The Panasonic DMP-BD10 Review Thread -v. 2.4 Firmware available now- - Blu-ray Forum

GoldenRedux · 10-11-2006, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff®

He added some pictures to the review now.

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/...d.php?t=243666

Not exactly the best pictures in the world there.

Dave · 10-11-2006, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenRedux

Not exactly the best pictures in the world there.

What is wrong with the pics?

GoldenRedux · 10-11-2006, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave

What is wrong with the pics?

Well, the pictures of the unit itself are so dark no details can be made out of them. The pictures of the menus looks alright. Obviously, taking pictures of a television screen to show the playback isn't exactly the greatest way to judge anything either, but I appreciate his effort.

I think there was a thread on here where someone posted links to pics of the Panny (pre-releases) that were much better.

GoldenRedux · 10-11-2006, 05:45 PM

More good news about the audio quality of the Panny:

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/...6&postcount=31

I think that seals it for me.

Josh · 10-11-2006, 07:08 PM

Another review saying Panny > Sammy:

Quote:

Picture quality. I read the 1st review and I can tell you between this review and several other reviews of movies and the picture quality I have lost all respect for these reviewers. They are either being paid off, blind or have no idea what is going on. This along with using displays that are not even capable of producing the image resolutions needed. I can say that the Panasonic displays a great picture, better than the Samsung.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post8633499

bferr1 · 10-13-2006, 03:21 PM

Okay, first impressions: player is a beauty out of the box. The remote is definitely not the greatest, though. The menu arrow pad doubles as a jog-shuttle dial, reminding me of an iPod. Jog-shuttle can be disabled in the setup menu. Boot and load time seems a bit slower than the August-built Samsung I had (which might itself be faster than the launch players), but definitely faster than the Toshiba. I found that the player is prone to some of the same HDMI handshake wackiness as the Toshiba, although nowhere near as jarring. The Samsung is better in this regard because with my set-up, I can switch to another source and not lose the HDMI connection with the Samsung. With the Toshiba and the Panasonic, I lose that connection. The Toshiba stops playback immediately and there is no resume play, which sucks big-time. The Panasonic continues playback when you switch sources away from it, but stops playback when you come back to it. Luckily, though, it DOES have resume play, making the player better than the Tosh in this regard. (Receiver, BTW, is a Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS.)

Setup menus are pretty simple to use and navigate through. I like that you can set up DD, DD+ and DTS independently from each other, unlike the Samsung with its global audio output setting. Unlike the Samsung, PCM can be output as multichannel PCM, even though the player may be set for bitstream. (You don't have to go into the settings and change output to PCM in order to hear it like you do with the Samsung.) Unlike the Samsung, with its colored dots or hourglass, a simple message pops up "Now loading," which can be disabled. Also unlike the Samsung, 4:3 material can be setup to pillarbox or zoom automatically. And lastly, unlike the Samsung, the blue light on the front panel can be turned off by setting the display to "dim." Nice. (Believe me, dim is still pretty bright, especially in a dark room. Bright setting is ridiculously bright, and you'll want to turn that down.)

(And Chris, I didn't see anywhere a display for video codec. Sorry!)

With the Samsung, the resolution of the player would sometimes change alternately between 1080p and 1080i during the handshake process, probably because of some weirdness with EDID and being passed through my receiver. I could never figure out why exactly. It's almost as if an auto resolution setting was overriding whatever choice I made in the setup menu, except that the Sammy doesn't have an auto setting. I like that the Panasonic has that auto setting, but also offers a manual selection. I can set my resolution manually and never have to worry about it switching on its own again. Nice!

Now for the good stuff: PQ. I have a Samsung HL-S6187 1080p DLP, and I'm sitting about 10-11 feet back. Previously, I thought I had a modded Samsung player with NR chip off because I swore I had better PQ over the launch player I tried. (I also had the colored dots and 4:3 pillarbox rather than the launch player's hourglass and 4:3 stretch.) I'm pretty sure now that the player I thought had improved PQ, in fact, doesn't. The Panasonic made Underworld:Evolution and even Lord of War pop with a crisp, super-detailed picture. It definitely felt like the PQ we were all expecting back in June. Extremely pleased. I also tried Corpse Bride, and immediately noticed the infamous posterization on the Warner Bros. logo was diminished substantially. There was still some posterization on the end fade out, but definitely an improvement over the Samsung. Tears of the Sun looked even more razor-sharp than before, if you can believe it. On Good Night and Good Luck, a weird peculiarity. With the Samsung, I had no menu selection highlight on the special features page, and every time I made a move with the remote, I'd get the red stop symbol. No such problems with the Panasonic, to my relief. Generally, I felt that PQ was improved over the Sammy-- not a huge, earth-shattering difference, but I'd really like to see if Peter Bracke and other critics feel compelled to reevaluate their PQ criticisms and revise their scores slightly upward as a result of this player.

