Apocalypse Now 4K UHD (1979)

[Rick Grimes]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

To my surprise, all four BDs in the Lionsgate 4K set (Final Cut, Theatrical & Redux, Extras, Hearts of Darkness) played on my region B player.

And dig this: on the Theatrical & Redux UHD you only get the new Atmos mix, but on the Theatrical & Redux BD there's no Atmos, instead you get the following audio options:

Hmmm. Seems Atmos is too good for Blu-Ray (especially if your Fox or Disney).

Perhaps the Atmos track took up too much space on the BD (Redux IS a long f*cking movie).
Similar issue with the Aussie release of Dances With Wolves - Collectors Edition. While the dizzy ported the Director’s Cut directly from the US disc, and left it unlocked (my Region A player thought the Aussie disc was the US disc I imported), the Theatrical Cut disc, that contains all the extras, was a transfer from a dates source with only vanilla DTS 5.1 (1.5 Mbps). A BD info scan reveals the BD-50 was jam packed with data.

It appears with Apocalypse Now Redux, they could easily fit a Dolby True HD track that hovers around the 1.5-2 Mbps mark, but an Atmos must take up 6-7 Mbps easy (and that’s just going by the core bitrate numbers seen in top corner of Sony players, when you hit the info button). Object-based audio tracks take up a fair bit of space.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by OgamiittoMcJ

[/SPOILER]

interesting
what's the options for final cut both UHD/BD ?

Here's everything just so there's no foul ups

Final Cut UHD: English Atmos (TrueHD 7.1 bed), English Dolby Digital 2.0 @ 192 kb/s

Final Cut BD: same

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Theatrical & Redux UHD: English Atmos (TrueHD 7.1 bed), audio commentary for Redux

Theatrical & Redux BD:

English Dolby TrueHD 5.1, English Dolby Digital theatrical mix 5.1 @ 448 kb/s (theatrical cut only), English Dolby Digital 5.1 @ 448 kb/s, English Dolby Digital 2.0 @ 192 kb/s, audio commentary for Redux

[brainofj72]

Why on earth wouldn’t they put the other Theatrical and Redux mixes on the UHD?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Rick Grimes

It appears with Apocalypse Now Redux, they could easily fit a Dolby True HD track that hovers around the 1.5-2 Mbps mark, but an Atmos must take up 6-7 Mbps easy (and that’s just going by the core bitrate numbers seen in top corner of Sony players, when you hit the info button). Object-based audio tracks take up a fair bit of space.

To that end: the video bitrate on the new branched Theatrical & Redux Blu-ray disc is super low, just like it was on the old branched BD. No, it's NOT the same old transfer as it's definitely the restored version here, but when things get hairy the compression really takes a hit. I'm watching the bunnies scene now from Redux and all that rain murders the compression on the new BD, some shots are pure filth and seeing as Radius60 encoded it I'm so not surprised, they're useless when dealing with bitrates that get this low.

The UHD looks 10x better compressed in the bunnies scene, you can tell the grain apart from the rain and things just get a little soft in its busiest moments rather than blocksville.

[OutOfBoose]

Distribution of audio tracks on the discs is bizarre.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by brainofj72

Why on earth wouldn’t they put the other Theatrical and Redux mixes on the UHD?

Yeah, that's disappointing that they did that. I wonder if the SC UHDs will have those audio options.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Dailyan

Yeah, that's disappointing that they did that. I wonder if the SC UHDs will have those audio options.

I dare say that the German release will be junking the extraneous DD tracks to make room for the German Atmos on top of the English Atmos, but then as they're doing their own encode they can do what they want and it's not like it really matters re: space being stolen from the video bitrate because SC are like so bad at encoding 4K video anyway.

Originally Posted by OutOfBoose

Distribution of audio tracks on the discs is bizarre.

Not putting the restored theatrical 5.1 mix on the Theatrical & Redux UHD is lame, and weird. It's not like making room for another 448 kb/s would've killed the video.

[Sky_Captain]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

Lovely looking collection but A Few Good Men is under A?

Yes, because it's not called 'Few Good Men.

With regards to Alien and chums, I like to keep movies in a series together.

Batman v Superman is filed beside Man of Steel, cause it's technically a sequel.

I'm loose with my alphabet, in that regard.

I have debated many times, just putting everything in the correct order, (Alien under A, Prometheus under P, etc), but it doesn't work in my head.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Sky_Captain

Yes, because it's not called 'Few Good Men.

My discs have been jumbled up for so long that it actually looks weird seeing stuff sorted into alphabetical order in your photo, I kid you not.

[xbs2034]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I dare say that the German release will be junking the extraneous DD tracks to make room for the German Atmos on top of the English Atmos, but then as they're doing their own encode they can do what they want and it's not like it really matters re: space being stolen from the video bitrate because SC are like so bad at encoding 4K video anyway.


Not putting the restored theatrical 5.1 mix on the Theatrical & Redux UHD is lame, and weird. It's not like making room for another 448 kb/s would've killed the video.

That really sucks about the restored original 5.1 being only on the Blu. I was probably gonna watch the theatrical cut next (since it’s the only version of the film I haven’t seen) and considering I’ve heard an immersive mix of IMAX 12 channel for Final Cut and my home setup is 5.1 anyway, that definitely would have been my audio choice.

[Alister_M]

I'll give the restored 5.1 mix a hoon on my smaller bedroom system (40" 1080p, 5.1) for the inevitable lazy Apocalypse Now weekend that I do every now and then.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by Sky_Captain

Yes, because it's not called 'Few Good Men.

