Terminator: Dark Fate SPOILER Discussion Thread

[CyberpunkCentral]

John Connor is dead (again). WTF!?

[kylor]

I think James Cameron is the only guy who wants John Connor to die more than Skynet (or some stupid form of it). This will become the Uncle Ben and Martha/Wayne death of the franchise, which sucks.

[xbs2034]

Originally Posted by kylor

I think James Cameron is the only guy who wants John Connor to die more than Skynet (or some stupid form of it). This will become the Uncle Ben and Martha/Wayne death of the franchise, which sucks.

I read the Wikipedia plot summary, and assuming it’s true (I know Wikipedia is fan edited), it’s sounds like Arnold’s Terminator dies yet again.

That kinda sucks, both because it truly is the Wayne family type death (he’s died in every movie except the 5th) and I hear he doesn’t appear until the third act in this. Whereas I feel like a Terminator that completes its mission and then develops remorse is an interesting character arc that could’ve used space to explore.

[UniSol GR77]

The Terminator Timeline before the T2 (second half) and Dark Fate alterations.


1965: Sarah Connor is born in Los Angeles.
May 12-13th, 1984: The events of The Terminator happen. John Connor, the one and only, is conceived by Sarah and Kyle Reese. Reese is killed. The T-800 Model 101 is destroyed, but Cyberdyne Systems retrieves the Neural Net chip and the arm. After the events, Sarah lives off the grid and moves to Mexico. The exact Polaroid picture - which one day John will give to Kyle - is shot.
February 1985: John Connor is born in Mexico. Sarah starts her training as soldier.
1992: Sarah tries to destroy a computer factory. She is arrested and internalized in a psychiatric hospital. John is bought to the Voights.
October 1994: Cyberdyne Systems becomes the main staple in Army’s computerized systems service.
April 1995: The events of the first half of Terminator 2: Judgment Day occurs the exact way as they are depicted on-screen.
Sarah Connor is freed from the Pescadero State Hospital. Sarah, John and the T-800/Uncle Bob escape in Mexico aided and supported by Enrique Salceda and his companion. They wait for the Judgment Day to happen.
The T-1000, unable to retrace them in any possible way, go in a self-“decommissioned” mode and wait somewhere, blending among humans.

In three years, Cyberdyne will become the largest supplier of military computer systems. All stealth bombers are upgraded with Cyberdyne computers, becoming fully unmanned. Afterwards, they fly with a perfect operational record. The Skynet Funding Bill is passed. The system goes online August 4th, 1997. Human decisions are removed from strategic defense. Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, August 29th. In a panic, they try to pull the plug.


August 29th, 1997: Judgment Day happens as previously told by Kyle Reese and Sarah Connor.
The T-1000, self-decommissioned two years ago, is destroyed by a nuclear blast.
L.A. Police reports (Kyle Reese, the Terminators) go lost in the nuclear fire and the EMP.

Three billion human lives ended on August 29th, 1997. The survivors of the nuclear fire called the war Judgment Day. They lived only to face a new nightmare: the war against the machines.

1996(?): The Failsafe T-800 materializes in the past. He cannot find the Connors. He self-decommission as the T-1000 did.
2000: Kyle Reese is born.
Maybe, around this time, Sarah and John destroys the T-800/Uncle Bob in order to prevent Skynet from retrieve him before its proper time.
2022-26: T-800s are introduced.
2027: Kyle Reese joins John Connor’s Tech-Com squadron. After many months, he is given the Polaroid picture.
2028: Skynet completes the T-1000 project.
July 4th, 2029: Skynet is defeated. The computer sends three Terminators back in time as last ditch effort:

The T-800 in 1984.
The T-1000 in 1994.
The Failsafe T-800 in 1996 (?)

Skynet believes the timeline is malleable/alterable.
As feedback, John Connor sends two warriors back in time:

Kyle Reese and “Uncle Bob” T-800.

Connor already knows the timeline is fixed. The war is over. Humanity recovers...



The actions of "Terminator 2" - SECOND HALF are the result of an anomaly in the continuum. The Circular Loop goes broken, we don't know "why". The fixed timeline becomes a malleable/alterable one.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by xbs2034

I read the Wikipedia plot summary, and assuming it’s true (I know Wikipedia is fan edited), it’s sounds like Arnold’s Terminator dies yet again.

That kinda sucks, both because it truly is the Wayne family type death (he’s died in every movie except the 5th) and I hear he doesn’t appear until the third act in this. Whereas I feel like a Terminator that completes its mission and then develops remorse is an interesting character arc that could’ve used space to explore.

