Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Vilya

For the third time, no one said that Terminator 2 had been "taken away." Modified does not mean the same thing as removed.

Just to confirm, your picture was taken of the Vudu digital purchase and not from some other source? It does look like the second image posted by Penguin. Perhaps Vudu has not "updated" their version of T2 to the latest so-called remastered version, but I would not be surprised if they yet did so.

Wendell is a good sport and I bet he will try explaining adaptive streaming to yet again. Hopefully, with greater success.

And even if this hasn't happened with T2 on Vudu specifically, these sorts of things have already happened with other movies.

For example, Disney's The Sword in the Stone. Before it ever came out on Blu-Ray, it was available on itunes, and was using the same master as of the last DVD release at the time, which while not perfect, was still a decent master.

Later when it came out on Blu-Ray, Disney did a horrible "remastering" of it, plagued with very heavy use of DNR to the point that some shots look like it was a painting that hadn't fully dried and got water on it, smearing the colors. The coinciding DVD and digital release at the time was also based on this new mastering.

On itunes, the previous version was replaced with this new problematic version. If someone had downloaded the movie while it was the previous mastering that itunes was supplying, then so long as they continued to have that backed up, anyone who bought it could continue to watch that version. However, at that point if they were to stream it or have need to redownload it, it would be the new DNR-heavy version.

There's a good chance that even if T2 on Vudu hasn't been updated in this manner, it might have been on other services.

Of note here is that in the case of itunes (which at least gives you the option to download the movie), for anyone who downloaded The Sword in the Stone at the right time, they still had that older version.

But Alchav is all about streaming. And while he doesn't put down downloads as often as he does discs, he has in the past gone on about how much better streaming is than having to download something and store it locally. While streaming has its benefits, when it comes to preservation of and access to movies without new edits and/or newly problematic remasterings applied to them, physical media is the best option for obvious reasons, and being able to download a title and store it locally (while still coming with some digital-distribution restrictions that I don'e like) is still a better option than streaming.

[avs commenter]

The pro disc/non streamers sure do get passionate about altered digital versions of content they will never view

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

The pro disc/non streamers sure do get passionate about altered digital versions of content they will never view

I thought you were pro-disc? You continue to show yourself up for what you are.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I thought you were pro-disc? You continue to show yourself up for what you are.

huh? I've always said I use both

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

huh? I've always said I use both

So why are you always trying to get a rise out of disc lovers? Are you just a born shit stirrer?

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

The pro disc/non streamers sure do get passionate about altered digital versions of content they will never view

We have big hearts and we care deeply for our digitally challenged brethren.

It is about a principle. The principle being that the consumer has no control over their digital content. It can be modified or deleted at any time for any reason without any compensation. Both have already happened, with the former being far more common than the latter, but both precedents have been established.

The content on my discs will never be sanitized to satisfy hyper sensitive snowflakes nor will it be arbitrarily deleted. My discs preserve the content on them, which is another important principle. I have quite a few titles and rarities on physical media that you can not stream nor buy digitally. I will keep on having them, too. Digital purchases, like streaming services, are more transient in nature, much like farts in the wind.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

So why are you always trying to get a rise out of disc lovers? Are you just a born shit stirrer?

I try to bring a little balance to this thread. I can't help that most on here are fragile and unaccepting of that

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

I try to bring a little balance to this thread. I can't help that most on here are fragile and unaccepting of that

Only a idiot would think your posts are ‘balanced’.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Only a idiot would think your posts are ‘balanced’.

To be fair, I acknowledge my obvious bias and preference. We all should. We need other points of view here; without them there would be nothing of value to discuss. Glad handing each other is not interesting to me at all.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

To be fair, I acknowledge my obvious bias and preference. We all should. We need other points of view here; without them there would be nothing of value to discuss. Glad handing each other is not interesting to me at all.

As do I. Go back and read the guy’s last dozen posts on here. Other views are of course necessary. What I can’t stand is people pretending to be something they are not.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

As do I. Go back and read the guy’s last dozen posts on here. Other views are of course necessary. What can’t stand is people pretending to be something they are not.

You don't much care for role playing, eh?

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Vilya

We have big hearts and we care deeply for our digitally challenged brethren.

