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We should keep in mind that the Ring is the physical representation of Evil - which in the story is the equivalent of Power - that is, the complete domination of others to one's will without empathy. All of these characters - Gandalf, Frodo, Galadriel, Aragorn, Elrond, Gollum, Denethor, Saruman, Boromir, and even Sam - were tempted by the Ring. Saruman, Gollum, Denethor, and Boromir failed because their personalities would not permit them to yield to the temptation of power. Others (Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel, Aragorn, and Faramir) were saved by virtue of intelligence and good nature. Sam was saved by his inherent good nature and "plain hobbit-sense", as it is called in the book. Although good, Frodo failed because the physical and mental toll taken upon him due to the quest had left him unable to resist at the end. Therefore, he was saved (for lack of a better phrase) by divine providence.
The point of the story and moral significance of the Ring being presented to each of these major characters can easily be extended to the modern "real" world; heads of organizations, politicians, and ultimately to we as the viewers (readers), as Tolkien often alluded to in his personal writings. The resulting question is, "What would you do when offered the temptation of Power?"
We should keep in mind that the Ring is the physical representation of Evil - which in the story is the equivalent of Power - that is, the complete domination of others to one's will without empathy. All of these characters - Gandalf, Frodo, Galadriel, Aragorn, Elrond, Gollum, Denethor, Saruman, Boromir, and even Sam - were tempted by the Ring. Saruman, Gollum, Denethor, and Boromir failed because their personalities would not permit them to yield to the temptation of power. Others (Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel, Aragorn, and Faramir) were saved by virtue of intelligence and good nature. Sam was saved by his inherent good nature and "plain hobbit-sense", as it is called in the book. Although good, Frodo failed because the physical and mental toll taken upon him due to the quest had left him unable to resist at the end. Therefore, he was saved (for lack of a better phrase) by divine providence.
The point of the story and moral significance of the Ring being presented to each of these major characters can easily be extended to the modern "real" world; heads of organizations, politicians, and ultimately to we as the viewers (readers), as Tolkien often alluded to in his personal writings. The resulting question is, "What would you do when offered the temptation of Power?"
Perfectly worded GB! Your posts are always a real treat for me to read. I think this site should upgrade you from Blu-ray Samurai to Resident Tolkien Scholar.
Perfectly worded GB! Your posts are always a real treat for me to read. I think this site should upgrade you from Blu-ray Samurai to Resident Tolkien Scholar.
I look to Grand Bob everytime some sort of questions about these books come to my mind, he is like a Tolkien scholar in my book
So Bilbo could surrender the Ring, Sam could surrender the Ring, Gandalf could refuse the Ring, and Galadriel could refuse the Ring, and even Aragorn could refuse the Ring, and all of that is okay, but if Faramir refused the Ring, then it would have stripped it of it's power.
Don't get me wrong, I love the movies, and I realize that they can coexist with the books. The books are still the books, and always will be, and the movie is like an alternate reality to the books, which is fine, but I just don't buy that Faramir had to be portayed that way, or the story would've collapsed in on it's self. I think that they just changed it because they wanted to, and also to ratchet up the tension, which is what a lot of their changes seem to be intended to do.
From what I heard, Faramir says this of the Ring in the book: "I would not pick it up, if it lay by the wayside". Almost every other character recognized the threat it would pose, while the younger son of the greedy Denethor just ignores it? That's quite a bit of an anti-climax, at least in my opinion. That's also why the ending of the third film was changed, because Gollum simply falls off the cliff in the book.
From what I heard, Faramir says this of the Ring in the book: "I would not pick it up, if it lay by the wayside". Almost every other character recognized the threat it would pose, while the younger son of the greedy Denethor just ignores it? That's quite a bit of an anti-climax, at least in my opinion.
The difference is that Boromir, like his father, is political, while Faramir is not. Therefore, despite the fact that he is of far less age and wisdom than say, Gandalf, Faramir wants nothing to do with any "heirloom" of Sauron, recognizing that it would be inherently Evil. Consequently his "I would not pick it up" quote, even if it means temporarily saving the kingdom. Of course, this point is lost in the film.
Quote:
That's also why the ending of the third film was changed, because Gollum simply falls off the cliff in the book.
I'm not sure if I understand this, because IMO, the last part of the film that involves Gollum agrees closely with the book.
From what I heard, Faramir says this of the Ring in the book: "I would not pick it up, if it lay by the wayside". Almost every other character recognized the threat it would pose, while the younger son of the greedy Denethor just ignores it? That's quite a bit of an anti-climax, at least in my opinion. That's also why the ending of the third film was changed, because Gollum simply falls off the cliff in the book.
That's just because Faramir is a hell of a man.
I do agree that line may not have worked in the movies, but in the books, Faramir is a very noble, intelligent, yet kindly man, and he is one of my favorite characters. In the movies, they made him a lesser man, who seems to be more self serving, less noble, and mean spirited, and then he becomes all snivelly and sad.
