Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[The_Donster]

Originally Posted by sapiendut

Yes. A bad source is a bad source. But given the same master, the streaming version will always be worse than the physical media.

Totally, but is it enough for the average consumer to notice? My gut says no. Otherwise we wouldn’t be a niche market compared to the alternatives that the masses flock to despite them being an inferior product

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Totally, but is it enough for the average consumer to notice? My gut says no. Otherwise we wouldn’t be a niche market compared to the alternatives that the masses flock to despite them being an inferior product

The masses care more about convenience and economy; they are more than willing to sacrifice some quality in favor of these.

Anecdotally, I have shown 4k discs and 4k streams to some of the people that I know and while they acknowledge the better quality; they are unwilling to buy 4k discs and they are even unwilling to pay the extra $3 per month for Netflix's 4K streaming plan. They see the quality difference, but they just do not care enough to pay anything more in order to get it. Not even just $3!

[The_Donster]

Exactly Vilya, exactly. I, for example, don’t want cable hooked up to my flatscreen. I feel it is worse than anything I’ve seen on any of my streaming services or upscaled DVDs.

[Waboman]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

I am entertained. [insert Gladiator gif] 😁

Originally Posted by Vilya

As a long time Oppo owner; your avatar is killing me!

Lol. Beam us up, Scotty. Er, I mean stream us up. The USS Oppo has been decommissioned.😜

Originally Posted by Steedeel

That would be Donster.

A man of many gif’s.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Exactly Vilya, exactly. I, for example, don’t want cable hooked up to my flatscreen. I feel it is worse than anything I’ve seen on any of my streaming services or upscaled DVDs.

I use an over the air antenna, one time cost of about $40, and my IPTV channels. I will NEVER pay cable's exorbitant prices again for the "privilege" of watching 20 minutes of commercials per viewing hour.

What I save on cable TV allows me to buy about 5 blu-rays per month; a much better use of the money, in my opinion.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by sapiendut

Yes. A bad source is a bad source. But given the same master, the streaming version will always be worse than the physical media.

Okay you answered your own question, if it's from the same Master then Streaming and Digital should be the same. Now with Adaptive Streaming the Providers could put the same File and should get identical results. On paper Physical should be better than Streaming, but in real time testing is it? I know Disc people like to parrot bad Streaming write-ups, but I don't see any of that in my Streaming Quality!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Okay you answered your own question, if it's from the same Master then Streaming and Digital should be the same. Now with Adaptive Streaming the Providers could put the same File and should get identical results. On paper Physical should be better than Streaming, but in real time testing is it? I know Disc people like to parrot bad Streaming write-ups, but I don't see any of that in my Streaming Quality!

It is NOT the same because the compression being used is not the same. Streams are much, much more compressed.

Adaptive streaming only adapts the stream to the user's variable internet connection conditions and it adapts downwards as conditions deteriorate and back up again as they improve, but only up to the streaming provider's limit. Netflix, under no condition, with any internet connection, will exceed a bitrate of 16 Mbps for its 4K streams; 16 Mbps is as good as it ever gets with them and that is well below the bitrate of any 4k disc which averages in the 80-90 Mbps range with a maximum of 128 Mbps.

You can not get identical results when the streaming bitrate is compressed to one fifth, or less, of the disc's bitrate.

Also, as you do not have the ability to play and watch a 4K disc, you have no frame of reference with which to make any comparison. You can not expect to see a difference when you can not even make the comparison in the first place.

[The_Donster]

Preaching to the choir on that point Vilya. I’ve considered mounting an antenna up in the attic to see if my Samsung will pick up local stations. Although the only thing The Mrs and I watch is The Good Place, and we can watch it on the NBC app once it starts up again.

As I’ve said before, I tried to unplug us from cable back when we bought our 55” LG (that our son now uses in his room) and saw all of its imperfections. Best I got was basic cable up until Comcast forced the boxes back on us in Washington State. Now we’ve moved here to Texas with The MiL in tow and I’ve been out voted again ’

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Waboman

I am entertained. [insert Gladiator gif] 😁



Lol. Beam us up, Scotty. Er, I mean stream us up. The USS Oppo has been decommissioned.😜



A man of many gif’s.

Something like that.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Preaching to the choir on that point Vilya. I’ve considered mounting an antenna up in the attic to see if my Samsung will pick up local stations. Although the only thing The Mrs and I watch is The Good Place, and we can watch it on the NBC app once it starts up again.

