New Panasonic player details/specs/price

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Gamekid

I agree with what you're saying "rushing = bad" Why even have HD-DVD in the first place if there is only support from one company for it? I'm saying that having it around is a bad idea, but it seems kind of silly to have it compete against blu-ray DVD when everyone knows that blu-ray will beat out HD-DVD. It's like the beta against the VHS. VHS beat out beta and beta died a horrible death.

Put it to you like this: I've seen stranger things happen, but honestly, there's no excuses for Blu-Ray to lose, given everything.

[Knight-Errant]

Originally Posted by JTK

Put it to you like this: I've seen stranger things happen, but honestly, there's no excuses for Blu-Ray to lose, given everything.

So true JTK

[Gamekid]

I don't see why blu-ray should lose. I mean blu-ray is the next gen format to DVD and DVD beat out VHS which beat out beta. Like any other new product, blu-ray just needs some time to improve. We have numerous movies coming out in blu-ray, numerours blu-ray players, about a dozen movie studios that are supporting blu-ray, and blu-ray records intended to replace VCR's. I don't know what more you can ask for? I guess to see improvements soon.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Gamekid

I don't see why blu-ray should lose. I mean blu-ray is the next gen format to DVD and DVD beat out VHS which beat out beta. Like any other new product, blu-ray just needs some time to improve. We have numerous movies coming out in blu-ray, numerours blu-ray players, about a dozen movie studios that are supporting blu-ray, and blu-ray records intended to replace VCR's. I don't know what more you can ask for? I guess to see improvements soon.

There wouldn't even be any hesitation or doubt by most sane or objective people had BD not stumbled out of the gate with the poor software that they did in the beginning and is already in the process of being improved upon.

Everyone had hoped BD would have immediately launched with nukes, shock and awe but they didn't.

I am increasingly getting the idea that come November...we're going to finally starting seeing some REAL shock and awe and the beginnings of the REAL Blu-Ray.

Buckle up.

[Psiweaver]

Blu-ray was released too early and wasn't really ready for prime time. We are finally seeing the real launch for when they are really ready.

[Gamekid]

I'm with you. Just image the impact that blu-ray will make this November. It's going to hit, as I would say, like an astroid.

[Knight-Errant]

It's great to see sanity return to these parts as it was starting to get depressing.

I understand why everyone was so down in the dumps a while back, but now we're seeing some really great looking content and BD 50s are right around the corner it feels like we're getting back on track!

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Knight-Errant

It's great to see sanity return to these parts as it was starting to get depressing.

I understand why everyone was so down in the dumps a while back, but now we're seeing some really great looking content and BD 50s are right around the corner it feels like we're getting back on track!

One point of concern here:

I am reading on Crutchfield and some other places about this Panny player and this is one thing that I tripped on:

Warranty: 1 year parts, 90 days labor"

If that's true, that's a joke, I'm sorry.

ANY of these $1000+ players should be coming with better warranties than that.


I've said for months now that the Sony BD player should be considered a Sony ES product and be handled as such. That means 4-5 year warranty out of the box.

The same should be true, or equivalent, for ANY AND ALL of the rest of these forthcoming >$1000 MSRP BD standalone players.

What's the warranty usually like on Pioneer Elite?


I feel like that would go a LONG ways towards helping to "justify" costs and it would just mean more confidence for potential customers all the way around.

That kind of warranty you quoted on a >$1000 product is a joke.


Somehow I see myself going back to my original Prime Directive once I get this HD-DVD player out of here next week and refunded: Use the game consoles as stop gaps until the format is over.

I just can't see putting big money down on first gen hardware, especially if they aren't going to provide better coverage than that.

[Gamekid]

I can use the VCR as an example. Many VCR's come with a one or two year limited warranty. You can get an extended warranty when the original one expires. With a blu-ray player, I think it would be best to get one that has a one or two year limited warranty, and also get an extended warranty to cover an additional 3 or 4 years. If I bought a blu-ray player, I would replace it eventually. I mean, we never kept certain things like cell phones, computers, VCR's or DVD players longer then about 6 years at most. I know that with the high price of a blu-ray player now, protecting your player from breakage is the most important thing that you want to do. With the panny player, you'll probably go through at least two or three players. Nothing lasts forever.

[Ascended_Saiyan]

I think I will get the Sammy player w/ 3 year warranty tomorrow from Hi-Fi Buys and use their trade-up program (I think it lasts a year) to get the Panasonic player when it comes out. All I'll have to do is pay the difference. That will scratch my itch nicely and that'll take care of the warranty issue.

[Chad Varnadore]

That's Panasonic's standard warranty on their DVD line too. And, I agree it is a joke. But, Panasonic is one of few manufacturers that really seems to get it when it comes to player design and I look forward to their first BD player more than most and will probably order it sight unseen as a result.

[theknub]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

I think I will get the Sammy player w/ 3 year warranty tomorrow from Hi-Fi Buys and use their trade-up program (I think it lasts a year) to get the Panasonic player when it comes out. All I'll have to do is pay the difference. That will scratch my itch nicely and that'll take care of the warranty issue.

they have a website? sounds like a great deal.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

I think I will get the Sammy player w/ 3 year warranty tomorrow from Hi-Fi Buys and use their trade-up program (I think it lasts a year) to get the Panasonic player when it comes out. All I'll have to do is pay the difference. That will scratch my itch nicely and that'll take care of the warranty issue.

I'd just wait if I were you...

