120hz explained

[Teabaggins]

so what's the benefit of 120 hz?

[jjmartin122]

I just got the Vizio SV470XVT with 120hz Smooth Motion and watching sports is amazing!!! Its better than being in the damn stadium!! There is no way I'm ever going back.

[dereksworl]

Originally Posted by jjmartin122

I just got the Vizio SV470XVT with 120hz Smooth Motion and watching sports is amazing!!! Its better than being in the damn stadium!! There is no way I'm ever going back.

I always been highly skeptical of anything Vizio. how does it compare to Sony's and Samsung's 120Hz Motionflow and Auto Motion Plus?

[Minimejer05]

Everytime I go to best buy I see the Sony Bravia(I think or XBR) with the 120Hz motionflow on... god I just LOOVE how fast and smooth it plays. I honestly cant wait to buy one soon... Now I watched a movie on my friends 65 inch DLP with 120Hz..and it looked like a normal movie.. I didnt notice anything movie "smoother" or "faster" is that because there wasnt a motion flow option? His was a 65 inch 1080p 120Hz Mitsubishi Diamond Class.

[ObiTrentKenobi]

Originally Posted by jjmartin122

I just got the Vizio SV470XVT with 120hz Smooth Motion and watching sports is amazing!!! Its better than being in the damn stadium!! There is no way I'm ever going back.

You think your Vizio is better than real life? WHAAAA???!???

Wow, try a Panasonic or Sony with 120 sometime then... you'll think you're flying through outer space!

[skygreenleopard]

Originally Posted by Minimejer05

Everytime I go to best buy I see the Sony Bravia(I think or XBR) with the 120Hz motionflow on... god I just LOOVE how fast and smooth it plays. I honestly cant wait to buy one soon... Now I watched a movie on my friends 65 inch DLP with 120Hz..and it looked like a normal movie.. I didnt notice anything movie "smoother" or "faster" is that because there wasnt a motion flow option? His was a 65 inch 1080p 120Hz Mitsubishi Diamond Class.

Exactly. 120 Hz and MotionFlow aren't the same thing, but 120hz sets ARE capable of MotionFlow/whatever your brand TV calls it. I prefer 120 hz without it, so 24 fps movies look the way they're supposed to in theaters.

So, your friend's 120hz TV was better than a 60hz TV in that it plays the movie at its true smooth 24fps (what I prefer). If he had a MotionFlow-like feature and were to turn it on, he'd get that ultra-smooth video effect that you like, almost an artificial 120 fps. If he were to downgrade to a 60hz set, the movie would show be around 24fps but it'd be inconsistent, resulting in some judder/skippy frames in certain scenes, like slow panning across a landscape or quick movements.

Hope this helps.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Originally Posted by skygreenleopard

Exactly. 120 Hz and MotionFlow aren't the same thing, but 120hz sets ARE capable of MotionFlow/whatever your brand TV calls it. I prefer 120 hz without it, so 24 fps movies look the way they're supposed to in theaters.

So, your friend's 120hz TV was better than a 60hz TV in that it plays the movie at its true smooth 24fps (what I prefer). If he had a MotionFlow-like feature and were to turn it on, he'd get that ultra-smooth video effect that you like, almost an artificial 120 fps. If he were to downgrade to a 60hz set, the movie would show be around 24fps but it'd be inconsistent, resulting in some judder/skippy frames in certain scenes, like slow panning across a landscape or quick movements.

Hope this helps.

A very odd thing though, I watched a Blu Ray in 1080/24p on my 60hz Samsung (it was Dark Knight) and there was no judder whatsoever. It was silky smooth....or at least as smooth as they normally are. No uneven judder to be had...and there are several sweeping/panning shots in that film that make it easy to notice such judder. My Tv does have a "film mode", so maybe that is an anti-judder setting that smooths the motion slightly.

BTW, that was my first Blu Ray on my TV and HOLY COW was it gorgeous. I bought a cheaper tv (Samsung LN40A530 for less than a grand) because I'm too poor to afford an XBR6 and I was afraid that it wouldn't show Blu Ray material as well as the higher priced TV's. Well, that fear has melted away after watching The Dark Knight on Blu. Total and complete AWSOMENESS.

[dereksworl]

Originally Posted by NuSoardGraphite

BTW, that was my first Blu Ray on my TV and HOLY COW was it gorgeous. I bought a cheaper tv (Samsung LN40A530 for less than a grand) because I'm too poor to afford an XBR6 and I was afraid that it wouldn't show Blu Ray material as well as the higher priced TV's. Well, that fear has melted away after watching The Dark Knight on Blu. Total and complete AWSOMENESS.

Nothing wrong with the A530. It produces a fairly ok black level and its 1080p. only thing you're really missing out on as oppose to the higher models is a higher dynamic contrast ratio(which is pointless), 120hz(that may come in handy, but not major), and Frame interpolation(won't go there, however does provide better motion res). other than that you're good. And if you haven't already, after calibration Blus will look even better......

[NuSoardGraphite]

I realise that!

I got a good tv for a great price. Its not 120hz, but it performs very well at doing everything I've thrown at it thus far and I'm very happy with my purchase.

