The Criterion Collection - Page 2069 - Blu-ray Forum

drbikeshorts · 12-11-2011, 04:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dag

Thanks for the advice, everyone. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to "move" the firmware update from my computer to the disc; I always got a message saying that there was a "problem", and pressing Retry always gave me that message. So formatting my own disc has proven unsuccessful.

My assumption is that my BD player does need an upgrade and that it isn't the Criterion blu-ray disc that is the problem. Tonight I watched Captain America (ridiculous) and had no problem. As I mentioned earlier, the other F&A two discs that came with the rental loaded without difficulty, but perhaps that 5 1/2 hour television version is just too much? I don't know.

I'll call Panasonic on Monday, and I think they can mail me a disc with the firmware. Perhaps I'll wait until some time in the new year before renting the movie again, but I really do want to see the television version.

To anyone her who watches Fanny & Alexander: enjoy the movie, and hopefully I'll be able to share my thoughts about it in the coming months.

This doesn't sound like a firmware problem at all. If 2 out of 3 disc work, then I'd be concluding that it's the third disc that has a problem.
Criterion discs really don't require the latest firmware - I haven't updated mine for ages.
Also, you say you played Captain America with no problem.
You probably should update your firmware (so should I

), but don't hold your breath that it will fix this specific problem.
I'd be wondering if anyone else has encountered this problem with that particular disc using similar equipment...

Criterion Collector · 12-11-2011, 05:08 AM

I am of the thought that a majority of the people who collect Criterion films would choose the BD over a DVD copy almost every time, unless money/cost was the deciding factor. If that were taken out of the equation, then I believe that no one would pick the DVD over the BD, once they understood the differences in the two technologies.

IMO, the high quality transfers that Criterion are known for, is their number one calling card. The bonus features are just icing on an already delicious cake, so to speak.

Why would a "film buff" type of person not want to have the best quality presentation available? Why would collectors buy the Criterion BD of The Third Man, Dazed and Confused, or Fear & Loathing, (for some examples), rather than buying their lower cost, non-Criterion counterparts? I believe this is due to the superior transfers...I could be wrong, but that is my personal reason for choosing Criterion.

I know that quite a few collectors are drawn to the collection for the special features as well. That too, would most certainly sway buyers to pick up the Criterion edition vs. the "other guys" release. In that instance, I could see the DVD copy being "good enough" but ultimately, I feel it all boils down to the presentation of the actual film. That presentation needs to be the best it can be with today's technology.

In the end, it doesn't really matter to me how another person builds their Criterion collection. Whether it be LDs, DVDs, or BDs...just as long as they give their collection the love it deserves.

Trekkie313 · 12-11-2011, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Criterion Collector

I am of the thought that a majority of the people who collect Criterion films would choose the BD over a DVD copy almost every time, unless money/cost was the deciding factor. If that were taken out of the equation, then I believe that no one would pick the DVD over the BD, once they understood the differences in the two technologies.

IMO, the high quality transfers that Criterion are known for, is their number one calling card. The bonus features are just icing on an already delicious cake, so to speak.

Why would a "film buff" type of person not want to have the best quality presentation available? Why would collectors buy the Criterion BD of The Third Man, Dazed and Confused, or Fear & Loathing, (for some examples), rather than buying their lower cost, non-Criterion counterparts? I believe this is due to the superior transfers...I could be wrong, but that is my personal reason for choosing Criterion.

I know that quite a few collectors are drawn to the collection for the special features as well. That too, would most certainly sway buyers to pick up the Criterion edition vs. the "other guys" release. In that instance, I could see the DVD copy being "good enough" but ultimately, I feel it all boils down to the presentation of the actual film. That presentation needs to be the best it can be with today's technology.

In the end, it doesn't really matter to me how another person builds their Criterion collection. Whether it be LDs, DVDs, or BDs...just as long as they give their collection the love it deserves.

I cam import quite a few of the more expensive or OOP titles that are region free for less than buying the Criterion version. Many have nearly the same special features and PQ.

Criterion Collector · 12-11-2011, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trekkie313

I cam import quite a few of the more expensive or OOP titles that are region free for less than buying the Criterion version. Many have nearly the same special features and PQ.

That is a great idea, and a great way to get films that would otherwise be expensive/difficult to obtain.

Don't get me wrong here folks, I have no problems with non-Criterion editions of films. I also have no problem with VHS, LD, or DVD either. If you really like a movie and want to own a copy of it, it doesn't matter whats printed on the packaging, or the format you choose.

If you cannot get the Criterion edition of whatever film for any reason (it's oop, etc.) then by all means, order up the non-Criterion edition, make a VHS copy from a cable broadcast (that is how I built almost my entire movie "library" when I was young), get the laser disc, or whatever, and enjoy life.

Love your collection for the content, not the packaging. In the end, who cares? As long as you are happy with your collection, that is all that really matters.

