Archived: Insiders Thread

[kjack]

From Warren Communications News:

BLU-RAY STILL PURSUING CHINA for expansion, but with single world-standard player, not China-only version as HD DVD did.


http://www.warren-news.com/

[hollywoodguy]

Originally Posted by kjack

From Warren Communications News:

BLU-RAY STILL PURSUING CHINA for expansion, but with single world-standard player, not China-only version as HD DVD did.


http://www.warren-news.com/

Keith,

what do you think that means for the format war "as we know it"?

[kjack]

Originally Posted by hollywoodguy

what do you think that means for the format war "as we know it"?

People more knowledgable than me will have to answer that question. I'm just a low-level grunt..

[kjack]

Originally Posted by ps3andlovinit

I know..that's why I was asking if anyone had insight on question #2 in particular and if DTS-MA is comparable to SACD. It was my understanding SACD is one of the most .. if not the most difficult and processor intensive decodes out there...including video.

Having looked at implementing SACD, from what I've seen, the SACD audio bitstream is basically simply passed to audio DACs that have the required input interface.

[Bullseye]

Originally Posted by kjack

Having looked at implementing SACD, from what I've seen, the SACD audio bitstream is basically simply passed to audio DACs that have the required input interface.

Kjack you need to add Alba to your list of BD players. They will be releasing BD players in the UK.

http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/11...eap_bd_player/
http://www.albaplc.com/html/home.htm

[WickyWoo]

Given that HD DVD has pretty much rolled over and died in Japan and Europe, why not try to win 100% studio support in those markets? This would reduce the format war to only one front.
How much would it cost to offer the HD DVD exclusive studios a handsome buyout package for region B and Japanese only versions of all their movies? Surely less then the cost HD DVD paid for Paramount/DW in August since HD DVD has less of a foothold in these markets, the studios’ fixed costs are being spread across fewer units.
This maneuver could show us how quickly high def media can gain on the real enemy, DVD, without a format war to deter adoption. There are many here in the US that are scared of buying a dead format so continue using the DVD format because it is good enough.

Because the exclusivity contracts are for the studio, not international divisions

Another suggestion. Its been seen again and again that the surefire way to kill a BR release is to release it after the DVD is on the market. Why not try to reverse that and kill the DVD release by putting BR movies on the shelf on Mondays and the DVDs on Tuesday. There would be no need for a second marketing campaign. Just say, "Pirates of the Carribean: at world's end available on DVD December 4th and available early on Blu Ray," at the end of the commercial and show the two versions with a 12/4 on the DVD and a 12/3 on the BR. Sony could also push the PS3 game releases to mondays to get more PS3 owners in the store on the same day as BR releases.

Because stores want their NR product on a tuesday, because it's the slowest day. The get it early factor worked with DVD, because that was up to 6 months early due to the rental window on VHS. A day or 2, or a week or 2 is not going to make the difference

[JadedRaverLA]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

It's a LOT more difficult.
First you have the lossy DTS Core. Then the HD extensions (still lossy) and THEN the MA lossless extension.
TrueHD is a separate lossless track with a companion DD track. This core track can either be hidden (Spider-Man) or separately accessible (Letters From Iwo Jima).

Maybe an insider can comment on this.

Are you sure about this? It's true that DTS-HD MA requires more processing power than TrueHD to decode... but you shouldn't touch the lossy core in the process. My understanding is that a DTS-HD MA track is a lossless track and a lossy track side by side (that only appear as one track to the user). You don't need to mess with the lossy track if you're listening to lossless.

The "extensions" thing I thought had been shot down by DTS some time ago.

[JBlacklow]

Insiders, someone brought this up at another forum, half jokingly, but I like the idea:

Why not have a deal where people who bought an HD DVD player can send it in or return it for credit (say, $100-$200) towards a Blu-ray player? It's funny, it's cheeky, it's a slap in the face to Toshiba, and it would appeal to all those people who got one from desperate HD DVD fanboys as a xmas "present".

[hollywoodguy]

Originally Posted by kjack

People more knowledgable than me will have to answer that question. I'm just a low-level grunt..

Fair enough, even though I don't believe you. Maybe I can get sth. out of you on these:

1) How far do you think we are off from the first player that does it all: BonusView, BD-Live and able to put out all advanced codecs as either fully internally decoded MPCM or raw bitstream (with the choice up to the end user)?

2) Do you see any major shifts in the US player market (sans PS3 & 360 add-on) for the rest of 2007? Before the start of the holiday season we saw a small sales lead of Blu-ray players over HD DVD. With the $199 and $99 1080i players the momentum (in units sold) seems to have shifted back considerably to HD DVD, but we haven't heard any numbers from the BD companies in a while.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by hollywoodguy

Before the start of the holiday season we saw a small sales lead of Blu-ray players over HD DVD. With the $199 and $99 1080i players the momentum (in units sold) seems to have shifted back considerably to HD DVD, but we haven't heard any numbers from the BD companies in a while.

