HDR heatmaps and torch mode UHDs

[Pyoko]

I never bought any of the BDs previously because I don't particularly like the movie, but the SDR grade for the restoration is actually quite unpleasant with its hard-clipped highlights.

Adjusting for the fact that it's a bit bright on average, the real HDR here consists mainly of the crystals on the good witch and the slippers, the tin man, and the occasional fire.

UHD color | UHD luminance | BD luminance | UHD tonemap | BD upscale

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 189 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 20 samples. (Min: 138, Max: 238, Median: 192)

[Pyoko]

Something appropriate about this turning up again.

I previously suspected the ancient BD master was unusually murky, causing the relative nit number to go up. User nissling kindly sent me some shots of the Japanese Mi4K BD so I'm reposting comparing to that one. The number is lower but not by as much as I thought. It is still quite, quite bright compared to the SDR master.








Album

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 268 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 11 samples. (Min: 241, Max: 366, Median: 258)

[Streetlight]

Can you compare the colors between a Mi4K BD and a UHD BD?

[Pyoko]

Originally Posted by Streetlight

Can you compare the colors between a Mi4K BD and a UHD BD?

Are you talking about the xvYCC stuff? I'm afraid not. If I understand it correctly the conversion to RGB will produce illegal values that must then be handled by the display and mapped to a wider gamut, but I don't think there's any way to capture that data after it's already been converted to RGB. Unless there were some way to capture frames of the raw YCbCr data and do the conversion yourself, but I don't know if there's any good way to do that either.

[Pyoko]

Probably an SDR conversion as I could more or less recreate the luminance of the HDR from the SDR with a curve for all the samples, but it kind of doesn't matter because this is probably the best conversion I've seen. They did a really great job expanding the highlights so it's got all the tiny bright details you want instead of big flat blobs, and without taking half the midrange with it.








Album

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 191 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 17 samples. (Min: 164, Max: 224, Median: 190)

[lgans316]

@Pyoko

Equalizer

Maximum Content Light Level : 7397 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level : 836 cd/m2

General
File size                                : 59.7 GiB
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
Overall bit rate                         : 64.7 Mb/s
Movie name                               : Equalizer

Video
ID                                       : 1
ID in the original source medium         : 4113 (0x1011)
Format                                   : HEVC
Format/Info                              : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile                           : Main 10@L5.1@High
HDR format                               : SMPTE ST 2086, HDR10 compatible
Codec ID                                 : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Bit rate                                 : 55.7 Mb/s
Width                                    : 3 840 pixels
Height                                   : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0 (Type 2)
Bit depth                                : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.280
Stream size                              : 51.4 GiB (86%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Color range                              : Limited
Color primaries                          : BT.2020
Transfer characteristics                 : PQ
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.2020 non-constant
Mastering display color primaries        : Display P3
Mastering display luminance              : min: 0.0050 cd/m2, max: 4000 cd/m2
Maximum Content Light Level              : 7397 cd/m2
Maximum Frame-Average Light Level        : 836 cd/m2
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Audio #1
ID                                       : 2
ID in the original source medium         : 4352 (0x1100)
Format                                   : MLP FBA 16-ch
Format/Info                              : Meridian Lossless Packing FBA with 16-channel presentation
Commercial name                          : Dolby TrueHD with Dolby Atmos
Codec ID                                 : A_TRUEHD
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 4 557 kb/s
Maximum bit rate                         : 7 812 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 8 channels
Channel layout                           : L R C LFE Ls Rs Lb Rb
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 1 200.000 FPS (40 SPF)
Bit depth                                : 24 bits
Compression mode                         : Lossless
Stream size                              : 4.20 GiB (7%)
Title                                    : Surround 7.1
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : Yes
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray
Number of dynamic objects                : 11
Bed channel count                        : 1 channel
Bed channel configuration                : LFE