I think David Wenham was a great choice for Faramir, and like I said earlier, I have come to accept the movies as an alternate reality to the books, and I really do love them. They are some of my absolute favorite movies, but I would've prefered to have a more noble Faramir.
I'm not sure if I understand this, because IMO, the last part of the film that involves Gollum agrees closely with the book.
Not really. Like I said, I haven't read the books, but I've read and heard a lot about them. Apparently, Gollum simply loses his balance, and falls into the crack of Doom with the Ring. Jackson & Co. tried filming it that way, but felt it defeated the point of Frodo's journey. Then, another version was done, where Frodo angrily shoves Gollum off the cliff to destroy the Ring; the filmmakers later realized it looked too much like murder. So, finally, we got the version where Frodo and Gollum fight over the Ring, both falling off, but Frodo manages to hang onto the cliff, while Gollum dies in the lava.
Looks like I have plans on watching the Lord of the Rings Blu-ray collection this coming weekend. Right now, I'm watching the Stargate Atlantis series.
Yes, it did. Sam clearly hesitated to return the Ring to Frodo, and his expression makes it clear that it wasn't just from worrying about his friend. Galadriel never had it in her possession, either, but she went psycho when Frodo offered it to her. Gandalf refused the Ring, knowing what it would do, and while Bilbo surrendered it on his own, he was clearly affected, too.
Galadriel had her own Ring of Power, as did Gandalf.
Their powers combined (CAPTAIN PLANET!) ...sorry...
along with The One Ring would corrupt them. They would actually be worse than Sauron. If i understood the books correctly...
I never took it as him doing anything but worrying about Frodo...
From a website:
The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring: Part 1
Info:
To separate Peter Jackson’s “The Lord of the Rings” trilogy into six parts that adhere as closely as possible to the six books of J.R.R. Tolkien’s “The Lord of the Rings”. This is done by both restructuring the films to match the narrative structure found in Tolkien’s book, and by removing as much as possible of the material that has no basis in Tolkien’s vision of Middle-Earth. For Book I, that chiefly involved removing the prologue and the Saruman subplot, as well as to end the edit at the fords of Bruinen.
Edit list:
- There is no prologue. Like in the book, this edit begins on a less serious note (Bilbo’s party etc.), and only later do we learn the importance of the Ring. Parts of the prologue have been inserted elsewhere, which I’ll point out when we get there.
- New title sequence. Just to give the edit a unique feel, really. Before the company credits and film title (which has been changed to “J.R.R Tolkien’s The Lord of the Rings”), Christopher Lee recites the Ring Verse.
- “Book I — The Return of the Shadow” title added over Frodo reading in the forest.
- Gandalf’s ride through Hobbiton has been reworked to remove Bilbo’s narration and include some shots from the theatrical version. Just because I preferred the theatrical version — it gives a better introduction to both Gandalf and Frodo, and Bilbo’s narration that replaced those scenes in the EE is really quite pointless. In order to make this work, a continuity issue arises: After they ride over the bridge, they are seen riding through the fields (which replaces a shot from the theatrical that was used in an earlier scene in the EE), then in the next shot they are riding through the marketplace seen to be on the other side of the bridge. I don’t consider it that big a deal, though, since the continuity of that sequence was rather murky to begin with.
- Bilbo is not seen panicking over having “lost” the ring. As in the book, the importance of the ring is not emphasized until after the party.
- As Gandalf reads Isildur’s account, the Battle of the Last Alliance from the prologue is seen, unnarrated. In order to remove the narration, the sequence has been shortened slightly.
- Removed the shot of the Black Rider on the hilltop after Frodo and Sam see the wood-elves. Frodo and Sam don’t know as of yet that they are being hunted. In order to follow the book, neither should the audience.
- Removed all the Isengard sequences. As in the book, that encounter is retold in Book II, and we have no idea of what’s happened to Gandalf until then.
- Merry doesn’t distract the Black Rider with the bag of vegetables. Both because it’s not in the book, and (mostly) because I find it silly.
- The Hobbits do not encounter a Black Rider on their way to the ferry. The Riders are heard, but not seen until one comes chasing after Frodo as he runs to the ferry. To make the Black Riders more frightening and less incompetent. Also, not in the book.
- Shots of “scary” inhabitants of Bree have been cut. Peter Jackson seems to think that Bree should be a frightening place, but it wasn’t in the book, so I’ve tried to make it a bit less ominous.
- The Inn of the Prancing Pony has been recolored. Originally, it was tinted with a sickly yellow. I’ve made it a bit warmer to make the inn seem more pleasant.
- Shots of “scary” people at the inn have been cut. Again, to make Bree a little less ominous.
- Cut Sauron’s line “I see you!”. Not in the book. In fact, in the book, the Eye is not even aware of Frodo until Amon Hen, and doesn’t “see” him until he claims the ring at the Cracks of Doom. In PJ’s movies, it seems that Sauron discovers Frodo all the time, which undermines his role as a villain. So in this edit, he just says to Frodo that he “cannot hide”, but without discovering his exact location.
