Lord of the Rings Trilogy (Theatrical Versions) - April 6, 2010

[captveg]

Originally Posted by 42041

That's the VERY PROBLEM. The HDTV broadcasts never looked very good.

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride.

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

For anyone saying these look "identical", you either have eye or monitor issues or both........

Practically identical. As in slight, but ultimately insignificant differences. As in .0001% of the potential buyers of this release will be able to see it and/or give a damn. As in practically negligible to the point of the studios - and Peter Jackson and the film's producers themselves, who I know for a fact approved this release - don't care one bit, because they signed off on it.

The problem, in my view (which I know has been the view of the studios for years now) is that these forums have gone from constructive criticism to fanatical impracticality on 99% of their complaints. They may read these boards, but trust me - they roll their eyes constantly.

[Blu-Benny]

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

Anyone see these comparisons? Click on the links, let the pic fully load, and run your cursor over the pic to see how much better a HDTV broadcast with a lower bitrate looks.


http://comparescreenshots.slicx.com/comparison/43821

http://comparescreenshots.slicx.com/comparison/43820

http://comparescreenshots.slicx.com/comparison/43823

http://comparescreenshots.slicx.com/comparison/43824

when the mouse isn't on the pic, it's the blu right?? when the mouse is on the pic, it's the hdtv broadcast??

and i haven't been keeping up w/the thread so is this another gladiator debacle???

[DetroitSportsFan]

Originally Posted by Brodo Faggins

Anyone else thinking of ditching the cases and putting the discs in the DVD EE cases?

[42041]

Originally Posted by captveg

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride.

"deal with it" would be a compelling argument for the Clerks blu-ray.

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by captveg

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride.



Practically identical. As in slight, but ultimately insignificant differences. As in .0001% of the potential buyers of this release will be able to see it and/or give a damn. As in practically negligible to the point of the studios - and Peter Jackson and the film's producers themselves, who I know for a fact approved this release - don't care one bit, because they signed off on it.

The problem, in my view (which I know has been the view of the studios for years now) is that these forums have gone from constructive criticism to fanatical impracticality on 99% of their complaints. They may read these boards, but trust me - they roll their eyes constantly.

I STRONGLY disagree and we can just agree to disagree............not even CLOSE to identical...........just look at the comparison grabs and watch all the detail get sucked out of Bilbos face on the blu ray.............****ing horrible The blu ray at absolute worst should show even a slight improvement, but it actually looses detail...............

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by Blu-Benny

when the mouse isn't on the pic, it's the blu right?? when the mouse is on the pic, it's the hdtv broadcast??

and i haven't been keeping up w/the thread so is this another gladiator debacle???

Correct.

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by captveg

Personally, I think you guys are insanely picky, to the point of absurdity. Those comparison screengrabs between the HD broadcast and the BD on avsforum look practically identical, save slight color timing difference.

Complaining about such minute "problems" - and I laugh outright in hysterics over calling this transfer a problem - will fall on completely deaf ears at ANY studio. All this does is make the studios less willing to listen when there is a a legitimate issue (Fifth Element, Gangs of New York, Gladiator).

That's all I have to say about the matter. You may now continue with your mental masturbation....

Even if they were identical (and they aren't, the DNR is very blatant - but regardless,) that would still be a huge problem.

That HDTV broadcast is old - it's from the old master.

There's no way in Hell new BluRay releases should be "identical" to old HDTV broadcasts, let alone worse.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

I STRONGLY disagree and we can just agree to disagree............not even CLOSE to identical...........just look at the comparison grabs and watch all the detail get sucked out of Bilbos face on the blu ray.............****ing horrible

Fair enough.

I would recommend contacting Peter Jackson to inform him of how you strongly disagree with the product he approved. Just don't be surprised when he also rolls his eyes....

[Brodo Faggins]

Do people really need to get so worked-up and emotional over things like this?

[Maggot]

All this commotion over the Blu-ray and HDTV shots. For me, both look equally as bad and only offer further proof that these films, in particular the first one, not only need a new, serious transfer, but demand it. Certainly they are going to look better than DVD, nobody denies that......but it is clear from what we have seen over the years from numerous fine Blu-ray transfers of various movies young and old, is that Warner's treatment of these movies boarders on contempt. Add to that their rather poor track record for just about anything that isn't a 50+ year old classic and there you have it.

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by captveg

Fair enough. I would recommend contacting Peter Jackson to inform him of how you strongly disagree with the product he approved. Just don't be surprised when he rolls his eyes.

I wish somebody would...........obviously, he did not catch this.

I question just how much he was involved with this initial release since there is no way he caught this. If he had, we would have received a proper product..........

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by Brodo Faggins

Do people really need to get so worked-up and emotional over things like this?

Who's emotional?

Disappointed is the word. It's a bummer.

No one is crying about it.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by Blu-Benny

and i haven't been keeping up w/the thread so is this another gladiator debacle???

Not even close. Gladiator was a major problem - erasing actual film content. In QC terms, it was a 10/10 in its faultiness for this type of issue.