It is about a principle. The principle being that the consumer has no control over their digital content. It can be modified or deleted at any time for any reason without any compensation. Both have already happened, with the former being far more common than the latter, but both precedents have been established.

The content on my discs will never be sanitized to satisfy hyper sensitive snowflakes nor will it be arbitrarily deleted. My discs preserve the content on them, which is another important principle. I have quite a few titles and rarities on physical media that you can not stream nor buy digitally. I will keep on having them, too. Digital purchases, like streaming services, are more transient in nature, much like farts in the wind.

That is the risk and sacrifice you have to accept in going digital. But these are very rare cases so the risk is pretty small. There are sacrifices you make in going physical as well. Which I why I do both.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

The pro disc/non streamers sure do get passionate about altered digital versions of content they will never view

You sure do get passionate about making blanket generalizations of people and things that have a lot of nuance to them in order to make it look like you've actually made some kind of point, even though you haven't.

Just because we buy movies on physical media doesn't mean that we don't subscribe to some streaming services or redeem digital codes that come with discs.

Your statement here could potentially be taken two ways...

1. That we will specifically not view those particular altered digital versions of the content. Or...

2. It is content that we will never view, period.

I'm not sure which was your intent, but I'll address both.


I can say that as someone who enjoys Disney's classic animated movies, things like the problem with the remastering of The Sword and the Stone, and the removal of scenes from Dumbo for the upcoming Disney+ are of concern to me. The only reason that I may not have to view those specific versions (even though I did buy The Sword in the Stone on Blu-Ray before I was aware of the issues with it - I still have the previous DVD) is due to access of versions without those issues and alterations, and typically that access is on physical media.

If as time goes on, physical media dies off more and more, to the point where it either stops being made completely, or where only newer releases come out and many catalog titles don't get many further reissues, digital distribution and alteration becomes a bigger concern.

As for any titles that may not be of interest to me that might be effected by something like this, while it won't have a direct impact on me in that isolated instance, it is still something that in principle I am against. And while it may not impact me substantially, it is likely impacting someone else who is a fan of that content.

So excuse us for having a larger overall concern about this stuff regardless of how much individual instances may or may not effect us directly. It's almost as if we care enough to not want anyone to be negatively effected in this regard, and not just solely be concerned exclusively about ourselves and the titles that we care about.

Yeah, what a bunch of jerks we are!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

That is the risk and sacrifice you have to accept in going digital. But these are very rare cases so the risk is pretty small. There are sacrifices you make in going physical as well. Which I why I do both.

Which means that you sacrifice twice as much as I do then! My sacrifices are limited to just one method of acquisition while you make sacrifices with both.

With all of that sacrificing that you are doing, does that mean that you are a worshiper?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

You don't much care for role playing, eh?

I wouldn't go that far. . Police woman, maids etc..

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

As do I. Go back and read the guy’s last dozen posts on here. Other views are of course necessary. What I can’t stand is people pretending to be something they are not.

LOL

maybe you should go back and read them because I'm pretty sure we already had this conversation. I use both disc and digital. However, I don't post much pro disc stuff in this thread because there is already plenty of that here. Hence, the 'balance'

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I wouldn't go that far. . Police woman, maids etc..

You like to pretend that you are a police woman or a maid? You are far more, , imaginative than I ever suspected.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

There's a good chance that even if T2 on Vudu hasn't been updated in this manner, it might have been on other services.

Have posted this before but will repeat. I stopped my Vudu DVD2HD after discovering several scope titles were HD but what looked like old P&S versions made for DVD . Every once in awhile there is a surprise, like The Mountain Men (Heston) which was P&S only on DVD and HD OAR (scope) on Vudu (and Prime). I never do DVD2HD if there is a remote chance it will make it to BD.

Wonder if the streamers would still brag if the T2 UHD was much better than the old disc version and while the Vudu version remained as is.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

LOL

maybe you should go back and read them because I'm pretty sure we already had this conversation. I use both disc and digital. However, I don't post much pro disc stuff in this thread because there is already plenty of that here. Hence, the 'balance'

How convenient.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

You like to pretend that you are a police woman or a maid? You are far more, , imaginative than I ever suspected.