The Fantastic Four: First Steps (2025)

[BluBonnet]

[50strat54]

Originally Posted by MWF6425

I haven't read the comics in years, but I liked the altered '60s vibe as well. I haven't seen "Thunderbolts" yet, but I'm looking forward to it. As for comparing "First Steps" to "Superman", I think that's inherently unfair. They're two entirely different stories, with separate characters and motivations. But I adore them both on their own merits, just the same.

I wasn’t comparing, I was just stating which movie I liked better by rating them which we do here all the time. Notice I wrote “not for me,” maybe should have wrote “in my opinion.”

But Superman 2025 also had a 60s vibe, it reminded me of DC Comics in the mid-60s as evidenced by having Krypro in the film and I still enjoyed a lot of the movie. More parts made me cringe while I never cringed during First Steps.

[50strat54]

Originally Posted by MWF6425

I haven't seen "WandaVision" yet, and I don't recall having a tough time understanding "Multiverse of Madness".

I don't know if that wink means you're joking, but either way I honestly don't understand people who are serious about dismissing hope and a desire for peace, in favor of the "old routine" that's just constant depression and noise. Narratives of all kinds have made us want to be better for centuries if not longer, and movies are just the latest way of conveying that.

So I’m guessing you probably wouldn’t like House of Sand and Fog or The Grifters. My friend absolutely despises The Grifters. I love both films A LOT. House of Sand and Fog though is really really really and I mean really depressing.

Also they are all scum in To Live and Die in LA, another big fave of mine.

No hope, worst behavior by human beings, great films.

[50strat54]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Superman sold less tickets than Man of Steel. F4 will sell roughly the same amount of tickets as the 2005 film. The genre needs a reset. It's like the mid to late 90's, when DC and Marvel ran the comic industry into the ground by oversaturating the market.

If true, this makes the petty side of me smile (a little bit, maybe a lot) given all the posts putting down the FF 2005/2007 films.

Makes it seem like the general buying public was willing to spend the same amount of money for the 3 films and liked all three films about the same.

Not talking about comic book book nerds/collectors and members of this forum.

We’ll see the final numbers once First Steps hits streaming.

[Star Lord]

My intro to F4. The 2000s movies were mid and never got me interested in the team like this comic did.

[BluBonnet]

It's not easy catching up with 60 years' worth of adventures, but this video does a pretty good job for the uninitiated.

It's from Marvel Entertainment, so it seems pretty official!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZBgbT_jtmQ

[saxomaphone]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

[Show spoiler]

I like these better.

[50strat54]

I hope that doc above is included in the 4K package.

[CreasyBear]

Originally Posted by 50strat54

If true, this makes the petty side of me smile (a little bit, maybe a lot) given all the posts putting down the FF 2005/2007 films.

Makes it seem like the general buying public was willing to spend the same amount of money for the 3 films and liked all three films about the same.

Not talking about comic book book nerds/collectors and members of this forum.

We’ll see the final numbers once First Steps hits streaming.

Adjusted, F4 (2005) would be at around $272 million, which is about where the 2025 film is going to top out at. Nothing was gained, but a lot more money was spent to get the same result.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Adjusted, F4 (2005) would be at around $272 million, which is about where the 2025 film is going to top out at. Nothing was gained, but a lot more money was spent to get the same result.

2 problems with that premise:

1. This movie is integral to setting up stuff that happens in the next 2 Avengers movies AND Phase 7 stuff - movies that are going to make billions. The older movies didn’t set anything up.

2. You also need to count merch sales plus the net positive of having these characters in Disney Parks, which helps theme park revenue.

[50strat54]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

2 problems with that premise:

1. This movie is integral to setting up stuff that happens in the next 2 Avengers movies AND Phase 7 stuff - movies that are going to make billions. The older movies didn’t set anything up.

2. You also need to count merch sales plus the net positive of having these characters in Disney Parks, which helps theme park revenue.

Oh yeah, right. Forgot about all of those incidentals.

The first MCU was a continuing build from Iron Man, success kept building on success until Infinity War and Endgame.

This new MCU phase is beginning with films that have had disappointing box office. Marvel fired a key actor and had to revamp the storyline. Bye bye Kang. It’s starting to look like even First Steps won’t be a rebound in terms of box office.

But love your optimism!

Live action Little Mermaid was actually a mega blockbuster with all of the tie-in merchandise it sold, Disney Parks tie-ins and setting up for live action Little Mermaid 2!