Audio #2
ID                                       : 3
ID in the original source medium         : 4352 (0x1100)
Format                                   : AC-3
Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name                          : Dolby Digital
Codec ID                                 : A_AC3
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 640 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 6 channels
Channel layout                           : L R C LFE Ls Rs
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Stream size                              : 604 MiB (1%)
Title                                    : Surround 5.1
Language                                 : English
Service kind                             : Complete Main
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Audio #3
ID                                       : 4
ID in the original source medium         : 4353 (0x1101)
Format                                   : DTS XLL
Format/Info                              : Digital Theater Systems
Commercial name                          : DTS-HD Master Audio
Codec ID                                 : A_DTS
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 2 222 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 6 channels
Channel layout                           : C L R Ls Rs LFE
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 93.750 FPS (512 SPF)
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Compression mode                         : Lossless
Stream size                              : 2.05 GiB (3%)
Title                                    : Surround 5.1
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Audio #4
ID                                       : 5
ID in the original source medium         : 4353 (0x1101)
Format                                   : DTS
Format/Info                              : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID                                 : A_DTS
Duration                                 : 2 h 12 min
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 1 509 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 6 channels
Channel layout                           : C L R Ls Rs LFE
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 93.750 FPS (512 SPF)
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Stream size                              : 1.39 GiB (2%)
Title                                    : Surround 5.1
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #1
ID                                       : 6
ID in the original source medium         : 4768 (0x12A0)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 2 h 10 min
Bit rate                                 : 30.0 kb/s
Count of elements                        : 3063
Stream size                              : 28.1 MiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #2
ID                                       : 8
ID in the original source medium         : 4769 (0x12A1)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 2 h 2 min
Bit rate                                 : 22.9 kb/s
Count of elements                        : 2144
Stream size                              : 20.1 MiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #3
ID                                       : 9
ID in the original source medium         : 4769 (0x12A1)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 1 h 50 min
Bit rate                                 : 765 b/s
Count of elements                        : 100
Stream size                              : 618 KiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #4
ID                                       : 10
ID in the original source medium         : 4770 (0x12A2)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 2 h 10 min
Bit rate                                 : 30.0 kb/s
Count of elements                        : 3063
Stream size                              : 28.1 MiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #5
ID                                       : 12
ID in the original source medium         : 4771 (0x12A3)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 2 h 2 min
Bit rate                                 : 23.0 kb/s
Count of elements                        : 2144
Stream size                              : 20.1 MiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Text #6
ID                                       : 13
ID in the original source medium         : 4771 (0x12A3)
Format                                   : PGS
Codec ID                                 : S_HDMV/PGS
Codec ID/Info                            : Picture based subtitle format used on BDs/HD-DVDs
Duration                                 : 1 h 50 min
Bit rate                                 : 765 b/s
Count of elements                        : 100
Stream size                              : 618 KiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : No
Forced                                   : No
Original source medium                   : Blu-ray

Menu
00:00:00.000                             : en:Chapter 01
00:06:49.659                             : en:Chapter 02
00:13:03.574                             : en:Chapter 03
00:20:55.671                             : en:Chapter 04
00:25:48.755                             : en:Chapter 05
00:35:26.707                             : en:Chapter 06
00:46:32.080                             : en:Chapter 07
00:55:44.007                             : en:Chapter 08
01:03:59.418                             : en:Chapter 09
01:13:52.803                             : en:Chapter 10
01:20:58.645                             : en:Chapter 11
01:31:09.297                             : en:Chapter 12
01:38:37.745                             : en:Chapter 13
01:47:28.733                             : en:Chapter 14
01:55:38.264                             : en:Chapter 15
02:00:01.485                             : en:Chapter 16

[Pyoko]

Expected this. The HDR is not very expansive overall, it's just got a fairly high average brightness, perhaps targeting a 200 nit SDR peak equivalent. Quite a few discs seem to land around there so I'm starting to think that maybe it's a reference point they're actually using rather than just doing stuff by eye.

