Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Just noticed VUDU has added a lot more titles with ads. IMHO, just more proof of providers and content owners continuing to look under rocks for dem der $$ .

Apparently Netflix is now trying to put a lid on spending (here). Sooner or later negative cash flow would catch up with them.

Vudu routinely offers me a $2 promotional credit to watch one of their "free with ads" movies, but I never actually receive them unless I email support and complain. In that regard, Vudu is a pain in the arse.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I am surprised that you are not warning us about Google's Stadia. Do you fear for the future of gaming, too?

Oh. Wait. I forgot that you already fully support and are in bed with, er, onboard with, online gaming, so there's no problem here, right? Never mind.

I Absolutely do. You would know that if you were a frequent visitor to those threads. Free to play with micro transactions is a horrid model.

Just because I use something doesn’t mean I’m in favour of it. VR often doesn’t have disc games and it wouldn’t be practical to keep swapping games with a headset on.
Unlike films, I realise I may have to call it a day with games as reactions and vision is not what it was and there are some excellent players out there now.

I will probably just play VR games that have a puzzle element to them, same with PlayStation console games.

Finally, games are like for like With their disc and digital versions. No compromise. There will ALWAYS be a compromise with video.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I Absolutely do. You would know that if you were a frequent visitor to those threads. Free to play with micro transactions is a horrid model.

Just because I use something doesn’t mean I’m in favour of it. VR often doesn’t have disc games and it wouldn’t be practical to keep swapping games with a headset on.
Unlike films, I realise I may have to call it a day with games as reactions and vision is not what it was and there are some excellent players out there now.

I will probably just play VR games that have a puzzle element to them, same with PlayStation console games.

Finally, games are like for like With their disc and digital versions. No compromise. There will ALWAYS be a compromise with video.

You are so, let's say, elastic in your attitude towards gaming. You'll readily enjoy digital versions of games, but then hate yourself in the morning, eh?

You are, conversely, so rigid and adamantly opposed to streaming, and digital video purchases especially, yet you use the former the same as the rest of us and you have no problem in buying a digital game. Digital video purchase? Hell no! Digital game purchase? Hell, yeah! How conflicted you must be!

So, in theory, if digital video content ever reached a point where its video and audio quality were equal to that of the best physical format, then your dislike of it would largely dissipate? You'd feel better about the fact that you have been using it all along?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

So you're a huge hypocrite? Supporting something that you're against is just plain wrong.

There are dozens of PSVR games with disc releases. How hard is it to take the headset off, swap the disc, and put the headset back on? You literally just admitted to buying digital games entirely because they are more convenient.

Not for the games I wanted. Are you aware how many PS VR games are on the store now?

I do t see how I'm a hypocrite. My fear is of tv screens and projectors going away and having access to the best AV quality possible. It’s that simple.



If digital gave you a ownership guarantee and matched the AV quality of Blu-ray AND 4K UHD there wouldn’t be a problem. It never will though. HT means replicating the cinema experience as closely as possible at home. That’s it, that’s my stance. Digital is a backwards step in QUALITY. gaming wise, it is. It’s the same bloody quality.

We both want the same thing but you also have the ownership issue. You won’t use the internet to update your games but you will use it to argue with me. Isn’t that hypocritical?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

You are so, let's say, elastic in your attitude towards gaming. You'll readily enjoy digital versions of games, but then hate yourself in the morning, eh?

You are, conversely, so rigid and adamantly opposed to streaming, and digital video purchases especially, yet you use the former the same as the rest of us and you have no problem in buying a digital game. Digital video purchase? Hell no! Digital game purchase? Hell, yeah! How conflicted you must be!

So, in theory, if digital video content ever reached a point where its video and audio quality were equal to that of the best physical format, then your dislike of it would largely dissipate? You'd feel better about the fact that you have been using it all along?

It wouldn't happen. Disc will always be better.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Not for the games I wanted. Are you aware how many PS VR games are on the store now?

I do t see how I'm a hypocrite. My fear is of tv screens and projectors going away and having access to the best AV quality possible. It’s that simple.