But I’m glad you’re back BluBonnet!

[Stanis]

No we don't need to count "setting up" other movies or merch sales whether a movie has succeeded or not at the box office. It's pretty simple math, despite all the negging trolls and positive trolls. Neither Supes or FF2025 were a smash hit, they were well received by audiences and critics but they didn't set records, they treaded water.

Narratively I ended up wishing F4 did more and Superman did less (but liked Supes a hair more, which suprised me). Am looking forward to Lobo (not supergirl) and Doom of course. Doom was slighted the hardest in the older adaptations.

[mwynn]

[Show spoiler]

Originally Posted by saxomaphone

I like these better.

How close would Isreal be to Isfake?

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by Stanis

No we don't need to count "setting up" other movies or merch sales whether a movie has succeeded or not at the box office. It's pretty simple math, despite all the negging trolls and positive trolls. Neither Supes or FF2025 were a smash hit, they were well received by audiences and critics but they didn't set records, they treaded water.

Narratively I ended up wishing F4 did more and Superman did less (but liked Supes a hair more, which suprised me). Am looking forward to Lobo (not supergirl) and Doom of course. Doom was slighted the hardest in the older adaptations.

This is why discussing box office is a waste if you are outside of the studio. There is now market penetration through social media interactions that makes them money. There is the merchandise, there are tax breaks and incentives. Studios can now get a 35% tax credit for filming in California.

Ant and the Wasp Quantumania did not light up the box office, yet it still made a profit because of tax breaks. There are movies that could total bomb at the box office yet make a profit off of ancillary sells.

Movie box office is no different then stats in sports, as people try to figure out how a team that had good stats and lost the game while nit watching the game.

[MWF6425]

Originally Posted by 50strat54

So I’m guessing you probably wouldn’t like House of Sand and Fog or The Grifters. My friend absolutely despises The Grifters. I love both films A LOT. House of Sand and Fog though is really really really and I mean really depressing.

Also they are all scum in To Live and Die in LA, another big fave of mine.

No hope, worst behavior by human beings, great films.

I already have far too much despair and conflict in my life - I don't enjoy films that remind me of it.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by mwynn

[Show spoiler]This is why discussing box office is a waste if you are outside of the studio. There is now market penetration through social media interactions that makes them money. There is the merchandise, there are tax breaks and incentives. Studios can now get a 35% tax credit for filming in California.

Ant and the Wasp Quantumania did not light up the box office, yet it still made a profit because of tax breaks. There are movies that could total bomb at the box office yet make a profit off of ancillary sells.

Movie box office is no different then stats in sports, as people try to figure out how a team that had good stats and lost the game while nit watching the game.

One thing that’s still undeniable, tho, is that the MCU is the highest-grossing franchise of all time.

You yourself posted the latest total, I think it’s now up to $32 billion or whatever.

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

One thing that’s still undeniable, tho, is that the MCU is the highest-grossing franchise of all time.

You yourself posted the latest total, I think it’s now up to $32 billion or whatever.

Yeah and Spider-man passed Star Wars. That is just Box Office. Imagine the tally with everything else included.

[Maryona]

As with Superman, these films are way too many now for the general public to leave everything and catch them in this slow economy. Jurassic and F1 are more casual fun.

[starmike]

Originally Posted by mwynn

This is why discussing box office is a waste if you are outside of the studio.

This is 100% true, but what other metrics are there? You can't ask everyone "hey, you gonna see this movie or wait for streaming?". That didn't exist until recently, so it's no surprise that ANY film drops off nowadays. Superman should be doing 2-3x what it's doing now, and FF should also. The international market dried up for CBMs, so how do you talk about anything? I bring up inflation because I think it's important to not compare $7 tickets to $16.50 tickets, but unless you can poll the planet of what their intentions are, box office is all that's left, and even that's not accurate in terms of eyeballs long-term.

Even streaming is a bad metric because there could be 1 person in a room, or 8 or 10 or 20 people in a backyard theater.

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by starmike

This is 100% true, but what other metrics are there?

Ticket sales is probably the easiest option. Though that again is not 100% accurate. What is the overall entertainment value in the box office if no one can 100% say what a movies is making. The number are pretty much worthless unless you can see the books. With sports at least there is a fantasy part or now the gambling. The fact that there is no true source for the Box office is preventing Vegas from allowing betting on it. If no one has figured out how to make money on it, you know it is not accurate.