One thing I don't feel comfortable commenting on is noise or grain levels, as I don't always expect a super-clean image like Revenge of the Sith or Chronicle of Riddick. I am much more concerned about apparent detail in the image, and I feel that there is definitely more detail in the Panasonic's image than the Samsung's. (And if you're a Samsung owner, don't fret. Just get that firmware upgraded!)

Another area I'm not comfortable commenting on is audio. I just don't think I have as discerning an ear as others. To me, DD and DTS are more than adequate, and they sound great on this player. I've spent time bouncing between DD+ and DTHD on some HD DVDs and cannot for the life of me hear any difference. And although PCM sounds great, there seems to be some deep bass missing on Underworld:Evolution in Marcus' voice when he interrogates Kraven that's definitely there on the DD track. I noticed the same thing on the Sammy. I understand the idea of lossless codecs and why that is more desirable in theory, but I guess practical benefits of lossless audio is one of those areas where YMMV, depending on your equipment, type of connection, hearing ability, etc. I am sending away for the DTHD and DTS-HD firmware upgrade, but if I never knew about it, I doubt I'd miss it.

In the box, there's a mail-in card for that firmware upgrade, another sheet of paper directing you to a Panasonic website for BD-J firmware download (which I haven't looked for yet), an extended warranty offer that I will look into, a free copy of Eight Below which shockingly looked and sounded amazing, and the offer for Great Raid and Gone in 60 Seconds. The Disney offer can be completed online with the player's serial number, and the card claims one week delivery. We'll see.

All in all, an improvement over the Samsung and a step in the right direction. Yes, it's pricey, but if you shop around or wait for 12% coupons from BB, like I did, you definitely won't regret it.

In hindsight, I'd have to say the June launch was a bit of a stop-gap or a dry run. With this player and the Sony and Sharp players due later this month, as well as the PS3 and the coming of the BD50, this format war is officially on. Blu-Ray has finally shown up in numbers-- better late than never.

Chris Beveridge · 10-13-2006, 04:25 PM

Thanks for the thoughts and the confirm. If I knew whether the Sony would display codecs or not, I'd be able to make a decision now of what to buy.

The June launch has been talked about as a stopgap measure in a number of circles and it's pretty apparent based on software alone. Sony didn't have that much really ready or many players to test it against and the lack of product from other distributors besides lionsgate for awhile kept the idea that Q4 is where it will all really begin.

It can be called "moving the goalpost", but in the long run - or hell, by january - this past June will not be a memory for me anymore. I'll have a choice of a number of solid players and lots of great looking software.

I do hope that HD Digest does go back and re-evaluate with the Panny though; they did it for HD DVD when the TrueHD upgrade came out. They should do it with a better player here.