As I’ve said before, I tried to unplug us from cable back when we bought our 55” LG (that our son now uses in his room) and saw all of its imperfections. Best I got was basic cable up until Comcast forced the boxes back on us in Washington State. Now we’ve moved here to Texas with The MiL in tow and I’ve been out voted again ’

I realize that it doesn't work this way except in theory, but I say that if the MIL wants cable, then the MIL can pay for it.

It is now time for me to rewatch The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug Extended Cut 3D; my neighbors are gonna love me! Smaug is awesome in actual multi-channel speaker driven surround sound! You aren't gonna find this wonderful presentation on streaming, either! Enjoy your 2D forums...I'm off on an adventure...in 3D!

[Waboman]

So what are we discussing here? Which is better, disc or digital? If you want quality, disc all day long. If you're after convenience it’s streaming. I like ‘em both. I love sinking into my chair, freshly made cocktail and streaming some 4K UHD Netflix and Prime shows. But if I’m going to watch a movie it’s 99% of the time I throw in a disc. Now if only I had a sexy fembot to put the movie in for me it’d be golden. Although I don’t think the Mrs would sign off on that.

[The_Donster]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I realize that it doesn't work this way except in theory, but I say that if the MIL wants cable, then the MIL can pay for it.

Well, she takes care of her fair share and for all I know, does. Right now I’d like to just get some decent internet or that at least justifies the cost. The Mrs and her keep talking about satellite, but don’t want a dish hanging off our beautiful house.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Well, she takes care of her fair share and for all I know, does. Right now I’d like to just get some decent internet or that at least justifies the cost. The Mrs and her keep talking about satellite, but don’t want a dish hanging off our beautiful house.

Satellite sucks. Succinct, but accurate.

[The_Donster]

Originally Posted by Waboman

So what are we discussing here? Which is better, disc or digital? If you want quality, disc all day long. If you're after convenience it’s streaming. I like ‘em both. I love sinking into my chair, freshly made cocktail and streaming some 4K UHD Netflix and Prime shows. But if I’m going to watch a movie it’s 99% of the time I throw in a disc. Now if only I had a sexy fembot to put the movie in for me it’d be golden. Although I don’t think the Mrs would sign off on that.

That’s basically the gist of the conversation, with a little prediction of doomed future from the acolytes on both sides Waboman.

[The_Donster]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Satellite sucks. Succinct, but accurate.

I think my MiL watches too much late night television. Both her and her grandson are prone to shrewd advertising

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Waboman

So what are we discussing here? Which is better, disc or digital? If you want quality, disc all day long. If you're after convenience it’s streaming. I like ‘em both. I love sinking into my chair, freshly made cocktail and streaming some 4K UHD Netflix and Prime shows. But if I’m going to watch a movie it’s 99% of the time I throw in a disc. Now if only I had a sexy fembot to put the movie in for me it’d be golden. Although I don’t think the Mrs would sign off on that.

Ditch the misses, promote the fembot! Simple.

[sapiendut]

Exactly. Just because YOU think streaming is fantastic, doesn’t mean that it is. Just because the masses thinks General Tso’s Chicken is Chinese Food, it doesn’t make it so.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

We are all sick of you talking about adaptive streaming when you clearly have no idea how it works.

Adaptive streaming requires files for every bitrate offered. The file size needed is therefore much larger to achieve the same quality of a disc. If a streaming provider wanted to match a 60GB 4K version on disc they would have to have a 60GB version, a 40GB version, a 20GB version, a 10GB version, a 5GB version, a 2GB version, and a 1GB version in order to accommodate various internet speeds. The total size needed would therefore be around 138GB for each movie.

That would get extremely expensive extremely fast. Digital providers are already paying hundreds of millions of dollars in bandwidth and storage costs every year. There is no chance that they will increase their spending to tens of billions of dollars just to appease the small number of customers who care about improved video quality. Especially since most of their customers (including you) already think that streaming looks fantastic.

A valiant effort, but one that will fail to teach him anything. Many have tried many times to explain many things to him and it always fails. This inability of his to learn anything, from anyone, ever, is really quite uncanny.

[Waboman]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

That’s basically the gist of the conversation, with a little prediction of doomed future from the acolytes on both sides Waboman.

Gotcha. Thinking of doing a little Netflix streaming in a bit. But first I have a strange craving for general tso’s chicken.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Ditch the misses, promote the fembot! Simple.

There are times...

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

At this point I'm not trying to teach him anything, I know that will never work. I'm just providing information for anyone else who may be reading. I don't want other people accidentally being fooled into thinking that alchav knows what he's talking about.

It is scary to even think that anyone could be so easily fooled, but there is overwhelming evidence that they do exist and in droves.