INCEPTION Review Thread (SPOILERS!!)

[Bizdady]

Originally Posted by JTStarkiller

Has anyone posted this yet? Sorry if it has. Joey GL linked to it on his Twitter this morning. Pretty cool.

[Show spoiler]

I was just about to post this but didnt

[Show spoiler]they go into Fischers dream first? I dont see that, it should be Fischers not Yusuuf? I dont remember Yusuuf being a dreamer?

Im so lost lol

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by Bizdady

I was just about to post this but didnt

[Show spoiler]they go into Fischers dream first? I dont see that, it should be Fischers not Yusuuf? I dont remember Yusuuf being a dreamer?

Im so lost lol

[Show spoiler]From the plane they went into Yusuuf's dream first, that's why it was raining(guy really had to pee). Then they went into Arthur's dream, which was 2 levels down and then they went into Fischer's dream to change how he felt about his father's empire, which was the third level.

[Bizdady]

Originally Posted by Gandalf Stormcrow

[Show spoiler]From the plane they went into Yusuuf's dream first, that's why it was raining(guy really had to pee). Then they went into Arthur's dream, which was 2 levels down and then they went into Fischer's dream to change how he felt about his father's empire, which was the third level.

I see!!! I need to watch this movie again lol me and coworker are really having serious discussions about some plot points lol she keeps confusing me lol

[JJ]

[JTStarkiller]

I thought level 3 was Fischer's dream and Eames was the architect, even though that diagram says it was Eames' dream. I remember Cobb asking Ariadne if he'd added anything, and she said the ventilation.

Bah, the whole thing about the dreamer/subject/architect still confuses me after two viewings.

[Blu3]

Originally Posted by JTStarkiller

I thought level 3 was Fischer's dream and Eames was the architect, even though that diagram says it was Eames' dream. I remember Cobb asking Ariadne if he'd added anything, and she said the ventilation.

Bah, the whole thing about the dreamer/subject/architect still confuses me after two viewings.

+1 lol I've only seen the movie once so far though

[Show spoiler]That picture diagram is cool, but it doesn't show how Cobb and Saito get out of limbo. As we see Saito reach for his gun once they both remember why they're there and what they are (or were) doing, we are led to believe that they simply shoot each other to wake up, which doesn't make sense at first because we're told that if anyone dies, as Saito did, they get stuck in limbo, but I suppose it's plausible, since they are already in limbo, and thus, could wake up by dying here (nowhere else to go but back to reality, or wake up). It's also possible that they remembered the "kicks" as a way to wake up based on Yusuuf's anesthetic formula, and simply knocked themselves over in their chairs or jumped out the window (your guess is as good as mine). Someone on an earlier page here mentioned they simply woke up after they remembered, but I doubt this, as the movie made it clear that you don't wake up from limbo until your time runs out, about ~50 years, which is what happened with Cobb and his wife, so Cobb and Saito would have to figure out a kick of their own to jump out early - the only thing I can't figure out is why Saito was so old by the time Cobb found him - are there two limbos going on here, and if so, why would one have a different timeline than the other (if all limbos are on the same dream level) - or is Cobb's dream not a limbo level??

[Bizdady]

Originally Posted by Blu3

[Show spoiler] the only thing I can't figure out is why Saito was so old by the time Cobb found him - are there two limbos going on here, and if so, why would one have a different timeline than the other (if all limbos are on the same dream level) - or is Cobb's dream not a limbo level??

[Show spoiler]I think the fact that Cobb knows hes in limbo while Saito doesnt realize it changes their timeline perception?

[aramis109]

Originally Posted by Bizdady

[Show spoiler]I think the fact that Cobb knows hes in limbo while Saito doesnt realize it changes their timeline perception?

You're both missing one point-

[Show spoiler]Don't forget that Saito fell into limbo at least minutes prior to Cobb. With the changing of levels and the progression of time being more rapid the deeper you go, perceptually for him he had been there for many years and thus had visibly aged into an old man.

[Blu3]

Originally Posted by Bizdady

[Show spoiler]I think the fact that Cobb knows hes in limbo while Saito doesnt realize it changes their timeline perception?