- Removed shots of sleeping Hobbits that were intercut with the Black Riders. A cheap and unnecessary way to heighten tension.
- Arwen doesn’t catch Aragorn off his guard. To lessen Arwen’s importance and make her seem lees like Xena the Warrior Princess and more like the elf maiden she’s supposed to be.
- Added subtitles for “Frodo FÃ�r” (“Frodo is dying.”) and “Be iest lÃ�n” (“As you wish”).
- Cut Sam’s lines “What are you doing!? Those wraiths are still out there!”. To quote faneditforum-member spelledaren, “Why is Sam so stupid?”
- Cut the Witch-King’s “Give up the Halfling, she-elf!” and Arwen’s “If you want himâ€� Come and claim him!”. Again, I feel it makes Arwen too much of an action-heroine.
- Arwen doesn’t summon the flood at the ford. Both to lessen Arwen’s importance, and because it’s not in the book — where it was Elrond and Gandalf who summoned the flood.
- Cut Arwen’s line “What grace is given me, let it pass to him”. Both to lessen her importance, and because I haven’t the slightest clue what it’s supposed to mean.
- As Arwen cradles the unconscious Frodo in her arms, we fade to “End of Book I”. Like the book, this edit ends with Frodo falling unconscious at the fords of Bruinen.
The new version of Book I is finished and uploaded. The following changes have been made from the first DVD release:
- The title sequence has been changed to match the style used for Books V and VI
- Gandalf’s line about the “long-expected party” has been cut to allow for a smoother audio transition
- Cut some of Bilbo’s speech, going directly from “I don’t know half of you half as well as I should like, and like less than half of you half as well as you deserve” (or however that line goes…) to “I regret to announce this is the end”, without the mumbling in-between
- The Last Alliance flashback has been extended to include the establishing shot of the marching armies and a shot of Elendil wielding Narsil
- Shots of the Wood Elves have been flipped to fix a continuity error
- Cut Pippin’s “Oh, that was close” and Merry’s bit with the carrot after their stumble down the cliff
- Cut Frodo seeing the Eye at the inn
- Cut Aragorn throwing his torch at a Ringwraith
- Cut Sam’s line “Look Frodo, it’s Mr. Bilbo’s trolls!”
- The flight to the ford has been shortened somewhat
- Also, this release has a higher video bitrate than the first one, and the audio work has been improved throughout
in the books, Faramir is a very noble, intelligent, yet kindly man, and he is one of my favorite characters. In the movies, they made him a lesser man, who seems to be more self serving, less noble, and mean spirited, and then he becomes all snivelly and sad.
The movie certainly adds drama, but at what cost? As an example, take a line of dialogue common to both. The Ring is at last revealed to Faramir, and having Frodo and Sam cornered, he says: "A chance for Faramir, Captain of Gondor, to show his quality."
In the original story, realizing that evil means lead to evil ends, Faramir ensures that Frodo and Sam know that they have nothing to fear, and in fact he offers them assistance. From The Two Towers: 'Sam hesitated for a moment, then bowing very low: 'Good night, Captain, my lord,' he said. 'You took the chance, sir.'
'Did I so?' said Faramir.
'Yes, sir, and showed your quality: the very highest'.
Faramir smiled. 'A pert servant, Master Samwise. But nay: the praise of the praiseworthy is above all rewards. Yet there was naught in this to praise. I had no lure or desire to do other than I have done.'
In the movie version, Faramir rather easily succumbs to the temptation of the Ring and the quote "... a chance for Faramir, Captain of Gondor, to show his quality" now has exactlly the opposite meaning from the original story and is said in mockery of himself. He leads Frodo and Sam towards Minas Tirith, when they are attacked in Osgiliath. Apparently, Frodo has prematurely lost his will (and wits), because he offers the Ring to the Witch-king before Sam knocks him down to his senses. Faramir finally recants and informs him that now "we understand one another" while in another questionable scene we see Gollum looking "remorseful", even though he has been senselessly beaten by Faramir's men (with more to come). This remorsefulness doesn't last long, as a few minutes later he is visualizing Shelob killing Frodo and Sam.
Of course, to those who haven't read or don't particularly care about the original story, this is a moot point. But for those who have, is the movie more dramatic? Yes, and what is cooler than another battle and seeing the Witch-king on a flying monster. But... better?
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Your posts are always a real treat for me to read. I think this site should upgrade you from Blu-ray Samurai to Resident Tolkien Scholar. 
Faramir finally recants and informs him that now "we understand one another" while in another questionable scene we see Gollum looking "remorseful", even though he has been senselessly beaten by Faramir's men (with more to come). This remorsefulness doesn't last long, as a few minutes later he is visualizing Shelob killing Frodo and Sam.
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