BDs That Are Out of Print (OOP)

[Member-839946]

This looks fine. I bought it from Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Mentiras-Arri.../dp/B089GHS1KM

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

This looks fine. I bought it from Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Mentiras-Arri.../dp/B089GHS1KM

It's a Spanish bootleg. A shockingly huge portion of Spanish BDs are bootlegs. They don't seem to treat copyright the same way there.

[houseca]

Originally Posted by bigdaddyhorse

Abyss and True Lies are coming soon, have been for 20 years!
Same with Peter Jackson's early works, although I think those have only been promised for 15 years.

I'd say lets bet on which happens first, but that is pointless. No one here will be alive to collect if either ever does happen.

Abyss and True lies are cheap on dvd, but are both ancient non-anamorphic transfers. I've seen True Lies in 1080 on cable and it looked nice, so maybe/probably there are "custom" BDs out there. At least the dvds are original widescreen versions.

Regarding The Abyss, There is an open matte 1.33:1 DVD available.... so maybe as good as having an anamorphic widescreen presentation.... depending on how you look at it.

As far as True Lies goes, there is that Spanish release that has been around a while, but is pretty much a bootleg due to the weird licensing laws in Spain. I have it, and I know many others do as well... it's decent PQ:

[Member-839946]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

It's a Spanish bootleg. A shockingly huge portion of Spanish BDs are bootlegs. They don't seem to treat copyright the same way there.

So? It's for sale. It's been for sale for at least a year (when I bought it). Either the rights holders are asleep at the wheel, or it's legal to import, sell and buy. And it looks fine, not like some highly compressed 720p stream rip off of the high seas.

If you like True Lies (and I do), this is a great alternative until Cameron deigns to bless us with his version.

[Nightman04]

Originally Posted by houseca

You should consider upgrading all your favorite VHS to Blu-ray or even 4K. Unless you are into mostly obscure stuff, you should be able to find most readily available on Blu-ray in North America.

Now if you're looking for The Abyss or True Lies, then we have got a problem

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

So? It's for sale. It's been for sale for at least a year (when I bought it). Either the rights holders are asleep at the wheel, or it's legal to import, sell and buy. And it looks fine, not like some highly compressed 720p stream rip off of the high seas.

If you like True Lies (and I do), this is a great alternative until Cameron deigns to bless us with his version.

On top of that, it’s pressed!

[houseca]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

It's a Spanish bootleg. A shockingly huge portion of Spanish BDs are bootlegs. They don't seem to treat copyright the same way there.

Funny how we posted essentially the same thing at the exact same time LOL.

I don't take issue with bootlegs as long as the movie never had a proper release on blu-ray worldwide. The Spanish True Lies, despite being pressed as previously mentioned, is put on my shelf with my other bootlegs. That's the way I see it.

[scififan73]

The Spanish blu ray may indeed be a bootleg, but it remains the best version easily attainable short of having your own film print.
Cameron/Disney can walk the moral high ground and pretend like the film never existed if they like. I'm happy with this release if no uhd never comes. Cameron had first dibs, dropped the ball, so i guess the Spanish bootleggers stand to be the only profiteers on this release.

[noiradelic]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

It's a Spanish bootleg. A shockingly huge portion of Spanish BDs are bootlegs. They don't seem to treat copyright the same way there.

They don't respect music copyrights either.

[bigdaddyhorse]

Originally Posted by houseca

Regarding The Abyss, There is an open matte 1.33:1 DVD available.... so maybe as good as having an anamorphic widescreen presentation.... depending on how you look at it.

I'll keep the non anamorphic widescreen. Looks OK upscaled on my 4K set and my player and/or TV is smart enough to play it in SD mode, so no squish or messing with settings.

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

So? It's for sale. It's been for sale for at least a year (when I bought it). Either the rights holders are asleep at the wheel, or it's legal to import, sell and buy.

I think the continued existence of this disc proves the rights owners could not possibly give half a ****. They know it's never going to get a legit release and are just holding on to their streaming rights. Not sure why Spain hasn't popped out an Abyss boot yet.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

So? It's for sale. It's been for sale for at least a year (when I bought it). Either the rights holders are asleep at the wheel, or it's legal to import, sell and buy. And it looks fine, not like some highly compressed 720p stream rip off of the high seas.