Mmm I don't know. I'm led to believe that you don't control time in any level, the level itself dictates the time, based on what level it is with regards to reality. So, all level 1 dreams should run on the same clock and so on, including limbo...?

[Show spoiler]Few things I haven't figured out yet with the whole dreamer/subject/architect set up and the machine...(sorry if it's been covered here, but there's over 100 pages in the thread...)

1. The machine administers the anesthetic to put people to sleep and is what ultimately dictates how much time you have and thus, dream in each level (exception being an early exit via a "kick"). The machine also connects people right? Otherwise how would they show up collectively on the same dream, but remain out of other people's dreams that are dreaming with other machines around the world (and vice-versa)? I only remember the I/V connection for the anesthetic from the machine, how else are they connected to it?

2. It's the dreamer's dream, populated by the subject with the environment (or level) created by the architect - is that right? And anyone else going in is what, a guest? Sooo the machine also sets this up? They don't show us how the architect "loads" up the levels, for example, or how the machine, or whatever is doing it makes sure that everyone goes into this guy or that guy's dream, and what controls who's mind you're breaking into? Is there a mental block for the others? Actually, others in the shared dream also populate the dream, as seen with Cobb's wife, so yeah, I'm definately going to have to watch this again to get how everything all ties together.

3. Once in a dream, or level 1, how do they get in deeper levels? The movie shows them using the machine again for the next level down and so on, but...they're already dreaming, so there's no actual or real 2nd machine, or 3rd one, and so on, taking them deeper and deeper, so what is it? Is it just the mind thinking it's going deeper and thus, by believeing it, it does so in the subconscious?? Whoa, that's a mind trip lol

[Blu3]

Originally Posted by aramis109

You're both missing one point-

[Show spoiler]Don't forget that Saito fell into limbo at least minutes prior to Cobb. With the changing of levels and the progression of time being more rapid the deeper you go, perceptually for him he had been there for many years and thus had visibly aged into an old man.

[Show spoiler]Although Saito seemed to age a bit more than what the time between when he died and when Cobb went in after him would've allowed (they're already in level 3 time), even in limbo time, that's good enough for me - thank you

[mjbethancourt]

Originally Posted by Blu3

+1 lol I've only seen the movie once so far though

[Show spoiler]That picture diagram is cool, but it doesn't show how Cobb and Saito get out of limbo. As we see Saito reach for his gun once they both remember why they're there and what they are (or were) doing, we are led to believe that they simply shoot each other to wake up, which doesn't make sense at first because we're told that if anyone dies, as Saito did, they get stuck in limbo, but I suppose it's plausible, since they are already in limbo, and thus, could wake up by dying here (nowhere else to go but back to reality, or wake up). It's also possible that they remembered the "kicks" as a way to wake up based on Yusuuf's anesthetic formula, and simply knocked themselves over in their chairs or jumped out the window (your guess is as good as mine). Someone on an earlier page here mentioned they simply woke up after they remembered, but I doubt this, as the movie made it clear that you don't wake up from limbo until your time runs out, about ~50 years, which is what happened with Cobb and his wife, so Cobb and Saito would have to figure out a kick of their own to jump out early - the only thing I can't figure out is why Saito was so old by the time Cobb found him - are there two limbos going on here, and if so, why would one have a different timeline than the other (if all limbos are on the same dream level) - or is Cobb's dream not a limbo level??

I think they did shoot themselves, and the director just decided at that point it would be in bad taste to depict yet more suicide, especially in what turns out to be the segue to the warm, positive ending. Cobb and Mal did not wake up when their time ran out, they laid on a train track and got obliterated. The age-perception thing is interesting, as it seems that it is transitory... characters are shown both old and young in different depictions of the same dream scene. Dreams are weird that way. I know in most of my dreams, I'm usually 10-20 years younger than I really am, and it changes a lot.

[onemorechance]

5 stars! saw this movie 3 times in imax!

[mjbethancourt]

Originally Posted by Blu3

Mmm I don't know. I'm led to believe that you don't control time in any level, the level itself dictates the time, based on what level it is with regards to reality. So, all level 1 dreams should run on the same clock and so on, including limbo...?

the time scale is controlled by the technology. Yusuf tailors compounds to specific parameters, including time scale. I think your assumption is basically correct, that all of those things are controlled by the technology. The director spares us those minute details, as there is already an abundance of exposition through dialogue.

