Dark Force Entertainment Discussion Thread

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by Hedji

SOAWN was the only title so far I've wanted from Dark Force, and was lucky to snag it on the first night it was available. I cross my fingers they won't get another title that I need, because shopping for movies online shouldn't be stressful....

You know something, that really is what's missing from the DF/CR experience. They put out consistently great films (even the ones I've no interest in are great, on the merits, being sought after films, with the best restoration possible) but the timing always feels off. It always has, but with Bill's old cartel, he'd put the store up and periodically and the titles would come and go, so you knew you would get the ones you wanted, within a few months, even though the timing never felt clear or easy. (That's why I loved the cartel.)

My Code Red guy, the one who used to do the ordering, had the Code Red store as an automatic start-up page, so we always knew the what/when of availability of titles, so that stress element wasn't really there. Now, it isn't like BF at VS where they gave an approximate and reliable time so we can all be sitting there, happily refreshing, while cruising the Best Buy/Amazon/Walmart disc sales, knowing there will be enough to go around. We have a day, a day that isn't necessarily going to be the day, and too many buyers for too few copies.

That stress element takes the Christmas out of it, if you know what I mean. However, I really do believe that, over time, DF is going to get set up with consistent and clear timing, larger inventory and, probably, even pre-orders. It just takes time to figure out logistics and set these things up. Had they listed 1000 of SoaWN with a 2 copy limit, they'd have sold 500 in the first day and every person on the boards would have snagged one. Bill and David both saw what happened and they clearly learned from it. I'm just looking forward to that day when they've got all the kinks worked out.

[Thomas Irwin]

Originally Posted by Ruined

44 copies of last victim / forced entry left FYI

I just purchased that and The Swinging Barmaids earlier. I didn't realize there were so few copies left.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by Thomas Irwin

I just purchased that and The Swinging Barmaids earlier. I didn't realize there were so few copies left.

I believe they put up the first 250 of the 1000 print run, there are like 16 left of the 250 now. I assume after those sell the store will shut down to restock.

[JasonMichael]

Originally Posted by miribeau

Had they listed 1000 of SoaWN with a 2 copy limit, they'd have sold 500 in the first day and every person on the boards would have snagged one. Bill and David both saw what happened and they clearly learned from it.

They did? What have we seen that would lead you to believe that?

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by JasonMichael

They did? What have we seen that would lead you to believe that?

David has been opening the store earlier and, this last time, sent out announcements, plural, giving warning, as well as announcing when it was open. Bill has opted to honor his agreements with Ronin, to allow them to handle a few of his upcoming releases, which he could easily have not offered via their portal, but, given their ability to handle a large inventory coming in and out basically at speed, he is going to give that another chance, in order to avoid a repeat. Both men have also, in live feeds, referred to the sellouts negatively, as something they learned from/that changed their minds/a learning experience or however they chose to put it. While honoring the great sales numbers, there has been clear acknowledgement of the problems.

Now, if you read the responses to very angry people on Facebook, you'll get a different idea altogether, but, ignoring those angry responses to angry people, just listening to Bill and David's dialogue since it all happened, they both really seem interested in moving forward with adjusted strategies.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by miribeau

David has been opening the store earlier and, this last time, sent out announcements, plural, giving warning, as well as announcing when it was open. Bill has opted to honor his agreements with Ronin, to allow them to handle a few of his upcoming releases, which he could easily have not offered via their portal, but, given their ability to handle a large inventory coming in and out basically at speed, he is going to give that another chance, in order to avoid a repeat. Both men have also, in live feeds, referred to the sellouts negatively, as something they learned from/that changed their minds/a learning experience or however they chose to put it. While honoring the great sales numbers, there has been clear acknowledgement of the problems.

Now, if you read the responses to very angry people on Facebook, you'll get a different idea altogether, but, ignoring those angry responses to angry people, just listening to Bill and David's dialogue since it all happened, they both really seem interested in moving forward with adjusted strategies.

Worth noting though the 2 quantity limit you proposed in your previous post is something DF specifically expressed no interest in at this time due to the small size of the label. I don't particularly care about this but if you think that's an adjustment DF is considering it's not.

[JasonMichael]

Originally Posted by Ruined

Worth noting though the 2 quantity limit you proposed in your previous post is something DF specifically expressed no interest in at this time due to the small size of the label. I don't particularly care about this but if you think that's an adjustment DF is considering it's not.

I actually agree with not limiting quantities, and if he is serious about not wanting to do so because of the label's small size, keeping the store open all the time would also make sense in that context. Besides, if it was open all the time, and people could order when they wanted, it would make the bulk buying by scalpers a less lucrative practice. It's only the false scarcity that fuels that.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by Ruined

Worth noting though the 2 quantity limit you proposed in your previous post is something DF specifically expressed no interest in at this time due to the small size of the label. I don't particularly care about this but if you think that's an adjustment DF is considering it's not.