If you like True Lies (and I do), this is a great alternative until Cameron deigns to bless us with his version.

I'm just pointing it out, to those who might not know.

I'm not an anti-bootleg crusader. I know some here are. I've actually had a few come after me for discs I bought without knowing they were bootlegs.

A number of German and (in my experience) a majority of Spanish discs are bootlegs. Just putting the info out there.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by bigdaddyhorse

I think the continued existence of this disc proves the rights owners could not possibly give half a ****. They know it's never going to get a legit release and are just holding on to their streaming rights. Not sure why Spain hasn't popped out an Abyss boot yet.

They probably decided that so few people will buy it that they don't care, and that it would be prohibitively expensive and pointless to sue about it in Spanish courts, where they might not even be able to get a favorable result, for all I know about Spanish law. What this bootleg outfit is doing could be entirely legal in Spain.

[Member-839946]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

They probably decided that so few people will buy it that they don't care, and that it would be prohibitively expensive and pointless to sue about it in Spanish courts, where they might not even be able to get a favorable result, for all I know about Spanish law. What this bootleg outfit is doing could be entirely legal in Spain.

There are sites selling dvd/bluray compilations of tv shows that no one else is selling. I'm new so I don't know if I can post examples, but we've probably all seen them. You know.. the legit looking e-commerce site with the description advertising "with the original as-aired commercials as a bonus!". VHS rip. Those are definitely bootlegs.

But a nice looking package with a decent transfer on a pressed disk that's been on the market.. on Amazon, for years? Someone's (not you. Not talking about you) going to have to present some solid evidence for why this is a bootleg. Sounds more like a "well, it MUST be a bootleg, because Cameron".

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

But a nice looking package with a decent transfer on a pressed disk that's been on the market.. on Amazon, for years? Someone's (not you. Not talking about you) going to have to present some solid evidence for why this is a bootleg. Sounds more like a "well, it MUST be a bootleg, because Cameron".

If you look at the packaging on many Spanish Blu-Rays, there's no small print with copyright information and no studio logo.



This is 1000% a bootleg. (Or at least a disc unlicensed by the rights holder, I'm not sure if it's even technically a bootleg under Spanish law).

There are certainly some legit Spanish releases, but many (if not most) Spanish Blu-Rays are created without the permission of the copyright holder. There are even tons of Spanish discs that are just direct rips of other discs, including Criterion discs.

It's been discussed here a great deal over the years.

Amazon stocks tons of bootlegs, they don't check the copyright status of everything they sell, especially overseas items. I unknowingly bought a bootleg copy of a Hitchcock film on BD from Amazon Germany, sold and shipped by them.

Copyright laws are different from country to country and the strength of enforcement is different from country to country. Spain appears to be a wild west as far as copyright goes.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

If you look at the packaging on many Spanish Blu-Rays, there's no small print with copyright information and no studio logo.



This is 1000% a bootleg. (Or at least a disc unlicensed by the rights holder, I'm not sure if it's even technically a bootleg under Spanish law).

There are certainly some legit Spanish releases, but many (if not most) Spanish Blu-Rays are created without the permission of the copyright holder. There are even tons of Spanish discs that are just direct rips of other discs, including Criterion discs.

It's been discussed here a great deal over the years.

Amazon stocks tons of bootlegs, they don't check the copyright status of everything they sell, especially overseas items. I unknowingly bought a bootleg copy of a Hitchcock film on BD from Amazon Germany, sold and shipped by them.

Copyright laws are different from country to country and the strength of enforcement is different from country to country. Spain appears to be a wild west as far as copyright goes.

Bootleg or not thank you Resen for that one and the Spanish law as well for making it happen!!!!

[Member-839946]

I'd like to make a distinction between "bootleg" as a legal definition, and as an indicator of quality.

I'm unconcerned with the legal status of disc offered for sale in a legit storefront (amazon). People (not saying you are) who reflexively post "That's a bootleg!" as if I'm supposed to not buy it or they'll tell my mom become tiresome.

Now, if I'm warned off of something because "It's a bootleg. It looks like a handheld cell phone video taken in a crowded movie theater with the wrong color balance by a meth addict in withdrawal", then that's useful information.