10-13-2006, 03:21 PM	#6
bferr1 Banned Member since:Sep 2006 Location:MA Trading Score:18	My Panny review, initial impressions Okay, first impressions: player is a beauty out of the box. The remote is definitely not the greatest, though. The menu arrow pad doubles as a jog-shuttle dial, reminding me of an iPod. Jog-shuttle can be disabled in the setup menu. Boot and load time seems a bit slower than the August-built Samsung I had (which might itself be faster than the launch players), but definitely faster than the Toshiba. I found that the player is prone to some of the same HDMI handshake wackiness as the Toshiba, although nowhere near as jarring. The Samsung is better in this regard because with my set-up, I can switch to another source and not lose the HDMI connection with the Samsung. With the Toshiba and the Panasonic, I lose that connection. The Toshiba stops playback immediately and there is no resume play, which sucks big-time. The Panasonic continues playback when you switch sources away from it, but stops playback when you come back to it. Luckily, though, it DOES have resume play, making the player better than the Tosh in this regard. (Receiver, BTW, is a Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS.) Setup menus are pretty simple to use and navigate through. I like that you can set up DD, DD+ and DTS independently from each other, unlike the Samsung with its global audio output setting. Unlike the Samsung, PCM can be output as multichannel PCM, even though the player may be set for bitstream. (You don't have to go into the settings and change output to PCM in order to hear it like you do with the Samsung.) Unlike the Samsung, with its colored dots or hourglass, a simple message pops up "Now loading," which can be disabled. Also unlike the Samsung, 4:3 material can be setup to pillarbox or zoom automatically. And lastly, unlike the Samsung, the blue light on the front panel can be turned off by setting the display to "dim." Nice. (Believe me, dim is still pretty bright, especially in a dark room. Bright setting is ridiculously bright, and you'll want to turn that down.) (And Chris, I didn't see anywhere a display for video codec. Sorry!) With the Samsung, the resolution of the player would sometimes change alternately between 1080p and 1080i during the handshake process, probably because of some weirdness with EDID and being passed through my receiver. I could never figure out why exactly. It's almost as if an auto resolution setting was overriding whatever choice I made in the setup menu, except that the Sammy doesn't have an auto setting. I like that the Panasonic has that auto setting, but also offers a manual selection. I can set my resolution manually and never have to worry about it switching on its own again. Nice! Now for the good stuff: PQ. I have a Samsung HL-S6187 1080p DLP, and I'm sitting about 10-11 feet back. Previously, I thought I had a modded Samsung player with NR chip off because I swore I had better PQ over the launch player I tried. (I also had the colored dots and 4:3 pillarbox rather than the launch player's hourglass and 4:3 stretch.) I'm pretty sure now that the player I thought had improved PQ, in fact, doesn't. The Panasonic made Underworld:Evolution and even Lord of War pop with a crisp, super-detailed picture. It definitely felt like the PQ we were all expecting back in June. Extremely pleased. I also tried Corpse Bride, and immediately noticed the infamous posterization on the Warner Bros. logo was diminished substantially. There was still some posterization on the end fade out, but definitely an improvement over the Samsung. Tears of the Sun looked even more razor-sharp than before, if you can believe it. On Good Night and Good Luck, a weird peculiarity. With the Samsung, I had no menu selection highlight on the special features page, and every time I made a move with the remote, I'd get the red stop symbol. No such problems with the Panasonic, to my relief. Generally, I felt that PQ was improved over the Sammy-- not a huge, earth-shattering difference, but I'd really like to see if Peter Bracke and other critics feel compelled to reevaluate their PQ criticisms and revise their scores slightly upward as a result of this player. One thing I don't feel comfortable commenting on is noise or grain levels, as I don't always expect a super-clean image like Revenge of the Sith or Chronicle of Riddick. I am much more concerned about apparent detail in the image, and I feel that there is definitely more detail in the Panasonic's image than the Samsung's. (And if you're a Samsung owner, don't fret. Just get that firmware upgraded!) Another area I'm not comfortable commenting on is audio. I just don't think I have as discerning an ear as others. To me, DD and DTS are more than adequate, and they sound great on this player. I've spent time bouncing between DD+ and DTHD on some HD DVDs and cannot for the life of me hear any difference. And although PCM sounds great, there seems to be some deep bass missing on Underworld:Evolution in Marcus' voice when he interrogates Kraven that's definitely there on the DD track. I noticed the same thing on the Sammy. I understand the idea of lossless codecs and why that is more desirable in theory, but I guess practical benefits of lossless audio is one of those areas where YMMV, depending on your equipment, type of connection, hearing ability, etc. I am sending away for the DTHD and DTS-HD firmware upgrade, but if I never knew about it, I doubt I'd miss it. In the box, there's a mail-in card for that firmware upgrade, another sheet of paper directing you to a Panasonic website for BD-J firmware download (which I haven't looked for yet), an extended warranty offer that I will look into, a free copy of Eight Below which shockingly looked and sounded amazing, and the offer for Great Raid and Gone in 60 Seconds. The Disney offer can be completed online with the player's serial number, and the card claims one week delivery. We'll see. All in all, an improvement over the Samsung and a step in the right direction. Yes, it's pricey, but if you shop around or wait for 12% coupons from BB, like I did, you definitely won't regret it. In hindsight, I'd have to say the June launch was a bit of a stop-gap or a dry run. With this player and the Sony and Sharp players due later this month, as well as the PS3 and the coming of the BD50, this format war is officially on. Blu-Ray has finally shown up in numbers-- better late than never.

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10-11-2006, 05:45 PM	#4
GoldenRedux Power Member Member since:Sep 2006 Blu-ray reviews:1	More good news about the audio quality of the Panny: http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/...6&postcount=31 I think that seals it for me.

10-13-2006, 04:25 PM	#7
Chris Beveridge Moderator Member since:Sep 2006 Location:Hudson, MA Blu-ray reviews:3	Thanks for the thoughts and the confirm. If I knew whether the Sony would display codecs or not, I'd be able to make a decision now of what to buy. The June launch has been talked about as a stopgap measure in a number of circles and it's pretty apparent based on software alone. Sony didn't have that much really ready or many players to test it against and the lack of product from other distributors besides lionsgate for awhile kept the idea that Q4 is where it will all really begin. It can be called "moving the goalpost", but in the long run - or hell, by january - this past June will not be a memory for me anymore. I'll have a choice of a number of solid players and lots of great looking software. I do hope that HD Digest does go back and re-evaluate with the Panny though; they did it for HD DVD when the TrueHD upgrade came out. They should do it with a better player here.

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