Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

That sounds like something the movie studios like

Once the studios have complete control, it will get far worse. When Disc dies, so does our control.

[NightMovie901]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

OK, cool. From time to time I like to look at SSD and HDD info published by the folks at Backblaze data center. FWIW, my signature line has links to a little info on myself.

I will take a look at the links. Thanks

I cannot talk too much about specifics of what is in our data center but we have a new solution from https://www.purestorage.com/ which is all SSD and all our SAN guys are saying it could replace all of our EMC cabinets in the very near future. Time will tell as I'm sure EMC isn't giving that business away easily.

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Just curious, for someone that is all in on digital, why come to a place like Blu-ray.com? It should be clear to anyone this a disc site.

So I Googled something like "itunes movie price tracker" and this site kept popping up. At first I was deterred by the name of the site because it was obviously about discs. However, the more searching I did the more it came back to this site. So I registered so I could setup and test the price tracking feature of iTunes movies I am interested in buying. (It works well by the way)

Then I found out that people actually sell the digital copy codes in a Buy/Sell/Trade section here on the forums so that got me to the forums. One day I clicked on the New Posts and this thread popped up and it sounded interesting. So I clicked and read the first couple and last 10 pages or so of the thread and started participating.

There was one other thread I participated in too but for the most part I'm looking at the digital codes for sale section.

I had never seen most of the Marvel movies so I just finished watching all 20 of them in the last couple of weeks. I'm still looking to buy codes for the last 2 Iron Mans and first 2 Thors but I own all the other ones now.

I haven't been to a theater is maybe 15 years or so. Last thing I remember was Saving Private Ryan so could have been longer than that.

Tonight I am going to see my very first IMAX movie: Captain Marvel

[NightMovie901]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Once the studios have complete control, it will get far worse. When Disc dies, so does our control.

Do we really have any control now?

I mean we take what they give us.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Ender14

Not to get off topic in this thread, but I just built a new PC using a Z390 motherboard and the i7-9700k processor. I used a Samsung NVMe SSD and did a fresh install of Windows 10 Pro. Why do you ask?

It did not work with a Samsung SATA SSD. During install Windows 10 did not see the SSD unless I loaded the Intel AHCI drivers first, then it would install completely but would fail on the reboot. I am using UEFI and have CSM Support disabled. I installed Windows 10 on a Seagate 1TB FireCuda then installed the SSD as an additional drive. Windows 10 would not initialize the drive till I installed Intel AHCI drivers, via Device Manager, then it initialized and formatted fine.

I do plan to procure a NVMe SSD (from the QVL) at some point and give it another go. Right now the 1TB WD NVMe SSD is $230 and the Samsung is $380 , the FireCuda, a SSHD, was $73 and must say it is pretty fast and quite.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

It did not work with a Samsung SATA SSD. During install Windows 10 did not see the SSD unless I loaded the Intel AHCI drivers first, then it would install completely but would fail on the reboot. I am using UEFI and have CSM Support disabled. I installed Windows 10 on a Seagate 1TB FireCuda then installed the SSD as an additional drive. Windows 10 would not initialize the drive till I installed Intel AHCI drivers, via Device Manager, then it initialized and formatted fine.

I do plan to procure a NVMe SSD (from the QVL) at some point and give it another go. Right now the 1TB WD NVMe SSD is $230 and the Samsung is $380 , the FireCuda, a SSHD, was $73 and must say it is pretty fast and quite.

That's odd. I have 2 other SATA SSD's in my system and the Windows installer could see both of them in addition to the NVMe drive I installed to. What motherboard are you using?

Yeah, I am amazed at how fast the NVMe drive is. I paid $128 for a 500GB Samsung EVO Plus. I didn't really need anything bigger since I had the two other SSD's.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

Do we really have any control now?

I mean we take what they give us.

Yes, and once we have it, it’s ours.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Ender14

I used a Samsung NVMe SSD and did a fresh install of Windows 10 Pro.

Forgot to ask, after the install did you run WinSAT.exe formal?

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Ender14

What motherboard are you using?

Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Pro, started with a ASUS Z390-A Prime and it had the same problem with the SATA SSD. Could not get the ASUS to fit in the case with the I/O shield in place so it was used without the shield. I did not like that so I procured the Gigabyte board, the I/O shield is built into the MB.

