Microsoft insider confirms: 360 is flawed

[york weir]

Originally Posted by tqlla

The problem would easily be fixed with a bigger chassis.

Its just too cramped for several hot processors.

I think the overall design is just flawed. I used an infrared temp sensor and the heat coming from my PS3 is actually hotter than the 360.

[blu reality]

It amazes me that anyone would buy a 360 with all these problems.

Inferior technology and horrible hardware problems. No wonder the world has rejected the 360!

[tqlla]

Originally Posted by york weir

I think the overall design is just flawed. I used an infrared temp sensor and the heat coming from my PS3 is actually hotter than the 360.

IMO, thats the problem. Heat is leaving the PS3... whereas, it is not leaving the 360.

[Urian]

We must remember that a good part of Microsoft money comes from the OEM market were they can attach the bugs of their applications directly to the hardware vendor, in the case of Xbox 360 the situation is the opposite.

In software world if something is wrong you can patch it, if your product lacks of something important you can add this important thing more later even to your customer base but the problem comes when you are a company of electronic devices and you have to deal with hardware, then is when the problems will start.

[181]

I like how the article writes "customers" as "costumers", as if every sale was staged.

[181]

i forgot that i even replied to this thread...back to work.

[reiella]

Originally Posted by tqlla

The problem would easily be fixed with a bigger chassis.

Its just too cramped for several hot processors.

Well, or a more modernly designed chasis. You can't expect to cram a micro-ATX with a 135nm video card into half the size of a standard shuffle case and not expect problems .

[PS3ds]

Originally Posted by blu reality

It amazes me that anyone would buy a 360 with all these problems...

Now that is the real thing here... we all have known that the 360 is crap for quite sometime, but others just don't get it.

My cousin just got one... you should have seen his eyes when I told him my brother has gone through three CrapBox360s in the last 18 months!!

[Blu-Beard]

Well I can vouch (from my own experiences) for there being truth in them recycling boxes. Quite a few times when I sent mine in for repair for something as minor as the disc tray getting stuck, I recieved a box with a different serial# (and not because it was a new one) and having even more problems. Then all of the arcade games that I'd purchased were only playable when I had an internet connection due to some licensing mumbo jumbo. There was actually one time where I sent it in for repairs and it came right back to me with out even being looked at

[saprano]

This quarter they are expecting 1 M failures

MS was so focused on beating Sony this cycle that the 360 was rushed to market when all indications were that it had serious flaws.

In the end I think it was fear of failure, ambition to beat Sony

Whenever something failed and there was a question about whether the test result was false, they would remove that test, retest and ship, or see if the unit would boot a game and run briefly and then ship.

They would rationalize that if the first few million boxes had a high failure rate, a few 10's of millions of dollars would cover it. And contrasting that cost with a big lead on Sony, would pay it in a heartbeat. They weren't even thinking about Nintendo.

Compare that to Sony, who delayed their launch, even though they were behind, when their box wasn't ready.

wow..................just wow

[Clark Kent]

I don't need a Microsoft insider to tell me that the Xbox 360 is a horribly designed console from an engineering standpoint. The real problem is that the Xbot fans have accepted this as standard procedure. Microsoft due to their various software monopolies can keep throwing money down the well to keep the whole thing afloat.

[york weir]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

I don't need a Microsoft insider to tell me that the Xbox 360 is a horribly designed console from an engineering standpoint. The real problem is that the Xbot fans have accepted this as standard procedure. Microsoft due to their various software monopolies can keep throwing money down the well to keep the whole thing afloat.

I guess it comes down to software, xbox live and the warranty.

If the 360 didn't have good software it would have failed quickly. If xbox live wasn't as strong as it is it would have suffered. If Microsoft would have not taken care of every console suffering from the ring of death it would have failed even quicker.

Besides making the console dependable in the beginning Microsoft has done well to handle the situation. They really need to fix the overall problem instead of patching it though. My guess is they are going to continue to patch it and spend more time on the next 360. The question then becomes, will the people buying the next 360 trust the hardware. I predict a ton of warranties being purchased.

[HDPerfection]

I would think it would be embarrassing to bash another product as if it were the worst thing ever made it shows ignorance and an inability to make sound decisions. I do not care if you have a favorite that’s cool but to try to rip apart other good products seems ridiculous, I wish the forums were limited to a more realistic thinking community. Oh well I guess some people are hard to embarrass or just so ignorant they don't realize it.

[RUR]

Originally Posted by HDPerfection

I would think it would be embarrassing to bash another product as if it were the worst thing ever made.

What I see is a number of folks (some of whom own 360's) rightfully criticizing what certainly appears to be a deficient design/product. Any product with a 30% failure rate (and you, yourself, claim it may be much higher) is hugely deficient.

it shows ignorance and an inability to make sound decisions.

Not sure how that follows. As explained above, the criticisms are based on ample anecdotal evidence, not to mention MS' $1.2B writedown, so it's not like anyone here is ignorant of the facts surrounding the XBox shortcomings.

I do not care if you have a favorite that’s cool but to try to rip apart other good products seems ridiculous,.

Ummm, see above. Do you believe that the XBox is a "good" product, in terms of build quality and reliability?

I wish the forums were limited to a more realistic thinking community. Oh well I guess some people are hard to embarrass or just so ignorant they don't realize it.