With regards to Alien and chums, I like to keep movies in a series together.

Batman v Superman is filed beside Man of Steel, cause it's technically a sequel.

I'm loose with my alphabet, in that regard.

I have debated many times, just putting everything in the correct order, (Alien under A, Prometheus under P, etc), but it doesn't work in my head.

I have my Blu-rays like you do, my UHD’s are alphabetized. Now that my collection is pushing 300 I might organize by genre.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

I have my Blu-rays like you do, my UHD’s are alphabetized. Now that my collection is pushing 300 I might organize by genre.

I do it by genre myself (albeit non alphabetized with UHD and BD mixed together).

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

To that end: the video bitrate on the new branched Theatrical & Redux Blu-ray disc is super low, just like it was on the old branched BD. No, it's NOT the same old transfer as it's definitely the restored version here, but when things get hairy the compression really takes a hit. I'm watching the bunnies scene now from Redux and all that rain murders the compression on the new BD, some shots are pure filth and seeing as Radius60 encoded it I'm so not surprised, they're useless when dealing with bitrates that get this low.

The UHD looks 10x better compressed in the bunnies scene, you can tell the grain apart from the rain and things just get a little soft in its busiest moments rather than blocksville.

How does the new transfer look to your eyes, Geoff... if you're comparing apples to apples, badly-compressed old Blu-ray to badly compressed new Blu-ray. Gut feeling... if it's ONLY the theatrical Blu someone's after, is it worth the upgrade?

[Rick Grimes]

‘Tis strange that only thing that’s really missing from the TC/Redux UHD is the DD 5.1 for the TC (and the commentary).
Obviously, putting the 5.1 Dolby TrueHD on the UHD would be redundant, since the 7.1 core could be accessed should one want to do so.

With my 5.1 set-up, the Dolby True HD core simply puts the noises that would be in the 7.1 to the rears (that’s the difference between the 5.1 and 7.1 DTS Sound Check on my Yamaha).
I’m sure the True HD core would sound just fine on the UHD, if you have a 5.1 set-up (and should sound better than any lossy).

While I don’t own A Few Good Men, I did put A Quiet Place at the front of my UHD collection, where it should go, logically. “The” gets dropped in titles, not “A” (another eg. A Fish Called Wanda). But, I do things a little differently to many with numerals in titles, as I have 12 Monkeys at the start of my UHD and 28 Days Later/28 Weeks Later at the start of my BD shelf. Of course, Se7en, would go in the “S” section.

[Geoff D]

To go back to the fillum itself, I watched the Final Cut on UHD and me still no likey, sorry. The pacing is just so off and it's weird how Willard smiles and jokes so much in the extended cut(s), not just the surfboard scene but in the bit with the bunnies when he says "don't leave without me" and flashes a grin at the chief. I get that people like how it humanises him but the movie seems to flip from one extreme to the other, we get Willard nicking the surfboard like a total goof and then in the scene right after he's going through his dossier all serious like, and he rolls down the cover over the entrance on the boat to keep the others and their dope smoke out. Almost seems like a different character at times.

Meh. If I'm gonna watch the long version again then I'll just put in Redux, the pacing is wrecked as it is so I might as well lump in the rest of it. But the theatrical is still the daddy, I think I'll watch it tomorrow.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I do it by genre myself (albeit non alphabetized with UHD and BD mixed together).

I can’t bring myself to mixing formats yet. Maybe when I have more.

[birdztudio]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I find it rather funny that people are even still debating what's on the discs even though other folks actually have it in hand!

Mine just turned up...but I'm watching the cricket on telly so impressions will have to wait.

mind me asking? being in UK how come you get it so quick? where did you order from?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

How does the new transfer look to your eyes, Geoff... if you're comparing apples to apples, badly-compressed old Blu-ray to badly compressed new Blu-ray. Gut feeling... if it's ONLY the theatrical Blu someone's after, is it worth the upgrade?

Honestly, I despised the yellow-ass colour grade on the old BD. I still don't think it was the worst BD ever made or anything, I recall quite enjoying it despite the colour the last time I spun it a few years ago, but the new transfer is delicious on BD. It's got finer grain, tighter detail, and no more horrible yellow wash. The new transfer still retains the more buttery looking skin tones of stocks from that era, only now it's a pat of butter rather than the whole goddamned churn.

One thing I will say from more of a UHD-enlightened perspective is that the new SDR grading does that modern "SDR conversion" thing of washing out more of the highlights than is strictly necessary. Brighter skies and backgrounds can look very bland and featureless on the new BD(s) while the old BD pulls down more of the highlights but the brightest spots burn out in that typical video-esque way. In that respect the new BD still looks more naturally film-like, along with the finer grain and detail, but me being me I couldn't help but instantly notice how flat it now looks.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

One thing I will say from more of a UHD-enlightened perspective is that the new SDR grading does that modern "SDR conversion" thing of washing out more of the highlights than is strictly necessary. Brighter skies and backgrounds can look very bland and featureless on the new BD(s) while the old BD pulls down more of the highlights but the brightest spots burn out in that typical video-esque way. In that respect the new BD still looks more naturally film-like, along with the finer grain and detail, but me being me I couldn't help but instantly notice how flat it now looks.

Thanks for the observations. Hmm... that might bug me as well, about the highlights washing out. They don't go cyan like 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY's SDR Blu-ray, do they? That kind of nonsense is unwatchable, for me.