[Blu3]

Originally Posted by mjbethancourt

I think they did shoot themselves, and the director just decided at that point it would be in bad taste to depict yet more suicide, especially in what turns out to be the segue to the warm, positive ending. Blu3: Cobb and Mal did not wake up when their time ran out, they laid on a train track and got obliterated. The age-perception thing is interesting, as it seems that it is transitory... characters are shown both old and young in different depictions of the same dream scene. Dreams are weird that way. I know in most of my dreams, I'm usually 10-20 years younger than I really am, and it changes a lot.

Good memory, I forgot about that part. I was focusing on the part where we hear Cobb talk about the lifetime they spent and then the small flashes of an old couple in limbo (them). Did the movie cover age perception? That's going to make it a bit harder to distinguish things. I have to watch it again!

"characters are shown both old and young in different depictions of the same dream scene" - can you refresh my memory with an example?

Originally Posted by mjbethancourt

the time scale is controlled by the technology. Yusuf tailors compounds to specific parameters, including time scale. I think your assumption is basically correct, that all of those things are controlled by the technology. The director spares us those minute details, as there is already an abundance of exposition through dialogue.

I'm actually glad they didn't spend a whole lot of time explaining the "machine". This kept us, the audience, engaged in the story. Of course, it also leaves the few of us who'd like to know more with questions lol

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by Blu3

Good memory, I forgot about that part. I was focusing on the part where we hear Cobb talk about the lifetime they spent and then the small flashes of an old couple in limbo (them). Did the movie cover age perpection? That's going to make it a bit harder to distinguish things. I have to watch it again!

"characters are shown both old and young in different depictions of the same dream scene" - can you refresh my memory with an example?

[Show spoiler]Well I can say while they did come back out of limbo physically the same age they were when they went in, you could tell they were mentally and spiritually old souls, Mal in particular. It was actually so bad for Mal that she refused to believe they were in the real world and thought limbo was real.

[gunner89]

seen this film 5 times now, still love it.

[Bizdady]

Originally Posted by aramis109

You're both missing one point-

[Show spoiler]Don't forget that Saito fell into limbo at least minutes prior to Cobb. With the changing of levels and the progression of time being more rapid the deeper you go, perceptually for him he had been there for many years and thus had visibly aged into an old man.

Yes I remembered that trying to backtrack lol One thing that I got to thinking now was dont they

[Show spoiler]need the briefcase machine to go into dreams? How did they get into Saitos limbo again? I dont remember Leo or Ellen killing themselves in dream 3.

[Blu3]

Originally Posted by Gandalf Stormcrow

[Show spoiler]Well I can say while they did come back out of limbo physically the same age they were when they went in, you could tell they were mentally and spiritually old souls, Mal in particular. It was actually so bad for Mal that she refused to believe they were in the real world and thought limbo was real.

[Show spoiler]Yeah, but hang on a second - Cobb tells us that the reason why Mal thought the real world was fake and limbo was real was because of the idea that he planted in her, which was also the 1st inception, and not the mental age related to the time they spent down there. The idea he planted in her was that the world they were in was fake, which at that time was the limbo world (dream, really), to try and get her to come back to reality. When they woke up, Mal still had that idea in her head, which is what caused her to (again) believe that the world around her was fake (only this time it wasn't) and commit suicide in order to get to what she thought was the real world - back to limbo. Did I miss something?

[Bizdady]

Im definately going to have to watch this again soon lol

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by Blu3

[Show spoiler]Yeah, but hang on a second - Cobb tells us that the reason why Mal thought the real world was fake and limbo was real was because of the idea that he planted in her, which was also the 1st inception, and not the mental age related to the time they spent down there. The idea he planted in her was that the world they were in was fake, which at that time was the limbo world (dream, really), to try and get her to come back to reality. When they woke up, Mal still had that idea in her head, which is what caused her to (again) believe that the world around her was fake (only this time it wasn't) and commit suicide in order to get to what she thought was the real world - back to limbo. Did I miss something?

No you didn't miss anything, good call.

[Show spoiler]Their mental age still affected her ability to perceive reality. If you were 50 years older than you looked, it'd probably make you a little psychotic too.