You might want to consider having more than 10 posts under your belt before you start insulting the members of this forum. You may even wish to present better arguments before doing so. Remember the Golden Rule.

[HDPerfection]

Originally Posted by RUR

What I see is a number of folks (some of whom own 360's) rightfully criticizing what certainly appears to be a deficient design/product. Any product with a 30% failure rate (and you, yourself, claim it may be much higher) is hugely deficient.

Not sure how that follows. As explained above, the criticisms are based on ample anecdotal evidence, not to mention MS' $1.2B writedown, so it's not like anyone here is ignorant of the facts surrounding the XBox shortcomings.

Ummm, see above. Do you believe that the XBox is a "good" product, in terms of build quality and reliability?

You might want to consider having more than 10 posts under your belt before you start insulting the members of this forum. You may even wish to present better arguments before doing so. Remember the Golden Rule.

Obviously I was not talking to you and ones amount of posts do not substantiate someone’s knowledge....the 360 is a good product as I own 3 of them, Also there is generally loss with any product put out of newer technology.....there are ramifications that some do foresee and do not, Microsoft has been around for along time and take care of their business...its easy to choose a side and run what if blu ray would have had the same types of problems....I am a consumer and don't bash products that don't deserve it.....as I own several 360's and had thousands of dollars worth of fun on them it seems to be to be worth the minor issues....I am new to PS3 and blu and hope to have the same success here....in my opinion there are allot of biased people here....closing your mind seems to be an awful thing.

edit: oh I have more than 10 posts now...will that make things better?

[tqlla]

Originally Posted by york weir

I guess it comes down to software, xbox live and the warranty.

If the 360 didn't have good software it would have failed quickly. If xbox live wasn't as strong as it is it would have suffered. If Microsoft would have not taken care of every console suffering from the ring of death it would have failed even quicker.

Besides making the console dependable in the beginning Microsoft has done well to handle the situation. They really need to fix the overall problem instead of patching it though. My guess is they are going to continue to patch it and spend more time on the next 360. The question then becomes, will the people buying the next 360 trust the hardware. I predict a ton of warranties being purchased.

This is probably the only product where vendors dont make money off of selling extended warranties.

[WickyWoo]

This is probably the only product where vendors dont make money off of selling extended warranties.

Gamestop no longer sells extended warranties on 360

[york weir]

Originally Posted by tqlla

This is probably the only product where vendors dont make money off of selling extended warranties.

I dunno, with microsoft extending the warranty to 3 years would the vendor simply send the unit back for credit?

A little story...

My brother-in-law had his launch console die with the ring of death. He called microsoft to see if they could assist and they could not other than sending a box. He told them not to because he had an extended warranty but they did anyway. He took the defective unit back to the store and got a brand new model, HDMI and all. A few weeks later his unit actually came in the mail totally repaired. He verified the serial number and it matched.

This tells me the store sent the unit back to microsoft and they should have returned it to the store but they actually returned it to my brother-in-law. Because of this I still think the vendors are making money on it.

[HDPerfection]

Originally Posted by york weir

I dunno, with microsoft extending the warranty to 3 years would the vendor simply send the unit back for credit?

A little story...

My brother-in-law had his launch console die with the ring of death. He called microsoft to see if they could assist and they could not other than sending a box. He told them not to because he had an extended warranty but they did anyway. He took the defective unit back to the store and got a brand new model, HDMI and all. A few weeks later his unit actually came in the mail totally repaired. He verified the serial number and it matched.

This tells me the store sent the unit back to microsoft and they should have returned it to the store but they actually returned it to my brother-in-law. Because of this I still think the vendors are making money on it.

Microsoft is doing their own repairs depending on the reason for failure...if for some reason you 360 died for another reason than the general faults your warranty would have to cover it

[RUR]

Originally Posted by HDPerfection

...ones amount of posts do not substantiate someone’s knowledge?

Often, it does.

...the 360 is a good product as I own 3 of them

How many you own or your personal experience is not a good indicator of product quality. A 30% failure rate is.

...Also there is generally loss with any product put out of newer technology.....there are ramifications that some do foresee and do not, Microsoft has been around for along time and take care of their business

I've been in product development of similar technologies on a far larger scale for over 30 years. Well-run companies don't "foresee" ramifications, they employ design, qualification test and production process control practices which eliminate the types of issues which result in 30% failure rates. If they didn't, they wouldn't be in business for long. The fact that MS had to write down $1.2B isn't a ringing endorsement of their ability to design and produce a reliable product.

...its easy to choose a side and run what if blu ray would have had the same types of problems....I am a consumer and don't bash products that don't deserve it.....as I own several 360's and had thousands of dollars worth of fun on them it seems to be to be worth the minor issues....

You're new, so perhaps you're unaware that members here often "bash Products", as you say, made by Blu-ray CE's and with equal fervor. The truth is the XBox 360 richly deserves criticism of its poor reliability, and it's hardly a "minor" issue.

...I am new to PS3 and blu and hope to have the same success here....in my opinion there are allot of biased people here....closing your mind seems to be an awful thing.

I don't see much close-mindedness in this thread, and this thread is what we're discussing. If you're referring to the forum, in general, start a different thread about the bias of this site. Should be entertaining.

edit: oh I have more than 10 posts now...will that make things better?

You know it doesn't, and your sarcasm merely serves to reinforce my earlier impression. Insulting members after 10 posts on your first day here demonstrates a lack of maturity or judgement.