I think we are all aware, at this point, that he won't limit general sales. However, he hasn't completely ruled out the possibility of isolated pre-orders with a 2 per title limit. In fact I think that is one he hasn't really considered yet. It would require special set up, on the site, for a pre-order limit, that had no effect on other items, or, perhaps a pre-order sale where there is only one item up for sale, with no free shipping option, just the pre-order, with that two copy limit, to, essentially, signal scalpers that this is not a money making opportunity.

It would be a pain for them to do that, but, it would give the first however many copies to fans, most likely just to fans or very nearly all to fans, and would still leave the wide release open to all the scalpers. I say give it time. Away from all of the critics and arguments, David and Bill are both actively thinking about their businesses and you never know what they'll come up with in terms of streamlining that process.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by miribeau

It would require special set up, on the site, for a pre-order limit, that had no effect on other items, or, perhaps a pre-order sale where there is only one item up for sale, with no free shipping option, just the pre-order, with that two copy limit, to, essentially, signal scalpers that this is not a money making opportunity.

It would be a pain for them to do that, but, it would give the first however many copies to fans, most likely just to fans or very nearly all to fans, and would still leave the wide release open to all the scalpers.

Actually, it would be quite easy to set up and offer to consumers and you won't have to take down the rest of the inventory in the store. When cresting or editing a product listing you simply set a maximum quantity per account. This is on a per product basis so it doesn't affect other items.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by Ruined

Worth noting though the 2 quantity limit you proposed in your previous post is something DF specifically expressed no interest in at this time due to the small size of the label. I don't particularly care about this but if you think that's an adjustment DF is considering it's not.

Which goes to show the two gentlemen can't be that unhappy with how this unfolded. Thus I can't see them viewing the sellouts negatively nor learning from this experience. DeFalco seemed to have no issue with eBay scalpers buying up the majority of the inventory given he is a small label.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by miribeau

Bill has opted to honor his agreements with Ronin, to allow them to handle a few of his upcoming releases, which he could easily have not offered via their portal, but, given their ability to handle a large inventory coming in and out basically at speed, he is going to give that another chance, in order to avoid a repeat.

If Bill had an agreement (i.e. contract) with Ronin then he probably wanted to avoid a lawsuit. But what do you mean when you say "...he is going to give that another chance, in order to avoid a repeat."?

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

Which goes to show the two gentlemen can't be that unhappy with how this unfolded. Thus I can't see them viewing the sellouts negatively nor learning from this experience. DeFalco seemed to have no issue with eBay scalpers buying up the majority of the inventory given he is a small label.

Small business invests money to make/sell product, is able to sell product, makes profit, stays afloat. Sounds like something you wouldn't be unhappy about as a business owner.

The only thing I would say, I can think of some innovative ways you could make the same amount of sales without annoying people as much about trying to get a copy of something, while still selling in small batches. But I will try to avoid the unsolicited business advice.

[kraven]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

If Bill had an agreement (i.e. contract) with Ronin then he probably wanted to avoid a lawsuit. But what do you mean when you say "...he is going to give that another chance, in order to avoid a repeat."?

On behalf of 90% of the board I will ask. Please stop qouting them!

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by kraven

On behalf of 90% of the board I will ask. Please stop qouting them!

I thought these forums were here to have actual discussions which includes posts from members who may have differing opinions from others which we may or may not agree with. Why would be want to ostracize discussions from those we might disagree with?

[cloudnine]

Originally Posted by ruined

i believe they put up the first 250 of the 1000 print run, there are like 16 left of the 250 now. I assume after those sell the store will shut down to restock.

500

[noirjunkie]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

I thought these forums were here to have actual discussions which includes posts from members who may have differing opinions from others which we may or may not agree with. Why would be want to ostracize discussions from those we might disagree with?

Because all people who disagree with "us" do not stand on equal footing. Conversations are only worthwhile when a productive dialogue can take place, and with those two, it's been proven to be impossible.

To paraphrase a common saying on these forums, don't feed the shill.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by cloudnine

500

It's unlikely they put up 500 because 500 weren't even available as soon as it went up for sale; even when considering the bundles.

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

I thought these forums were here to have actual discussions which includes posts from members who may have differing opinions from others which we may or may not agree with. Why would be want to ostracize discussions from those we might disagree with?

It has nothing to do with disagreement, but rather shutting down trolls, shills, and other disruptive posters. The unholy trinity of Ruined-miribeau-ChristophahMaghen make this and the CR thread almost unbearable.

[cloudnine]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

It's unlikely they put up 500 because 500 weren't even available as soon as it went up for sale; even when considering the bundles.

DD said they put up half (the run of 1000) and that half is close to being sold out.

[AKNewbie]

Originally Posted by noirjunkie

Because all people who disagree with "us" do not stand on equal footing. Conversations are only worthwhile when a productive dialogue can take place, and with those two, it's been proven to be impossible.

To paraphrase a common saying on these forums, don't feed the shill.

Originally Posted by indravayu

It has nothing to do with disagreement, but rather shutting down trolls, shills, and other disruptive posters. The unholy trinity of Ruined-miribeau-ChristophahMaghen make this and the CR thread almost unbearable.

The temptation to reply is great which shows how adept they are.
I know, I know...put them on ignore.