I'm now also exporting regular tonemapped UHD shots and upscaled BD ones during the process, is that something people would be interested in seeing? Caps-a-holic already has nearly everything but thought it might be nice to have anyway. I'm not sure if I should just post them here or separate them out in the screenshots thread if so.

I'm also trying out another image host, since its thumbnails are small enough I can kind of almost get away with just dumping the entire thing without the post becoming insanely—just slightly—long (there's also more than the usual amount of shots this time.) Let me know how it works out or if you prefer the old style post/host.

UHD color | UHD luminance | BD luminance | UHD tonemap | BD upscale

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 193 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 35 samples. (Min: 114, Max: 275, Median: 191)

[Pyoko]

HDR is at times kind of random on this, the light bed for example is HDR in one shot but not in others. The taser scene stood out to me when I watched it and sure enough it seems to be only one that goes up 1000 nits.

UHD color | UHD luminance | BD luminance | UHD tonemap | BD upscale

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 112 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 20 samples. (Min: 93, Max: 256, Median: 105)

[Agent Kay]

Shell is really very theatrically accurate despite people thinking it was like a Sony supernova grade!

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Agent Kay

Shell is really very theatrically accurate despite people thinking it was like a Sony supernova grade!

It was more the expectation that led to my initial disappointment with it, I didn't see it theatrically but I fully expected an assault on my eyeballs from the UHD and when I didn't get it I got my sulk on. Upon rewatching it a little while ago I enjoyed it a LOT more, both film and HDR grade, because those expectations had been tempered.

[professorwho]

Looking at this thread makes me curious for what Sony's UHDs of "Mr Smith" and "Dr Strangelove" will be like with regards to nit levels.

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by professorwho

Looking at this thread makes me curious for what Sony's UHDs of "Mr Smith" and "Dr Strangelove" will be like with regards to nit levels.

I want to see the sequel Mr and Mrs Smith

[Eric_The_Victor]

Like the new format Pyoko, thanks and keep'm coming.

[Pyoko]

Originally Posted by Agent Kay

Shell is really very theatrically accurate despite people thinking it was like a Sony supernova grade!

Did they? I remember most complained about it being too dark and having no HDR. The latter clearly not true, as for the former it's accurately calibrated for dim room viewing (not the kind of movie you'd want to watch in a bright environment anyway.)

[Pyoko]

Haven't watched it yet, just a quick sampling.

Although an improvement with better grain and so on, the restoration is definitely showing its age here along with the quality of the source. The biggest issue the BD had was with gradation/banding and abrupt changes in values that became even more noticeable in motion with the heavy grain. The 10bit on the UHD helps a lot with this. The fact that it's now stretched to HDR and is so bright means I still get gradation issues with grain popping in the brightest parts, but that's probably just the processing on my set.

Shot 7 appears to have a boom mic that's just about visible in the top of the frame on the BD, but it's quite noticeable on the UHD with the different framing.

UHD color | UHD luminance | BD luminance | UHD tonemap | BD upscale

With a similar highlight roll-off the HDR version would on average be equivalent to the SDR version with peak white at 403 nits (Gamma at 2.40), based on 20 samples. (Min: 244, Max: 658, Median: 388)

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by Pyoko

Did they? I remember most complained about it being too dark and having no HDR. The latter clearly not true, as for the former it's accurately calibrated for dim room viewing (not the kind of movie you'd want to watch in a bright environment anyway.)

Sorry I meant they thought it was that way theatrically

[Pyoko]

Originally Posted by Agent Kay

Sorry I meant they thought it was that way theatrically

Ah yes, now I understand. I doubt there are many if any movies that were attenuated on disc compared to the theatrical release.

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by Pyoko

Ah yes, now I understand. I doubt there are many if any movies that were attenuated on disc compared to the theatrical release.

All them Sony remasters lol

[Geoff D]

Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Light Cannon™

[Pyoko]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Light Cannon™

Pretty much. If it weren't for that barely anything would break 300 nits.