If digital gave you a ownership guarantee and matched the AV quality of Blu-ray AND 4K UHD there wouldn’t be a problem. It never will though. HT means replicating the cinema experience as closely as possible at home. That’s it, that’s my stance. Digital is a backwards step in QUALITY. gaming wise, it is. It’s the same bloody quality.

Since when did digital games come with a guarantee similar to what you require of digital video purchases? They don't. Those game servers can be turned off at anytime and the games themselves can be modified, for good or ill, also at any time.

Home theater hardware is perfectly safe. You are just bringing up this home theater gear fear of yours to change the subject.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Digital games don't have an ownership guarantee. They are in fact way more likely to disappear then digital movies. Multiple consoles have already dropped their entire digital library (Xbox & Wii) and more will likely follow soon.

I didn’t say they did.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Since when did digital games come with a guarantee similar to what you require of digital video purchases? They don't. Those game servers can be turned off at anytime and the games themselves can be modified, for good or ill, also at any time.

Home theater hardware is perfectly safe. You are just bringing up this home theater gear fear of yours to change the subject.

Lol. You are not a founder member of this thread. (This thread was a continuation of an even older thread). That was my EXACT concern. From day one actually.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Since when did digital games come with a guarantee similar to what you require of digital video purchases? They don't. Those game servers can be turned off at anytime and the games themselves can be modified, for good or ill, also at any time.

Home theater hardware is perfectly safe. You are just bringing up this home theater gear fear of yours to change the subject.

But you can complete those games and be done with them. Films you enjoy over and over.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

So the ownership guarantee is only necessary for movies? You play digital games, watch satellite TV, and subscribe to Netflix. I just don't understand why one type of art needs an ownership guarantee but none of the others do.



What? Is something preventing you from being able to replay games?

Furthermore if that really is your stance then physical games would be much cheaper than digital games. You can sell them when you're done with them.

Games have a specific path that you need to complete and once you do, what is there to do? For older games, the graphics sometimes look awful and take me out of the game.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Lol. You are not a founder member of this thread. (This thread was a continuation of an even older thread). That was my EXACT concern. From day one actually.

Founder member? You have only been on this forum five months longer than I have. Some of our members have been here since 2006; three full years before your paranoia first appeared.

If you have been predicting the doom of home theater gear since 2011 congratulations on being dead wrong for NINE consecutive years. With predictive abilities such as yours, it's a wonder that you don't have your own TV show.

Oh. Wait. No one has a TV anymore. Maybe Quibi will give you a series? Seven minutes of your nonsense at a time would be more than plenty.

So, you don't need to really own a game because games have no replay value? You must buy some crap games. You do realize that some people feel the same way about movies?

Requiring ownership guarantees of one type of digital content, but not of another, is hypocritical. It is certainly your prerogative, but it is still hypocritical. Why? Because you are ever on your decrying the one while fully embracing the other.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Founder member? You have only been on this forum five months longer than I have. Some of our members have been here since 2006; three full years before your paranoia first appeared.

If you have been predicting the doom of home theater gear since 2011 congratulations on being dead wrong for NINE consecutive years. With predictive abilities such as yours, it's a wonder that you don't have your own TV show.

Oh. Wait. No one has a TV anymore. Maybe Quibi will give you a series? Seven minutes of your nonsense at a time would be more than plenty.

So, you don't need to really own a game because games have no replay value? You must buy some crap games.

Requiring ownership guarantees of one type of digital content, but not of another, is hypocritical. It is certainly your prerogative, but it is still hypocritical. Why? Because you are ever on your decrying the one while fully embracing the other.

Yeah, and you missed my original posts. They were expressing concern with HT. There are posters who would confirm this.

Games you say? Single player games, not really. I complete them, enjoy them and move on. With so many games, why would I replay a game that has already been completed? Especially my favourite genre, puzzle games.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Movies have a specific narrative that never changes in any way. Once you've seen it what is there to do? Older movies sometimes have bad effects that look awful.

Different beast completely.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yeah, and you missed my original posts. They were expressing concern with HT. There are posters who would confirm this.

I have no doubt that your lunacy has been witnessed by many and for years.

