That Amir Blokes been Sussed on AVS

[mainman]

If the 51Gb HD-DVD gets released. Do you guys think it'll play on the HD-DVD players that are out now?

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by mainman

If the 51Gb HD-DVD gets released. Do you guys think it'll play on the HD-DVD players that are out now?

No.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by mainman

If the 51Gb HD-DVD gets released. Do you guys think it'll play on the HD-DVD players that are out now?

Well, there is more being dangled than just the 51GB. That is pretty useless without an increase in bandwidth (30GB *IS* enough if you're stuck at 30.54 max mux). Microsoft won't endorse it in the DVD Forum without the bandwidth increase. Guaranteed. And it is being done to lure Disney, and they would want to reuse the BD50 encodings -> Bandwidth.

There is no way the A1/XA1 will support the higher capacity. A Toshiba engineer has already said this publically for the TL45. And it is highly doubtful that any of the current players can do it. And they are tight lipped about that. It's super desperation time in the HD DVD world. They are taking a MASSIVE gamble to try to sway Disney over one last time.

Toshiba demonstrated reading from the discs on a modified drive. Modified how? At what speed?

Gary

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

Well, there is more being dangled than just the 51GB. That is pretty useless without an increase in bandwidth (30GB *IS* enough if you're stuck at 30.54 max mux). Microsoft won't endorse it in the DVD Forum without the bandwidth increase. Guaranteed.

There is no way the A1/XA1 will support the higher capacity. A Toshiba engineer has already said this publically for the TL45. And it is highly doubtful that any of the current players can do it. And they are tight lipped about that. It's super desperation time in the HD DVD world. They are taking a MASSIVE gamble to try to sway Disney over one last time.

Toshiba demonstrated reading from the discs on a modified drive. Modified how? At what speed?

Gary

An MS employee (bkilian I think) has said that the add on drive is a 2x drive so it will support the 1.5x speed, but he said that the division was unsure on whether they can get 17GB layers to read, or TL working without any problems.

AFAIK Toshiba has never demo'ed a TL disc, and they have never shown one to the public, most likely because it doesn't exist.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

An MS employee (bkilian I think) has said that the add on drive is a 2x drive so it will support the 1.5x speed, but he said that the division was unsure on whether they can get 17GB layers to read, or TL working without any problems.

AFAIK Toshiba has never demo'ed a TL disc, and they have never shown one to the public, most likely because it doesn't exist.

There is MUCH more to it than the drive speed. The A1's drive was 2x as well.

First, the data must be readable. The PRML circuitry must be able to handle the distinct new configuration while maintaining the existing one. PRML is the KEY aspect that makes HD DVD possible. Toshiba's super-advanced PRML allows such high densities with the old tech.

The data must be able to flow through the tuned computer that is the player. Suddenly you increase the peak data rate by 50% without any change in components?!

At the very least, the clock speed of the decoder would presumably have to be higher than the spec requires to be able to manage the extra data flow. And that would impact cooling requirements and the fan speed.

Make a hot and noisy player just in case you change the spec?

Gary

[dialog_gvf]

I'm of two minds on the question of disclosure. At this point this TL51 is a beacon of hope. But, it is also an albatross. It is a super-Osborne feature. Nobody would dare buy in if they knew about TL51, and didn't know FOR SURE whether the player they were interested it would support it.

And how could anyone say, for sure, until the spec is defined?

After years of "we have it now, and all you BD people do is talk about potential" EVERYTHING is turned around. And all they are POTENTIALLY offering is the same as what BD has now. Nothing more.

In the meantime, BD is flooding the store shelves with GREAT titles. And the hardware shelves with more and more brands of players.

Now all HD DVD has to do is figure out how to distract everyone for a year so they can get their players and new stuff out.

Gary

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

I'm of two minds on the question of disclosure. At this point this TL51 is a beacon of hope. But, it is also an albatross. It is a super-Osborne feature. Nobody would dare buy in if they knew about TL51, and didn't know FOR SURE whether the player they were interested it would support it.