This may (or may not) be a legal bootleg, but it's a better transfer than some boutique distributors make (you know who you are).

If it is a bootleg, what's the provenance? Stream rip? Because True Lies has never been on HD media, right? So where do the "It's for a sure a bootleg" people suggest it came from?

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by danny24

Bootleg or not thank you Resen for that one and the Spanish law as well!!!!

Yep, when legitimate rights holders sit on their rights for absurdly long times, and deny consumers the ability to buy legit versions, as with this title, they only encourage bootleggers.

I believe someone in the True Lies thread checked the video on the disc and said it's from an HD broadcast version, much like the recent Spanish bootleg of Danny Boyle's The Beach, which is also locked away in the Disney vault.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

I'd like to make a distinction between "bootleg" as a legal definition, and as an indicator of quality.

I'm unconcerned with the legal status of disc offered for sale in a legit storefront (amazon). People (not saying you are) who reflexively post "That's a bootleg!" as if I'm supposed to not buy it or they'll tell my mom become tiresome.

Now, if I'm warned off of something because "It's a bootleg. It looks like a handheld cell phone video taken in a crowded movie theater with the wrong color balance by an meth addict in withdrawal", then that's useful information.

This may (or may not) be a legal bootleg, but it's a better transfer than some boutique distributors make (you know who you are).

If it is a bootleg, what's the provenance? Stream rip? Because True Lies has never been on HD media, right? So where do the "It's for a sure a bootleg" people suggest it came from?

To be clear, I'm not saying this is something someone recorded with a cellphone. I'm sure it looks watchable, from a clear, moderately recent source.

The (pretty lengthy) discussion in the thread for the disc suggested it's from a European HD broadcast:

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=328966

The reason to point out that it's a bootleg is to be aware of any weaknesses, since it's certainly not a brand new transfer approved by James Cameron (which we may never get, in spite of the annual rumors that it's "coming soon.")

Again, technically this may not even be a "bootleg" under Spanish law, but outside Spain, it's certainly a bootleg.

That said, it's far and away the best version available.

[Member-839946]

Thanks for that. Interesting.



As do movies, apparently.

[houseca]

Originally Posted by ReedSolomon

I'd like to make a distinction between "bootleg" as a legal definition, and as an indicator of quality.

I'm unconcerned with the legal status of disc offered for sale in a legit storefront (amazon). People (not saying you are) who reflexively post "That's a bootleg!" as if I'm supposed to not buy it or they'll tell my mom become tiresome.

Now, if I'm warned off of something because "It's a bootleg. It looks like a handheld cell phone video taken in a crowded movie theater with the wrong color balance by a meth addict in withdrawal", then that's useful information.

This may (or may not) be a legal bootleg, but it's a better transfer than some boutique distributors make (you know who you are).

If it is a bootleg, what's the provenance? Stream rip? Because True Lies has never been on HD media, right? So where do the "It's for a sure a bootleg" people suggest it came from?

When I referenced the Spanish release as a "bootleg", I was only referring to it as a legal term. Many care greatly about that and I was just giving others a heads-up. I was not trying to downplay its PQ/AQ. As I mentioned earlier, I own the disc and since it is the best quality available, I am content with it, otherwise I would not keep it in my collection.

I had an HD recording of it a few years ago that I got from HBO or Showtime, and I can say that this quality matches that recording... and that is not a bad thing. Sometimes it's just nice to own a physical copy of something you love, in decent quality. This certainly fits the bill.

[Rzzzz]

Originally Posted by houseca

When I referenced the Spanish release as a "bootleg", I was only referring to it as a legal term. Many care greatly about that and I was just giving others a heads-up. I was not trying to downplay its PQ/AQ. As I mentioned earlier, I own the disc and since it is the best quality available, I am content with it, otherwise I would not keep it in my collection.

I had an HD recording of it a few years ago that I got from HBO or Showtime, and I can say that this quality matches that recording... and that is not a bad thing. Sometimes it's just nice to own a physical copy of something you love, in decent quality. This certainly fits the bill.

I can vouch for everything said here. The picture looks great, the audio is excellent and it has great extras but those are in SD (at least they are on the disc that I have). Even if Cameron never bothers with True Lies, I am set....