[CV19]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yes, and once we have it, it’s ours.

Sent you a PM but message coming up that your inbox is full.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by CV19

Sent you a PM but message coming up that your inbox is full.

Just sorted it mate, can you resend?

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Forgot to ask, after the install did you run WinSAT.exe formal?

No, but I did run Prime95 and CoreTemp for 30 minutes or so since it was my first time using water cooling. None of the cores ever got above 65 degrees celsius.

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Pro, started with a ASUS Z390-A Prime and it had the same problem with the SATA SSD. Could not get the ASUS to fit in the case with the I/O shield in place so it was used without the shield. I did not like that so I procured the Gigabyte board, the I/O shield is built into the MB.

Wow, I used the Gigabyte Aorus Pro Wifi! Which version of the BIOS came pre-installed? Mine had 8b I believe (I updated it since). It saw all my SSD's, both SATA and NVMe as did the Windows installer.

I guess you should PM me to discuss further so we don't hijack the thread

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

That was my thinking for a very long time and that is certainly a valid and reasonable line of thought.

I guess as time goes by I'm less interested in owning physical things and want more convenience and access to things instead. Lines become less straight, less black & white, and become more curvy and grey area.

I got rid of all my music CDs a long time ago. Why? Because I didn't need them any more. A whole box of CDs (and more) was on my phone.

Now with Apple Music I don't see any reason to buy new music. Yes, I'm well aware that if I cancel my subscription then I don't have access to all the music. However, I'm not heavily invested in a music library either.

I'm not sure Apple can pull off an Apple Movies subscription service but then again that is what everyone said about Apple Music in the past. Certainly something interesting to think about/discuss.

Some of us are in the mindset that there are pretty compelling reasons to continue to buy and listen to CDs, but they do require certain prerequisites.

A) CDs sound better than music on your phone - but you do need at least a halfway decent system at home or in your car to appreciate the difference. Also you need to care about how something sounds, which seems to be a shrinking percentage unfortunately.

B) I believe in supporting the artists by buying CDs, as the money they receive from subscription services is a joke. I usually see one live show a month, and will stop by the merch table to find something to purchase, as this is where the artists can make a profitable evening out of stopping in our city, and then have a reason to come back.

C) I am more than a casual music fan and want to read liner notes. I want to know who played what on the CD as well as the producer, mixer, etc... pulling out the liner notes will also occasionally give you the lyrics. I know you can google all of these things, but I prefer to read them from the packaging. The other day I listened to the very first cd I bought back in 1984 and had a nostalgic moment by pulling out the liner notes.

D) I have a pretty sizable collection, not the biggest but certainly more than a box full, and there is something gratifying about adding to the collection as you slide things around. When people visit the house and check out the basement, it is validating to hear “Holy crap” and other more colorful outbursts when they see the collection. Having music on a phone somehow does not bring forth the same response.

E) Lastly, if people stopped buying CDs, artists would not be releasing them. Plain and simple.

Do I subscribe to Apple Music? Yes I do, but I use it to check out new artists.

Do I listen to CDs at home? Nope. Vinyl is the only source at the house, but that is a whole other subject. CDs are for my 35 minute commute mostly.

I completely understand the convenience of having a seemingly unlimited amount of options by subscribing to a steaming service, but I also appreciate listening to an album all the way through as the artist intended, and not simply asking Siri to play a certain song.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Ender14

Wow, I used the Gigabyte Aorus Pro Wifi! Which version of the BIOS came pre-installed? Mine had 8b I believe (I updated it since). It saw all my SSD's, both SATA and NVMe as did the Windows installer.

BIOS was 8b as well. Just a guess, the problem is the 1TB size. Will look into more at some point.

Recently I connected a 2TB USB drive (GUID) to my Synology NAS and the Synology would not see it. Had me confused because I've had a 4TB USB drive connected to it for a few years now. I finally remembered that I had formatted the 2TB drive with 64K cluster size, so I reformatted with 32K cluster size and now it worked with the Synology . These drives have large video files on them, video from PBS AMC-21 satellite.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gotmule

Some of us are in the mindset that there are pretty compelling reasons to continue to buy and listen to CDs, but they do require certain prerequisites.