And how could anyone say, for sure, until the spec is defined?

After years of "we have it now, and all you BD people do is talk about potential" EVERYTHING is turned around. And all they are POTENTIALLY offering is the same as what BD has now. Nothing more.

In the meantime, BD is flooding the store shelves with GREAT titles. And the hardware shelves with more and more brands of players.

Now all HD DVD has to do is figure out how to distract everyone for a year so they can get their players and new stuff out.

Gary

The difference between the BDA distracting the world while only HD DVD was out and the Samsung had f/w issues and the DVD forum trying it now is the biggest factor in this whole war, the PS3. Now the BDA have a viable entry-level option that works flawlessly, then the DVD forum had a clunky G1 player that didn't work half of the time. Now the BDA have some really solid releases coming 007, Pirates 1+2, Ice Age, Cars, Spiderman 1+2, then the DVD forum didn't really have the titles to seal the deal. The DVD forum don't have as much influence as the BDA, the only company that will do anything is MS, Universal look to have taken a step back to consolidate for a while, compare that to Sony, Samsung, Matsushita (Panasonic and JVC), Phillips, Fox, Disney, MGM, Lionsgate and Colombia who will all be pushing BD in all of their movies and in their TV adverts for DVD, adding at the end "also available on Blu-ray Disc" or something to that effect.

The way I see it, the DVD forum haven't got a snowball's chance in Hell of succeeding in making people wait for a year. If they don't woo Disney, this time then they will most likely can the whole idea of TL.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

The way I see it, the DVD forum haven't got a snowball's chance in Hell of succeeding in making people wait for a year. If they don't woo Disney, this time then they will most likely can the whole idea of TL.

Even trying again with TL51 is a clear act of desperation.

You have the usual suspects spending a year explaining why the capacity and bandwidth is not needed, and then wham, Toshiba side swipes their best ally with "oops, it turns out you're wrong" announcement.

Makes them look like fools.

Gary

[GasCat]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

After years of "we have it now, and all you BD people do is talk about potential" EVERYTHING is turned around. And all they are POTENTIALLY offering is the same as what BD has now. Nothing more.

Great point. I think it's funny how it is conviently 1 GB more than what Blu-Ray now has out there. If I owned HD-DVD and they could not play it on my current player I would be extremely angry. We would have in fact three different formats, not just two.

[4K display]

TheInquirer.net spews out the usual rubbish, specifically towards Sony & Blu-ray:
Blu-ray, HD both doomed as pr0n industry twiddles thumbs

Microsoft VP is asked to comment on the article:

Originally Posted by Amir

Is this the article? http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36942

If so, seems like he did pretty good research. And this is high praise, coming from us who usually get beat up good by Inquirer

I guess he missed this part:

HD-DVD on the other hand does not require AACS

[Dave Mack]

Theres' a pretty desperate sounding thread in the HDdvd software thread now at AVS telling all owners to BUY, BUY, BUY!!!! so that they will then hopefully release more content! With a good percentage saying, "Screw that! Give me some content I want, THEN I'll buy!"

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Dave Mack

Theres' a pretty desperate sounding thread in the HDdvd software thread now at AVS telling all owners to BUY, BUY, BUY!!!! so that they will then hopefully release more content! With a good percentage saying, "Screw that! Give me some content I want, THEN I'll buy!"

^^ A pretty simple concept that goes right over the heads of a lot of those same HD-DVD zealots.

I just chuckled to myself the other night when I fired up Invincible on BD (good movie, btw) and saw that opening montage from Disney, a huge BD exclusive powerhouse studio if ever there was one, and the beautiful HD ads for such EXCLUSIVE titles like Pirates of the Caribbean and the rest of it.

No amount of FUD or "Wishing Upon a Star" nonsense can get past concrete facts like these. People will see it. People will buy it.

And there's nothing HD-DVD, MS, and Toshiba can do about it, especially when their lone exclusive studio, Universal, has essentially left them hanging in the breeze for all intents and purposes.