I don't care if a guy has three movies in his collection, and all of those are dubbed from the t.v. in "SLP" mode to fit onto a single VHS tape. If those three movies are his favorite three movies ever made, and that was the only way he had to get them, and he is happy just to have those copies...then his collection is awesome!

For me, personally, I just like having the "best" copy I can obtain (within reason). Sometimes that means scaling back my purchases to be able to afford the Criterion edition. Life is full of compromises, that is one I am willing to make.

In the end, we must all remember, it's the love of film, not technology (although that is nice too) that brings us together on this forum.

tenia · 12-11-2011, 08:48 AM

I had to say that I made my parents buy me a Panny BDT-110 when they were in holidays in the USA so I could import Criterions.

I've never have any issue with any disc I've tried on it, including the TV F&A. And the BDT-110 is a quite low-end player, and it went through the whole luggage trip.

EricJ · 12-11-2011, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROclockCK

It was. It is! But that's coming from someone who grew up with this movie in the context of 60s science, politics, and moviemaking.

Despite 2001: a space odyssey and Planet of the Apes, and to a lesser degree Fantastic Voyage, the pre-moon landing era wasn't especially good for speculative fiction on film. Most of it was just 'sciffy' formula: Take a handful of guys, an obligatory babe, launch them toward ______, and toss in a BEM* for middle-act conflict. Destroy the BEM, fire retros, and head home.

Oh, and some point in between, have the crew learn some late-50's Message of how the alien civilization clearly destroyed itself by letting its technology get out of control...Can't leave that part out, for the "credibility".

EricJ · 12-11-2011, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dag

Thanks for the advice, everyone. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to "move" the firmware update from my computer to the disc; I always got a message saying that there was a "problem", and pressing Retry always gave me that message. So formatting my own disc has proven unsuccessful.

My assumption is that my BD player does need an upgrade and that it isn't the Criterion blu-ray disc that is the problem.
I'll call Panasonic on Monday, and I think they can mail me a disc with the firmware.

Um...your BD player doesn't connect to the Internet?
(I've got a PS3, but I'm assuming the "regular" players do, too.)

And I'm not sure which Captain America you saw, but I'm guessing it must've been the '90 Golan/Globus version, since that's the only "ridiculous' one I know of.

Oblivion138 · 12-11-2011, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricJ

And I'm not sure which Captain America you saw, but I'm guessing it must've been the '90 Golan/Globus version, since that's the only "ridiculous' one I know of.

Both of the 1979 TV pilots with Reb Brown were pretty ridiculous, too.

Though still more enjoyable than that godawful 1990 film. Hard to believe that anything that came out of J.D. Salinger could be as awful as his son was in the role of Cap.

Icemouth · 12-11-2011, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Criterion Collector

I am of the thought that a majority of the people who collect Criterion films would choose the BD over a DVD copy almost every time, unless money/cost was the deciding factor. If that were taken out of the equation, then I believe that no one would pick the DVD over the BD, once they understood the differences in the two technologies.

IMO, the high quality transfers that Criterion are known for, is their number one calling card. The bonus features are just icing on an already delicious cake, so to speak.

Why would a "film buff" type of person not want to have the best quality presentation available? Why would collectors buy the Criterion BD of The Third Man, Dazed and Confused, or Fear & Loathing, (for some examples), rather than buying their lower cost, non-Criterion counterparts? I believe this is due to the superior transfers...I could be wrong, but that is my personal reason for choosing Criterion.

I know that quite a few collectors are drawn to the collection for the special features as well. That too, would most certainly sway buyers to pick up the Criterion edition vs. the "other guys" release. In that instance, I could see the DVD copy being "good enough" but ultimately, I feel it all boils down to the presentation of the actual film. That presentation needs to be the best it can be with today's technology.

In the end, it doesn't really matter to me how another person builds their Criterion collection. Whether it be LDs, DVDs, or BDs...just as long as they give their collection the love it deserves.

Of course if they had both formats, but the majority won't rebuy a Criterion that they own on DVD on Blu-Ray.

Keep in mind that Criterion collectors are already a niche, and then take a (larger) niche of Blu-Ray, and there's obviously more DVD Criterion collectors than Blu-Ray Criterion collectors, and even less upgraders.

BohemianGraham · 12-11-2011, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Dalek

I agree based on my own experience with a 13" TV most of my life (up to a 36" now) and listening to films on headphones at night and in the morning to avoid the ire of neighbors. Watching a letterboxed VHS on a 13" CRT...those were the days (the actual film image being about the same size as an envelope), and yet I saw many amazing films that way. I am more than happy with the set-up I have now, which is modest-to-laughable by most standards on this site.

Not only is it about experiencing the film by any means necessary for the viewer, but it also shows that a great film can overcome any crappy video set-up.

36" is nothing to sneer at. Not everyone can afford or wants a huge widescreen TV due to a number of reasons. I only have a 42" one myself, and no surrond sound (the horror, the horror!) because I live in an apartment.
I had a 13" one for the longest time, and had to use a converter box to hook up a DVD player to it. I bought a cheap Citizen 20" CRTafter my first year of university (which amazing still works after my brother rolled it off the bed when he was moving it one day), and I was borrowing my parents old 32" CRT before I bought mine. It's sitting in a corner as an end table, but my mom said she's coming in at the end of the week to finally take it from me to use as a spare.