A friend at work just gave me a copy of Speed Racer on Blu ray, so now I have to get my buddy to bring his PS3 over again so we can watch that. I need to get my own PS3 ASAP! Especially now after seeing all the goodness from E3 it looks between Blu and games I won't be leaving my living room for a long, long time.

btw, I've done a quick DIY calibration, but its not optimized for HD yet. I want to get DVE HD basics disc when I get my PS3. I know my picture can look even better than it already does, but my brain has difficulty imagining what thats going to look like

[steve1971]

My tv is 60hz and I couldnt be happier. It has taken everything I have thrown at it movie wise and I noticed little or no judder at all. From panning shots, to fast moving images and no problem at all. That is why I have said that why should I spend more money for 120hz when the tv I have does the job just fine? There is no need period. I have read that websites like CNET also dont like or dont favor 120hz because they believe it makes the film look fake and not what the director of the movie intended. It comes down to personal preference in the end and what you like. But for me? I will stick with my 60hz tv because so far its been an amazing experience.

[Jimbowne]

Originally Posted by stockstar1138

i hope this clears things up. nothing beats a native 1080p24 signal which you can get with a 120hz tv, but not a 60hz tv. all 120hz tvs should be able to have these motion enhancers turned off.

all those xxxxs were added as space fillers and mean nothing.

Can you clarify why a 60hz tv cannot use the native 1080p 24hz signal?? I have a 1080p 42" RCA (60 hz) and one of its settings is the 1080p 24hz, so I assume it can display that or there is some adjustment taking place? Thanks

[rubystone356]

I own a philips 47pfl7403D/f7. it can do the 120 refresh rate. I like the tv very much. I know that some people do not like the image from the 120. it works fine for me. had the tv for over 6 months now.

Jacob

[dereksworl]

Originally Posted by Jimbowne

Can you clarify why a 60hz tv cannot use the native 1080p 24hz signal?? I have a 1080p 42" RCA (60 hz) and one of its settings is the 1080p 24hz, so I assume it can display that or there is some adjustment taking place? Thanks

As far as i know its using 3:2 pulldown or 3:2 reverse pulldown to display it. 3:2 reverse conversion will make it somewhat smoother, however it is still not displaying it properly because it is not 24p compatible. you're more than likely still getting judder......that is if you even notice it though......

[steve1971]

Originally Posted by steve1971

My tv is 60hz and I couldnt be happier. It has taken everything I have thrown at it movie wise and I noticed little or no judder at all. From panning shots, to fast moving images and no problem at all. That is why I have said that why should I spend more money for 120hz when the tv I have does the job just fine? There is no need period. I have read that websites like CNET also dont like or dont favor 120hz because they believe it makes the film look fake and not what the director of the movie intended. It comes down to personal preference in the end and what you like. But for me? I will stick with my 60hz tv because so far its been an amazing experience.

I read what I wrote here and now I laugh because now that I own a 120hz HDTV I now see what others have been talking about and why they love 120hz. I was blind and now have seen the light. Its just sad that it took so long1 lol

[rubystone356]

welcome to the 120hz club.

Jacob

[tha_legend713]

so can someone help me out(total noob)...I recently bought the Toshiba Regza 55sl500u 120hz led tv and everytime I play a blu-ray I cant seem to get more than a 60hz refresh rate...is that normal? this is what im getting..

Resolution: 1920x1080
Scan Type: progressive
Frame Rate: 60hz
Aspect: 16x9
Bit Depth : 36bit
Color Space: sRGB
RGB/YUV: YUV
Chroma Format: 4:4:4

any help would be great

[drummerboy_2002]

Originally Posted by tha_legend713

so can someone help me out(total noob)...I recently bought the Toshiba Regza 55sl500u 120hz led tv and everytime I play a blu-ray I cant seem to get more than a 60hz refresh rate...is that normal? this is what im getting..

Resolution: 1920x1080
Scan Type: progressive
Frame Rate: 60hz
Aspect: 16x9
Bit Depth : 36bit
Color Space: sRGB
RGB/YUV: YUV
Chroma Format: 4:4:4

any help would be great

I don't know anything about that TV, but the refresh rate on the TV is generally not variable. It's always 120. That's likely the rate of the source (BD player). Check the settings to make sure that your player is sending a 24p signal.

[tha_legend713]

Originally Posted by drummerboy_2002

I don't know anything about that TV, but the refresh rate on the TV is generally not variable. It's always 120. That's likely the rate of the source (BD player). Check the settings to make sure that your player is sending a 24p signal.

thnx for your help....does it change with every movie?

[drummerboy_2002]

Originally Posted by tha_legend713

thnx for your help....does it change with every movie?

Again, generaly, movies will be 24fps, unless the player is doing some 3:2 pulldown, which is an outdated process these days. Other content, like TV shows, could be 30fps or 60fps. There is no 120fps format. That's just the refresh rate of your TV, but it's good because it makes it easy to fluidly display 24, 30 and 60fps content.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by steve1971

[I]My tv is 60hz and I couldnt be happier. It has taken everything I have thrown at it movie wise and I noticed little or no judder at all. From panning shots, to fast moving images and no problem at all. That is why I have said that why should I spend more money for 120hz when the tv I have does the job just fine? There is no need period. I have read that websites like CNET also dont like or dont favor 120hz because they believe it makes the film look fake and not what the director of the movie intended. It comes down to personal preference in the end and what you like. But for me? I will stick with my 60hz tv because so far its been an amazing experience.

Originally Posted by steve1971

I read what I wrote here and now I laugh because now that I own a 120hz HDTV I now see what others have been talking about and why they love 120hz. I was blind and now have seen the light. Its just sad that it took so long1 lol

Those cNet comments have NOTHING to do with 120Hz. It is not the refresh rate they are discussing, it is the motion estimation/motion compensation circuitry which LCD (CCFL and LED) sets use to acheive less motion blurring, but also result in artifacting.

You will acheive a more natural picture with a 120Hz set keeping the ME/MC circuitry off, motion resolution will suffer but that's a worthy trade-off in my opinion if you've got an LCD.