Some people have the same feelings about movie replay value that you have about games. You expect everyone to appreciate your point of view, but you soundly criticize them for theirs. Therein lies the hypocrisy.

The only difference is the type of digital content that is being purchased. You say it is okay to buy digital games because blah blah blah. Others say it is okay to buy digital movies for the exact same reasons that you give for buying digital games. You condemn them for doing the very thing that yourself are doing.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I have no doubt that your lunacy has been witnessed by many and for years.

Some people have the same feelings about movie replay value that you have about games. You expect everyone to appreciate your point of view, but you soundly criticize them for theirs. Therein lies the hypocrisy.

The only difference is the type of digital content that is being purchased. You say it is okay to buy digital games because blah blah blah. Others say it is okay to buy digital movies for the exact same reasons that you give for buying digital games. You condemn them for doing the very thing that yourself are doing.

I didn’t say it was ok. There is no choice. VR mostly sells digital games. VR is my main gaming priority. I was forced, there is no choice. Much in the same way I would be forced to use digital lest I cannot experience films on a projector or large tv screen. Given the choice, I would want a world of discs for every format and art form that requires it.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I didn’t say it was ok. There is no choice. VR mostly sells digital games. VR is my main gaming priority. I was forced, there is no choice. Much in the same way I would be forced to use digital lest I cannot experience films on a projector or large tv screen. Given the choice, I would want a world of discs for every format and art form that requires it.

How many VR games do you have on disc?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Steedeel is obviously hypocritical and selfish. He only cares that people support the types of content he cares about most. Everyone else's preferences are wrong. Games don't matter because Steedeel doesn't like them as much as movies.

Whether or not I'm interested in any specific content or will be in the future I think that it is important that it remains available for those who are interested in it. I won't support a format that doesn't give everyone guaranteed access to the things they love.

So if discs were declared dead tomorrow and the industry stopped making them, you wouldn’t watch new films at home?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

How many VR games do you have on disc?

I have 12 disc games out of 40 titles. Where it was possible in other words. It is easier with the digital games though because the headset is wired and you don’t want to be constantly removing the headset lest you snag the wires.

[RefractiveIndex]

Originally Posted by Vilya

You are so, let's say, elastic in your attitude towards gaming. You'll readily enjoy digital versions of games, but then hate yourself in the morning, eh?

You are, conversely, so rigid and adamantly opposed to streaming, and digital purchases especially, yet you use the former the same as the rest of us. How conflicted you must be!

So, in theory, if digital video content ever reached a point where its video and audio quality were equal to that of the best physical format, then your dislike of it would largely dissipate? You'd feel better about the fact that you have been using it all along?

Video games aren't like movies, they are computer programs just like a word processor or an internet browser. Do you need a physical copy of your word processor or internet browser?

Many modern video games are large software platforms that are constantly being updated with additional content and features by developers. Owning a physical copy of a game is kind of pointless because over time the code and data can undergo enormous changes and additions that make it completely incompatible with the contents on the physical disk. Furthermore, if you're a PC gamer the vast majority of games never receive a physical copy anyway and when there is a physical copy it's little more than code in a box that gives you access to a digital download. The code is a one time use making it impossible to sell the game like you can with a physical copy of a film. It's also common to digitally sign a EULA(End user license agreement) when you install a game regardless of it being installed from a disc or digital download.

I don't believe it's hypocritical to be pro physical copies of films and pro digital copies of games as they are completely different animals. Films are more akin to books than games. If you want to draw an analogy between films and gaming it would make more sense to compare games stored locally on the gamer's system(regardless of being installed from a disc or downloaded) and gaming streaming services like Geforce NOW and Google Stadia where the graphics and game logic is processed on a server and a video capture of the rendered graphics are streamed back to the client. With a gaming streaming service, the client only responsibility is to capture user input and send it to the server.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

So if discs were declared dead tomorrow and the industry stopped making them, you wouldn’t watch new films at home?

No, I wouldn't watch any new films at home or anywhere else. I'd make do with the hundreds of thousands of movies and TV shows that have already been released on disc.