It's true. The terminator in this movie does die. He makes himself a sacrifice in order to take out the Rev-9. He is also the same terminator that killed John Connor, so the death is deserved anyway, even if he changed his mind and tried to help.

That irks me a little bit. Mostly because Terminators cannot self-terminate (hence the whole ending in T2). Yet the terminator in Dark Fate decides to self-terminate sacrificially in order to take out the Rev-9. It undoes so many things T1 & T2 set up, and it makes sure to tease you and rub it in your face all the way through the movie as well (callback T2 scene where the Rev-9 crashes into a shed, the scene where Carl goes to wear the famous black glasses like in T2, but doesn't do it just to piss off fans of T2). Absolute shite.

[UniSol GR77]

That irks me a little bit. Mostly because Terminators cannot self-terminate (hence the whole ending in T2). Yet the terminator in Dark Fate decides to self-terminate sacrificially in order to take out the Rev-9.

He evolved beyond the programming.
IMHO, Carl is just a great character and a truly new take on Terminator.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

He evolved beyond the programming.
IMHO, Carl is just a great character and a truly new take on Terminator.

I don't buy that. If he had evolved so much he would have had SOME feelings towards his adopted family.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

I don't buy that. If he had evolved so much he would have had SOME feelings towards his adopted family.

Remorse (because the death of John) has become greater than that.

We just got the very first Human Terminator, pretty much different from Marcus Wright and Grace.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

Remorse (because the death of John) has become greater than that.

We just got the very first Human Terminator, pretty much different from Marcus Wright and Grace.

It was garbage IMO. We have human characters to act the human parts for us. After all, it's the humans that are fighting for their humanity, not Skynet (sorry, Genisys, oops, I mean Legion. God ****ing damn it keep consistent!). Robots should be just that, robotic. Heck, T2 managed it just fine. IMO it really shouldn't be more than that.

That's just me. Other people may be fine with that and that's cool.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

It was garbage IMO. We have human characters to act the human parts for us. After all, it's the humans that are fighting for their humanity, not Skynet. Robots should be just that, robotic. Heck, T2 managed it just fine. IMO it really shouldn't be more than that.

Carl is an anomaly. That's the beauty of the concept. Humanity is an anomaly, it's unpredicable, it happens no matter what.
I absolutely love it.

[Creed]

So only stick with T1 and T2.

Not surprising.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

Carl is an anomaly. That's the beauty of the concept. Humanity is an anomaly, it's unpredicable, it happens no matter what.
I absolutely love it.

That's cool that you like it. I just don't, but no offense to you for liking something I don't.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

That's cool that you like it. I just don't, but no offense to you for liking something I don't.

Have you read my timeline? Any observations to improve it?

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

Have you read my timeline? Any observations to improve it?

Maybe mention that Dani is the new John Connor, and Grace was basically the new Kyle Reese in a sense. Technically the new Sarah Connor would be Dani's mom, but it seems in this movie it's her father.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

Maybe mention that Dani is the new John Connor, and Grace was basically the new Kyle Reese in a sense. Technically the new Sarah Connor would be Dani's mom, but it seems in this movie it's her father.

I did not write the "revised" timeline, only the original (fixed) timeline where the second half of T2 never occurred.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

I did not write the "revised" timeline, only the original (fixed) timeline where the second half of T2 never occurred.

Ah okay. Then yeah, my suggestion is to add the revised timeline. Though I'm sure you've got that planned anyway.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

Ah okay. Then yeah, my suggestion is to add the revised timeline. Though I'm sure you've got that planned anyway.

Yes. I'm just expecting more "inside" infos about Dark Fate.

Wondering why Dani Ramos is so special for Legion... and how many Terminators did Sarah destroy since 2000 or so...

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

Yes. I'm just expecting more "inside" infos about Dark Fate.

Wondering why Dani Ramos is so special for Legion... and how many Terminators did Sarah destroy since 2000 or so...

It was hinted that it's supposed to be Dani's son (this is actually mentioned by both Sarah and Grace) thats the key to Legion's defeat. Then the movie decides to throw that out of the window and it's now somehow Dani herself, not her kid.

I swear the writing makes no ****ing sense.

[UniSol GR77]

Originally Posted by kylor

It was hinted that it's supposed to be Dani's son (this is actually mentioned by both Sarah and Grace) thats the key to Legion's defeat. Then the movie decides to throw that out of the window and it's now somehow Dani herself, not her kid.

I swear the writing makes no ****ing sense.

Maybe they will explain that in the sequel.

[kylor]

Originally Posted by UniSol GR77

Maybe they will explain that in the sequel.

That's if they don't reboot it again first before we even get answers.