A) CDs sound better than music on your phone - but you do need at least a halfway decent system at home or in your car to appreciate the difference. Also you need to care about how something sounds, which seems to be a shrinking percentage unfortunately.

B) I believe in supporting the artists by buying CDs, as the money they receive from subscription services is a joke. I usually see one live show a month, and will stop by the merch table to find something to purchase, as this is where the artists can make a profitable evening out of stopping in our city, and then have a reason to come back.

C) I am more than a casual music fan and want to read liner notes. I want to know who played what on the CD as well as the producer, mixer, etc... pulling out the liner notes will also occasionally give you the lyrics. I know you can google all of these things, but I prefer to read them from the packaging. The other day I listened to the very first cd I bought back in 1984 and had a nostalgic moment by pulling out the liner notes.

D) I have a pretty sizable collection, not the biggest but certainly more than a box full, and there is something gratifying about adding to the collection as you slide things around. When people visit the house and check out the basement, it is validating to hear “Holy crap” and other more colorful outbursts when they see the collection. Having music on a phone somehow does not bring forth the same response.

E) Lastly, if people stopped buying CDs, artists would not be releasing them. Plain and simple.

Do I subscribe to Apple Music? Yes I do, but I use it to check out new artists.

Do I listen to CDs at home? Nope. Vinyl is the only source at the house, but that is a whole other subject. CDs are for my 35 minute commute mostly.

I completely understand the convenience of having a seemingly unlimited amount of options by subscribing to a steaming service, but I also appreciate listening to an album all the way through as the artist intended, and not simply asking Siri to play a certain song.

In other words, you are contributing to the exact thing that will cause the extinction of CD eventually.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

It isn't the best example because DVD is better than VHS and no one argues that fact. With Blu-ray vs Digital the Blu-ray is still currently a higher quality format with better sound (generally). But let me pivot though ... for those of us that had BetaMax we knew that Beta was better than VHS in quality but the masses had decided on VHS ... we had no choice but to adopt VHS because they eventually quit producing Beta tapes

BetaMax is also a terrible example because LaserDisc was available at the same time. People who wanted the best quality format were buying LaserDisc, which continued to be produced until the early 2000s after DVD came out.

But either case is an example of a physical format being replaced by another physical format. Moving from one physical format to another physical format doesn't bring the major disadvantages that going from physical to digital does. The only way that DVD and Blu-ray can become obsolete is if all of the titles on them are released on a better physical format.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

In other words, you are contributing to the exact thing that will cause the extinction of CD eventually.

As a Netflix subscriber, you're doing the same thing with movies.

[NightMovie901]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

BetaMax is also a terrible example because LaserDisc was available at the same time. People who wanted the best quality format were buying LaserDisc, which continued to be produced until the early 2000s after DVD came out.

But either case is an example of a physical format being replaced by another physical format. Moving from one physical format to another physical format doesn't bring the major disadvantages that going from physical to digital does. The only way that DVD and Blu-ray can become obsolete is if all of the titles on them are released on a better physical format.

There were like 6 guys that bought LaserDiscs LOL

We'll have to see what happens. Let's revisit this 10 years from now.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

BIOS was 8b as well. Just a guess, the problem is the 1TB size. Will look into more at some point.

Recently I connected a 2TB USB drive (GUID) to my Synology NAS and the Synology would not see it. Had me confused because I've had a 4TB USB drive connected to it for a few years now. I finally remembered that I had formatted the 2TB drive with 64K cluster size, so I reformatted with 32K cluster size and now it worked with the Synology . These drives have large video files on them, video from PBS AMC-21 satellite.

Very strange. You may be right on the size issue, but I did some poking around and couldn't find anything. Good luck to you.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

There were like 6 guys that bought LaserDiscs LOL

We'll have to see what happens. Let's revisit this 10 years from now.

I was one of the 6. I still have mine and the player as well.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by NightMovie901

There were like 6 guys that bought LaserDiscs LOL

We'll have to see what happens. Let's revisit this 10 years from now.

Those 6 guys made it a profitable format for over 20 years. It only stopped being profitable after a better physical format was released (DVD).

DVD, Blu-ray, and Ultra HD Blu-ray can easily survive as profitable niche formats for many decades after the masses switch over to digital. And that just circles around to my previous point: more people supporting physical media means more titles on physical media.