The Fountain!!!!!

[Q?]

Originally Posted by Lord_Stewie

Thanks Q.

[Show spoiler]Now I am more confused.

lol Shad...
My structuring is really messy
I hope people actually understand what I'm trying to say

I've updated my take on the whole thing, makes a little more sense

[Lord_Stewie]

Originally Posted by Q!

lol Shad...
My structuring is really messy
I hope people actually understand what I'm trying to say

Well I know that the movie is about past, present and the future. And Hugh Jackman's character is trying to save the woman he loves in all three different times however, I don't understand the SIGNIFICANCE of that tree in all three different times.

[jhiggy23]

I've written almost 20 pages about the film, as it is my favorite, with the intent to add it into my (delayed) forthcoming book. Here is the link to a shortened version of my analysis, as well as some other analyses for your perusal Czar:


https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ountain&page=4



What I love about the film is that everyone takes something different away from it. I state, quite presumptively, that there is only one true analysis based on the facts and scenes set forth. However, I love hearing other ppl's takes on the film even if they aren't supported by the film, because when it comes down to it all that matters is what the film means to you personally.

[F-Man]

Q, your analysis although short helped me notice many comparisons that I didn't catch before! And they all make perfect connect-the-dots sense.

Like the invasion being Izzy's cancer, Tommy breaking out of his bubble meaning accepting death (I knew it was the moment he did, but going out of the bubble finally makes sense), Xibalba being the cure he's researching (I already knew about the tree of life in the past also being it obviously), his failed attempt with the elixir of life representing the greed that he has by searching a way to cure death.

And yes, you are also absolutely correct about him finishing the book representing coming to terms with death and accepting what he should have done instead of fighting it. In fact, I believe that the ending of the book is not the future scenes, but the one where he tastes the elixir, emphasizing even more how he has finally understood that trying to cure death was greedy. This is shown in the film as just after Future Tom accepts to finish the book (about time, after 500 years), the camera zooms to his head and we cut back to the Spanish setting, showing that he is finishing the book in his head.

Great film by the way! Aronofsky is one of the present Great Directors.

[Q?]

F-man thank you and great post

But after reading Jhiggy23's take, although almost the same I find it making sense more. here it is for you guys.

[Show spoiler]Interpretation: I have no problem with the essay written to Ebert regarding the conquistador and present day storylines. It's readily apparent that the conquistator storyline was written by Izzi up until the little entryway where Tomas meets the Mayan priest. When Izzi dies, Tommy finishes the story for her, with Tomas drinking the sap and being overtaken by flowers, etc. Yes, I know that people will say that he continued the story and that the future timeline is really the end of the book. I understand that the evidence to support this notion includes Izzi saying on the snowy rooftop that the story "ends there" and that Tommy's motivation in writing that as an ending would be him living forever with Izzi in Xibalba. I also know that I probably just convinced many people that my following argument is wrong because of these two facts, but let me continue.

What is the predominant theme of the movie? The main theme of the movie is that we cannot stop death from occurring. Because of this, we must live every moment to the fullest and really do our best to appreciate the time we have. When Izzi was sick, all Tommy did was try to find a cure to prevent her from dying (an example would be when he left bed in the middle of the nite). In doing so, he missed out on the few moments he had left with Izzi while she was alive (remember also that he found some sort of cure right when she died). So, before she dies she asks him to finish the story for her. What was that story about? The conquistador story was meant to be a direct representation of Tommy in real life. The Inquisator (death) was closing in on Queen Isabella but Tommy leaves her to go search for a way to prolong her life (Tree of Life). This is exactly what happened in real life. That being the case, it is likely that Tommy would realize his fault and atone for it by killing off the greedy Tomas (who tried to live forever by drinking the sap) at the end of the book, thus showing that no one can really live forever and that we have to enjoy the time we have with the people we love. A further example of this theme is when Tommy puts the seed near the grave of Izzi. In doing so, he knows that the seed will turn into a tree and in that it will hypothetically live forever, like the Tree of Life. Humans, however, will not.

Now, the astronaut/future timeline. This would take way too much space to really get into, but what I found it to be was Tommy's mind/feelings. At a glance, I'm sure that seems ridiculous and confusing. However, do not judge it until you watch the film from that perspective. Evidence: when Izzi dies the scene cuts to the future with the tree dying (the whole time the tree represented Izzi, which was pretty easy to see). When Tommy tattoos his finger it cuts to the future with all the tattoos on his arms and him saying "all these years, etc." This is meant to show all the times that he missed out on being with his wife, instead trying to find ways to prevent her from dying. The ending when the bubble reaches Xibalba is an epiphany for him, and the scene cuts to him at the grave with the aforementioned seed. This is his realization that it is the time we have with people that matters, and that we should enjoy life instead of trying to prolong it. Another example would be when he is practicing tai chi. This scene comes at a time when he is at peace at work. Another would be when he is eating little pieces from the tree (Izzi), which is representative of Izzi dying a little bit each day and his contributing to it (not showing her love by being there with her). There are many more examples throughout the film.

To combat the notion that it is really the ending that he wrote for Izzi's story, I give you the following: let's assume it really is the ending. That would mean that Tomas did not really die and that the story went right to him in the future with the bubble on the way to Xibalba. What would the point of this be? Remember that Tommy finished the book after Izzi died. At this time he surely realized that he should have spent time with her instead of finding ways for her to stay alive. By having the story end with him finding a way to live forever and make it to Xibalba, it would show that Tommy really learned nothing from Izzi's death and that there is no moral, theme, or redemption in the film. To me, that would not make sense. Now, the small things: why would the future Tommy have tattoos if the story went directly from the conquistador to the astronaut (remember that the present day story was real, not part of the story, as evidenced by Izzi asking him to finish ONLY the last chapter)? Why would present day Izzi appear to future Tommy a few times, including with the hospital bed (which corresponds to the time that Tommy was with her at the hospital)? Etc. Thus, thematically it would not make sense, and the evidence does not support it.