FOTR ranks probably around a 1/10 or 2/10. At most.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

I wish somebody would...........obviously, he did not catch this.

I question just how much he was involved with this initial release since there is no way he caught this. If he had, we would have received a proper product..........

He's on record, on this very website, as having seen the Blu-rays.

https://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=3849

"I've seen the Blu-ray as they sent it to me to approve and I looked at the film and it looks fantastic on Blu-ray but I don't know the date [of release]."

He didn't catch it because he didn't consider it a problem.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by Maggot

All this commotion over the Blu-ray and HDTV shots. For me, both look equally as bad and only offer further proof that these films, in particular the first one, not only need a new, serious transfer, but demand it. Certainly they are going to look better than DVD, nobody denies that......but it is clear from what we have seen over the years from numerous fine Blu-ray transfers of various movies young and old, is that Warner's treatment of these movies boarders on contempt. Add to that their rather poor track record for just about anything that isn't a 50+ year old classic and there you have it.

Warner had the producers approve the release. What more should they have done, exactly?

[dcowboy7]

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

Here is the best and most honest review yet.........3/5 PQ


http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...ay-review.html


Here is copy and paste of the video review portion.................



Video: 3/5

All three films come to us in VC-1 encoded 1080p video. if you would like more information on the encode please see my second post.

It is no secret that many people, myself included, had high hopes for this release. These films were technically groundbreaking during their theatrical runs and deserve the absolute best transfer possible when going to Blu-Ray.



Now the question you’re all asking – just how good do they look?

Sadly the answer is – so so.

Warner has yet again failed to perform due diligence when it comes to an important Blu-Ray release. While the films do get progressively better as far as PQ is concerned as you progress through the trilogy, they are simply good and rarely great. The Fellowship of the Ring has always looked a little “soft” – even in theaters as some of you may recall, but it never lacked in terms of fine detail. Unfortunately, the Blu-Ray release has been subjected to Digital Noise Reduction (DNR) to the extent that some HDTV recordings actually show better fine detail. It appears to me that rather than starting from a rescan of the source film Warner took their existing HD master and threw it through the DNR cycle on medium before making a few color timing fixes, boosting contrast ever so slightly and throwing it onto a disc in average bitrate VC-1.


I know that many of you are going to be disappointed reading this – and let me assure you that I am even more disappointed writing this. These films deserve better, they deserve to be treated with respect and demand that more time and money be invested to ensure they look their best. Warner has done a great job moving to Blu-Ray as a high def format – but they consistently let us down with their Blu-Ray transfers. Films like this should come to us free of DNR and digital tampering beyond what is absolutely necessary to ensure they are true to Peter Jackson’s vision. So little care was in fact taken that there is actually digital noise present in certain dark scenes (00:24:02 in the Two Towers for example).


If the spiel I wrote in my introduction demonstrates anything, it should be just how important these films are to many of us. If I was to make a list of films that deserve to be fully remastered – these films would be right at the top. When I refer to remastering I do not mean taking the current master, applying a smattering of Digital Noise Reduction (DNR) and slapping it into a moderate bitrate VC-1 encode. I refer to a complete rescan of the original film stock at 4k or better resolution and a re-render for any effects that are dated or low res.

Summary: If you’re a picture quality fanatic this release is not for you. The needless and inconsistent use of DNR has absolutely tarnished what could have been a groundbreaking release.

Whats with the BOLD.

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by captveg

He's on record, on this very website, as having seen the Blu-rays.

https://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=3849

"I've seen the Blu-ray as they sent it to me to approve and I looked at the film and it looks fantastic on Blu-ray but I don't know the date [of release]."

He didn't catch it because he didn't consider it a problem.

Yeah, I have seen that quote...............Like I said, I question how involved he really was with this initial project.

[Blu-Benny]

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

Correct.

thanks!!

Originally Posted by captveg

Not even close. Gladiator was a major problem - erasing actual film content. In QC terms, it was a 10/10 in its faultiness for this type of issue.

FOTR ranks probably around a 1/10 or 2/10. At most.

alright, thanks!!

[42041]

Originally Posted by captveg

What more should they have done, exactly?

scan some film.

[Beta Man]

Originally Posted by Blu-Benny

when the mouse isn't on the pic, it's the blu right?? when the mouse is on the pic, it's the hdtv broadcast??

and i haven't been keeping up w/the thread so is this another gladiator debacle???

The fact people aren't sure which is which is a testament to how poor this transfer is.....

Originally Posted by captveg

Not even close. Gladiator was a major problem - erasing actual film content. In QC terms, it was a 10/10 in its faultiness for this type of issue.

FOTR ranks probably around a 1/10 or 2/10. At most.

I disagree.... from the screen caps, the DNR level is about equally terrible, but this picture is MUCH softer, and looks worse.......

I noticed (when looking for it) the 'missing arrows' in Gladiator.... but the overall image quality in these screen caps is much worse than the Gladiator ones in my opinion. (Both are trash..... so we're comparing rubbish to garbage )