[Ascended_Saiyan]

Originally Posted by theknub

they have a website? sounds like a great deal.

Try here. I think you might have to go into a local store. They have a lot of names (i.e. HiFi Buys, Tweeter, Sound Advice, etc.).

[theknub]

i'll take a gander. most likely i'll just wait since that makes the most sense... but you never know

[Gamekid]

Maybe the pioneer player won't be out until late september.

[Psiweaver]

Originally Posted by JTK

One point of concern here:

I am reading on Crutchfield and some other places about this Panny player and this is one thing that I tripped on:



If that's true, that's a joke, I'm sorry.

ANY of these $1000+ players should be coming with better warranties than that.


I've said for months now that the Sony BD player should be considered a Sony ES product and be handled as such. That means 4-5 year warranty out of the box.

The same should be true, or equivalent, for ANY AND ALL of the rest of these forthcoming >$1000 MSRP BD standalone players.

What's the warranty usually like on Pioneer Elite?


I feel like that would go a LONG ways towards helping to "justify" costs and it would just mean more confidence for potential customers all the way around.

That kind of warranty you quoted on a >$1000 product is a joke.


Somehow I see myself going back to my original Prime Directive once I get this HD-DVD player out of here next week and refunded: Use the game consoles as stop gaps until the format is over.

I just can't see putting big money down on first gen hardware, especially if they aren't going to provide better coverage than that.

The standard Elite warranty is 2 years and thats what will be coming with the Pioneer player. Most A/V products have warranty in line with that Panasonic nicer A/V products tend to have 2-3 year warranty and speakers 5 or more.

[ethan]

Back on topic, I found something on ZDnet :

Panasonic is promising a free firmware upgrade that will enable the player to decode the latest and greatest high-fidelity Blu-ray soundtracks, DTS-HD, and Dolby TrueHD.

Oh, and a little more detailed description of their video processing, on another site :
http://www.mrmdvd.com/catalog/produc...roducts_id=536

P4HD (Pixel Precision Progressive Processing for HD)
To get the best HD images from a BD-Video disc, you need a player that renders high-quality progressive images, expresses motion smoothly, and draws sharp diagonal lines. The DMP-BD10's P4HD processes more than 15 billion pixels per second and applies the optimum processing to every pixel in the video data on the disc. The result is images with exceptional resolution.

Precise Pixel Generation
BD-Video supports a number of formats. For example, the highest-quality format (1920 x 1080 pixels) can be recorded at any of four different frame rates - 59.94i, 50i, 23.976p and 24p and the compression format can be MPEG2, MPEG4 AVC or VC-1. The BD-Video player must detect these instantly and perform progressive conversion when necessary. Both for the de-interlacing and scaling, the DMP-BD10's super-high-speed P4HD generates each pixel correctly according to information obtained from up to 60 surrounding pixels. Applying progressive processing to huge amounts of data, it delivers images of striking beauty.

16-Level Motion Detection with Pixel-Based Motion Adaptive
For optimum progressive conversion, the processing must suit the motion of the image. The super-high-speed P4HD categorizes the image motion of each pixel into one of 16 levels, from stationary to super fast. For areas with stationary images, it applies the progressive processing best suited to still images. In other areas it applies processing that matches the degree of motion. The results are stunningly beautiful progressive images with minimum conversion.

Diagonal Processing
The ability to create smooth, sharp diagonal lines is a key in progressive conversion. The P4HD quickly detects diagonals and applies correction to the pixels accordingly. In reproducing the kinds of geometric patterns often seen in architecture, for example, the DMP-BD10 provides exceptionally smooth, sharp diagonal lines whether the image is still or moving.

3:2/2:2 Pull-Down Progressive Processing
The P4HD instantly determines whether a source is film or video and optimizes the processing accordingly. Applying 3:2 or 2:2 pull-down with movie software, it makes images look natural and true to life.

i/p Conversion for 1080p* Playback
The P4HD achieves high-speed, highly precise i/p conversion with Precise Pixel Generation, 16-Level Motion Detection, Diagonal Processing and 3:2/2:2 Pull-Down Processing. This makes it possible to convert 480i and even previously difficult-to-convert 1080i signals to full-HD 1080p images.* HDMI connection required.

Up-Conversion to 1080p* Playback
When playing a BD-Video or DVD disc, the P4HD up-converts content recorded in the 480i/p, 720p or 1080i format to 1080p with Precise Pixel Generation that generates each pixel from 60 Surrounding Pixels of Information. You enjoy superb 1080p-level image quality. * HDMI connection required.

297MHz/14bit Video D/A Converter
DMP-BD10 incorporates a 297MHz, 14bit Video D/A Converter from Analog Devices Co. Ltd. that provides high-quality 4x oversampling for 1080i/720p output. NSV (noise shaping video) processing shifts the noise component to an unused band to further boost the signal-to-noise ratio. And finally, we added extremely fine 14bit signal processing that renders ultra-fine images with smooth gradation. Thanks to technologies like these, the DMP-BD10 can theoretically reproduce up to nearly 4400 billion colours.

It's not totally clear, but scaling with "up to 60 surrounding pixels" suggest a very nice bicubic scaling, and the diagonal staircase smoothing could be great if done right.

[Psiweaver]

Yeah doesn't sound too shoddy though i think i'll go with the Pioneer Elite still.

[JTK]

What about the lossless audio codecs?

Break it down for me real simply: Does Panasonic's promised firmware, combined with the hardware, essentially mean that player is going to be future proof for a bit?