There is obvious a lot more to my analysis, but I think what I provided is enough to prove my theory. At the very least, I think that watching the movie through this lens can prove just how beautiful of a film it is.

In conclusion:

Conquistador: Izzi's story up until meeting with Mayan priest. Tommy continuing and ending story with Tomas dying after drinking the sap.

Present Day: Real life storyline

Future/Astronaut: Tommy's mind/feelings

Great post Jhiggy
It's almost the same as F-mans take isn't it?

[jhiggy23]

Originally Posted by Q!

F-man thank you and great post

But after reading Jhiggy23's take, although almost the same I find it making sense more. here it is for you guys.

[Show spoiler]Interpretation: I have no problem with the essay written to Ebert regarding the conquistador and present day storylines. It's readily apparent that the conquistator storyline was written by Izzi up until the little entryway where Tomas meets the Mayan priest. When Izzi dies, Tommy finishes the story for her, with Tomas drinking the sap and being overtaken by flowers, etc. Yes, I know that people will say that he continued the story and that the future timeline is really the end of the book. I understand that the evidence to support this notion includes Izzi saying on the snowy rooftop that the story "ends there" and that Tommy's motivation in writing that as an ending would be him living forever with Izzi in Xibalba. I also know that I probably just convinced many people that my following argument is wrong because of these two facts, but let me continue.

What is the predominant theme of the movie? The main theme of the movie is that we cannot stop death from occurring. Because of this, we must live every moment to the fullest and really do our best to appreciate the time we have. When Izzi was sick, all Tommy did was try to find a cure to prevent her from dying (an example would be when he left bed in the middle of the nite). In doing so, he missed out on the few moments he had left with Izzi while she was alive (remember also that he found some sort of cure right when she died). So, before she dies she asks him to finish the story for her. What was that story about? The conquistador story was meant to be a direct representation of Tommy in real life. The Inquisator (death) was closing in on Queen Isabella but Tommy leaves her to go search for a way to prolong her life (Tree of Life). This is exactly what happened in real life. That being the case, it is likely that Tommy would realize his fault and atone for it by killing off the greedy Tomas (who tried to live forever by drinking the sap) at the end of the book, thus showing that no one can really live forever and that we have to enjoy the time we have with the people we love. A further example of this theme is when Tommy puts the seed near the grave of Izzi. In doing so, he knows that the seed will turn into a tree and in that it will hypothetically live forever, like the Tree of Life. Humans, however, will not.

Now, the astronaut/future timeline. This would take way too much space to really get into, but what I found it to be was Tommy's mind/feelings. At a glance, I'm sure that seems ridiculous and confusing. However, do not judge it until you watch the film from that perspective. Evidence: when Izzi dies the scene cuts to the future with the tree dying (the whole time the tree represented Izzi, which was pretty easy to see). When Tommy tattoos his finger it cuts to the future with all the tattoos on his arms and him saying "all these years, etc." This is meant to show all the times that he missed out on being with his wife, instead trying to find ways to prevent her from dying. The ending when the bubble reaches Xibalba is an epiphany for him, and the scene cuts to him at the grave with the aforementioned seed. This is his realization that it is the time we have with people that matters, and that we should enjoy life instead of trying to prolong it. Another example would be when he is practicing tai chi. This scene comes at a time when he is at peace at work. Another would be when he is eating little pieces from the tree (Izzi), which is representative of Izzi dying a little bit each day and his contributing to it (not showing her love by being there with her). There are many more examples throughout the film.

To combat the notion that it is really the ending that he wrote for Izzi's story, I give you the following: let's assume it really is the ending. That would mean that Tomas did not really die and that the story went right to him in the future with the bubble on the way to Xibalba. What would the point of this be? Remember that Tommy finished the book after Izzi died. At this time he surely realized that he should have spent time with her instead of finding ways for her to stay alive. By having the story end with him finding a way to live forever and make it to Xibalba, it would show that Tommy really learned nothing from Izzi's death and that there is no moral, theme, or redemption in the film. To me, that would not make sense. Now, the small things: why would the future Tommy have tattoos if the story went directly from the conquistador to the astronaut (remember that the present day story was real, not part of the story, as evidenced by Izzi asking him to finish ONLY the last chapter)? Why would present day Izzi appear to future Tommy a few times, including with the hospital bed (which corresponds to the time that Tommy was with her at the hospital)? Etc. Thus, thematically it would not make sense, and the evidence does not support it.

There is obvious a lot more to my analysis, but I think what I provided is enough to prove my theory. At the very least, I think that watching the movie through this lens can prove just how beautiful of a film it is.

In conclusion:

Conquistador: Izzi's story up until meeting with Mayan priest. Tommy continuing and ending story with Tomas dying after drinking the sap.

Present Day: Real life storyline

Future/Astronaut: Tommy's mind/feelings

Great post Jhiggy
It's almost the same as F-mans take isn't it?

That's kind of you to say, Q.

[assydingo]

It seems people try too hard to understand movies like this and wind up frustrated. You should not reasonably expect to understand this movie in one viewing.

There was a lot I didn't pick up on. Like when he cuts small pieces off the tree it symbolizes him hurting his wife by not being with her when she's dying. I didn't even realize the Mayan with the flaming sword was meant to symbolize the angel with a flaming sword in the bible who kept Adam & Eve out of Eden after they sinned.

It's a movie that seems beautiful the first time but the road to awe is in repeat viewings.