have the original material.

The issue was described here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/htpc/commen..._enabled_with/

And it has to do with the filter used for MPC-HC (the video player). Once I installed this madVR this is what the picture now looks like:

[Show spoiler]

So I wasn't spreading false information, this is what it looked like without the proper settings. That's why from the start I questioned why the image looked like c.rap.

What is amusing is the fact no one here in this forum seems to be using a PC for viewing 4K content. Of course it would look normal in your TV, but I was using a PC all along. Or no one here noticed that? If not how did you think I took these screenshots?

If any of you had downloaded these samples and tried to find out what was wrong with them you would have told me ages ago.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

If any of you had downloaded these samples and tried to find out what was wrong with them you would have told me ages ago.

When members were saying that you were displaying "HDR" images that hadn't been converted to SDR and they looked completely washed out that might have been a bit of a giveaway.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

If any of you had downloaded these samples and tried to find out what was wrong with them you would have told me ages ago.

No need to "download" anything, it's been stated repeatedly that the images didn't have any kind of proper transform applied to them. I've seen this before from completely unknown posters who wade in and think they're breaking the news to us when we know all along what the problem is, it's not our fault you're so consumed with your own sense of outrage that you won't actually listen to people who are watching the disc in its intended environment, via a UHD player on a 4K HDR television.