Heck, I'm still using VCR, and I have a Sega Genesis and Nintendo Gamecube on my 42". I have 4 VHS tapes I still watch. They don't look pretty, but it's better than paying an arm and a leg for the DVDs, which are out of print, when the BD upgrade should be happening soon. Stupid Disney. VCR does not look pretty on a HDTV.

For everyone asking about army of Shadows, I highly recommend it as a blind buy. It's a compelling story, and I couldn't get over at how much Simone Signoret had aged in the 14 years after Diabolique was made. Paul Meurisse, her co-star, still looked the same. I had a discussion with my friend about how awesome it was, and how glad I was that Hollywood didn't get their grubby little paws on it, as it would have been full of explosions, all the Resistance members would be a lot better looking and younger, and Gerbier and Mathide would have slept together or something, since Hollywood can't straight-up adapt anything anymore.

However, I'm just thinking the worst.

Call me cheap, but I only began buying Criterions once they hit BD because I found them to be a lot more affordable. A lot of people on here can be a bit rude about people paying more than 20 for a Criterion, but really, it's a great deal when you look at how much their films used to cost, and what they still cost in Canada.

I've wanted to buy their editions for years, but I couldn't justify 70 dollars for a DVD, because of a wacky C on it. Back then 35 was as high as I'd go for a DVD. I've bumped it to 40 for a BD. I thought I was doing great with finding a used copy of Brazil (single disc) in the Rogers store on Adelaide Street in London, Ontario when I was up doing my MLIS, for 10 bucks.

Of course, that was before I found out Canadians can order from Amazon.com and B&N. I'm more inclined to buy the Criterion BDs because they are cheaper than their DVD counterparts (Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas is still 60 dollars in Canada for the DVD, the BD is 35

), and you always run the risk of Criterion announcing an upgrade.

SlickDamian · 12-11-2011, 04:32 PM

I guess I'm late on the My Criterion train, but here's my collection:

http://www.criterion.com/my_criterio...ian/collection

ROclockCK · 12-11-2011, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricJ

Oh, and some point in between, have the crew learn some late-50's Message of how the alien civilization clearly destroyed itself by letting its technology get out of control...Can't leave that part out, for the "credibility".

Oh yes EricJ. The obligatory "faux seal of thematic integrity".

jcs913 · 12-11-2011, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icemouth

Of course if they had both formats, but the majority won't rebuy a Criterion that they own on DVD on Blu-Ray.

Keep in mind that Criterion collectors are already a niche, and then take a (larger) niche of Blu-Ray, and there's obviously more DVD Criterion collectors than Blu-Ray Criterion collectors, and even less upgraders.

Thanks Icemouth, as the bold was my original point in starting.
We are skewed on this site, considering that we are already a fan of the technology and crave it where we can, but the original post was 'why do they even make a dvd version, especially with the Eclipse sets.' In my interaction with different Criterion followers, this seems to be the case. We need to step outside this site and realize that the overwhelming majority of Criterion fans are dvd owners exclusively. It may seem silly to us due to the influence of this site, but many have dvd collections already and will gladly buy the film on dvd over BD, as the film/extras is what they want. You see so many dvd copies being sold on ebay for a good price, because these collectors and film fans can fill their shelves cheaply, as opposed to paying retail. A $12 copy of The Lady Vanishes on ebay is a great deal to someone that does not see paying $20 for a new blu-ray version. The upgraders are the ones feeding this market and the original dvd Criterion followers are feeding off this.

oildude · 12-11-2011, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Dalek

I love commentaries. Most that I've listened to have been interesting to me. Sometimes stepping back from the narrative and watching a film purely for the imagery is also revealing. It saddens me that Criterion seem to be doing less and less of them, but it also seems that most people never listen to them.

Of course, I've also watched Star Wars with the French audio turned on for something different...

Darth Vader speaks French?? Mon Dieu!!

retablo · 12-11-2011, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icemouth

Of course if they had both formats, but the majority won't rebuy a Criterion that they own on DVD on Blu-Ray.

Keep in mind that Criterion collectors are already a niche, and then take a (larger) niche of Blu-Ray, and there's obviously more DVD Criterion collectors than Blu-Ray Criterion collectors, and even less upgraders.

I re-buy everything on blu. Why? Because it's better. Does everyone? Probably not... but I still argue that cinephiles - i.e., the ones who generally collect Criterion and other niche titles - are the ones most interested in presentation. They are the ones who spend money on high-end setups because they love cinema... the average moviegoer doesn't care about presentation as much, hence why so many still haven't adopted blu-ray. Who has? The cinephiles. And who's more likely to upgrade to blu IF they already have the DVD? The cinephiles.

AreaUnderTheCurve · 12-11-2011, 06:54 PM