Are you sure about that? By end of September according to both parties there were about 400,000 players on the market, 53% of which were HD DVD, 44% of which were Blu-ray and 3% of which were dual format.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by kjack

Having looked at implementing SACD, from what I've seen, the SACD audio bitstream is basically simply passed to audio DACs that have the required input interface.

KJack - how come none of the new receivers are coming with the DAC's capable of DSD conversion without hitting the PCM realm?

Cirrus Logic CS4398 "Super DAC" for example, capable of both 24/192 PCM and DSD digital to analog conversion.

[hollywoodguy]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

Are you sure about that? By end of September according to both parties there were about 400,000 players on the market, 53% of which were HD DVD, 44% of which were Blu-ray and 3% of which were dual format.

Sure about what, the momentary shift towards Blu-ray or the shift back to HD DVD? Your numbers are total numbers, but I remember insiders talking about Blu-ray players starting to outsell HD DVD "in the last few weeks" at that point in time (likely end of September). The shift back is simply my assumption. If Blu-ray players had outsold HD DVD despite their price dumping, I think we would have heard about it.

[eat_me_cool]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

Are you sure about that? By end of September according to both parties there were about 400,000 players on the market, 53% of which were HD DVD, 44% of which were Blu-ray and 3% of which were dual format.

For all the noise about the Walmart sale, the PS3 has been selling the same number of units every two days in November.

[Frode]

Originally Posted by JBlacklow

Why not have a deal where people who bought an HD DVD player can send it in or return it for credit (say, $100-$200) towards a Blu-ray player? It's funny, it's cheeky, it's a slap in the face to Toshiba, and it would appeal to all those people who got one from desperate HD DVD fanboys as a xmas "present".

Do a search - it's already been suggested and answered. Not going to happen, and what would the BDA do with the players? It would only cost them even more money disposing of it in an environmentally safe way.

[WickyWoo]

Honestly the more I learn about DTS HDMA, the more I can't wait for NL and Fox's contracts to expire so it can go away. The entire thing sounds overthought and overcomplicated. Maybe if it didn't rely on processing 3 simultaneous streams and mixing them more decks would be able to decode it

[Seretur]

Conversely, by the time their contracts expire, processing power and software capabilities will probably reach the point where this issue is a total wash on the consumer end.

If anything, it might be slightly ahead of its time. But then, so is Blu-ray, right?

[hollywoodguy]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Honestly the more I learn about DTS HDMA, the more I can't wait for NL and Fox's contracts to expire so it can go away. The entire thing sounds overthought and overcomplicated. Maybe if it didn't rely on processing 3 simultaneous streams and mixing them more decks would be able to decode it

I can understand the sentiment, but if (I know, I know...) all decks decoded it, we'd probably want the studios to use nothing else. Lower bitrate peaks than DTHD, highest-available-quality lossy core and smaller size than DTHD&DD combined are awfully good specs. I would be very interested in some of the insider's opionions about the future of DTS HD MA.

Maybe RBFilms, if he still reads this thread, can chime in for a second to explain why he thinks DTS HD MA is the best choice for HDM, I remember him being very vocal about it in the past.

Also Keith Jack, is internal decoding coming soon?

Paidgeek, how was working with DTS HD MA on Close Encounters? Any perceptual difference to DTHD? Advantages, disadvantages? Any plans by Sony to use it in the future for other reasons than to indulge a certain director ?

[iceman]

Guys, this is the Insiders thread, so stay on topic, keep it clean and avoid answering questions directed to insiders unless it's a trivial question, then the question should have been avoided

[manikin]

To Paidgeek:
I know you are not directly involved with PS3 features but support for locationfree basestation would certainly make my day. The PSP can remote play from both the PS3, and a locationfree basestation, Hopefully the PS3 will eventually be able to stream content from a locationfree basestation.
Thanks

[WriteSimply]

paidgeek, some more suggestions for the PS3 firmware if you could pass them on to SCE. Thanks!

1. Playlist for Video. Also if possible a "Play All" option for videos stored using flash drives and media cards.

2. Ability to create your own folder on either photos, music or video section.

3. Ability to play music while you're on the PSN.

If the PS3's HDMI port/chip can't pass through the TrueHD/DTS HDMA signal, could SCE offer a motherboard retrofit so that this can be achieved? I wouldn't mind paying for it. If this retrofit is possible, it would be better if SCE design new PS3s that can passthrough the signal. That way the motherboard fix as well as the firmware fix can be minimized.

And as BD movie specific question, I asked about Bonus View/Profile 1.1 titles being tested. How many titles is SPHE looking at that will have BD-Live capability in 2008?

Thanks paidgeek! (US$5)


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