The Official Paradigm Speakers Thread

[Yahzi]

Thanks GAWD. Made my decision a little easier. I think I'll be pulling the trigger on the cc690 with Studio 20's and ADP590 surrounds. Most likely will get an SVS SB12 NSD.

[Yahzi]

Does anyone use the J23 stands for the Paradigm Studion 20v5's? I notice quite a few people use the J29's. Just wondering, as those stands are quite tall.

[GAWD]

Originally Posted by Yahzi

Does anyone use the J23 stands for the Paradigm Studion 20v5's? I notice quite a few people use the J29's. Just wondering, as those stands are quite tall.

I have the J29 for my 20s. Puts them at a good level for me. See which ones you like better.

[GAWD]

Originally Posted by Yahzi

Thanks GAWD. Made my decision a little easier. I think I'll be pulling the trigger on the cc690 with Studio 20's and ADP590 surrounds. Most likely will get an SVS SB12 NSD.

If this is for movies and you have the space look into the PB12. If you need a smaller footprint then yeah the SB will be just perfect.

[Yahzi]

Originally Posted by GAWD

I have the J29 for my 20s. Puts them at a good level for me. See which ones you like better.

I don't know which one to go for. Some pictures show the J29 to be really tall, other pictures show the J23 to be just right. But then other pictures show the opposite, and the J23's are too small.

Could you please send me pictures of your Studio 20's on J29's?

If this is for movies and you have the space look into the PB12. If you need a smaller footprint then yeah the SB will be just perfect.

Well I will be living in an apartment. Single 2 seater couch. To be honest I think a single SB12 will probably be WAY overkill since I most likely won't be able to use 50% of it's capability, but I was told that for music especially, it's a great performer. Movies, pretty darn good given how small it is.

The Velodyne EQ Max 15 is no slouch, with it's larger ported cabinet and 15" driver, but what's interesting is that you would need two of them to match the clean output down to 20 Hz compared to a single SB12. This is according to the CEA-2010 Output tests, so I think it's probably going to be more than I need, but I'm okay with that.

[GAWD]

Wont be able to get pics of the stands but sit and take measurements. See which ones would put the tweeter at ear level.

You're right, if it's a smaller room get the SB and not PB. I had 2 PB12 in an 18x20 and they were fine but took up WAY too much room. Sold those and am in the process of building 4x 18". Those boxes are 24x24x24 which isn't all that small either.

The choices you made are great. I love my 20s and always will. Had the v2, v3 and now have the v4 and v5.

I've never heard the 690 but it's a beast in itself.

The J29s are a little pricey but I do like the fact that you can screw the speaker to them.

Other than that...when u get them sit back and enjoy....don't keep changning and upgrading like the rest of us

Don't know if you're heading down the road of external amps or not...don't bother. The 20s don't need that much juice and the ADPs won't either. MAAAAAYBE the 690 but listen to it first before someone suggests an Emotiva or anything like that.

I've been through so many freaking different amps....in the end it all sounds the same. I sold my Emotivas, got Crown XLS amps put over 1k back in my pocket and guess what? Still sounds the same. Only reason I like external amps is because of the little blue lights...NOTHING ELSE

[Yahzi]

Thanks GAWD. I've participated in a number of these "all amps sound the same" discussions and I also agree that for the most part, amplifiers that are well designed and are working within clean operating limits will sound the same.

I'm buying a Denon X4000 receiver soon, which includes Audyssey XT32 and has more power than I'll probably ever use, especially in a flat. Pity you can't send me pics of your J29 stands, but I'll do some measurements.

Sometimes it's nice to see the stands as well, especially with the same speakers, but I'll do the measurements and see which might suit be better. Thanks again for all your advice! Much appreciated.

[deltadube]

Originally Posted by GAWD

I've been through so many freaking different amps....in the end it all sounds the same. I sold my Emotivas, got Crown XLS amps put over 1k back in my pocket and guess what? Still sounds the same. Only reason I like external amps is because of the little blue lights...NOTHING ELSE

wow have to disagree.. amps really improve your dynamics..

xpa 1s really make my 100s sing .. you need lots of head room
for great sound...

cheers

[deltadube]

Originally Posted by Yahzi

Thanks GAWD. I've participated in a number of these "all amps sound the same" discussions and I also agree that for the most part, amplifiers that are well designed and are working within clean operating limits will sound the same.

I'm buying a Denon X4000 receiver soon, which includes Audyssey XT32 and has more power than I'll probably ever use, especially in a flat. Pity you can't send me pics of your J29 stands, but I'll do some measurements.

Sometimes it's nice to see the stands as well, especially with the same speakers, but I'll do the measurements and see which might suit be better. Thanks again for all your advice! Much appreciated.

with a denon x4000 you will need some external amps if you want good
sound quality... that model has that same power as the old 3313 ci
125wpc for 2 channels only 5 channels is 80wpc
you need lost of power for a great sounding system..

cheers

[deltadube]

Had a great visit with a Paradigm Manager at my house..

liked sound of my system..

asked me if i would like to become a paradigm beta test.. for sure!

Told me Paradigm is bringing out a new high end speaker line out
top pair around the 20k mark..

375 lbs each..

like to try those out !

cheers

[GAWD]

Originally Posted by deltadube

wow have to disagree.. amps really improve your dynamics..

xpa 1s really make my 100s sing .. you need lots of head room
for great sound...

cheers

We can agree to disagree

My crown amp is putting out 375 watts, more than the xpa 2 did and 300 more than my Anthem does. All the same but the hundreds do need more power.

But selling the Emos did pay off my subs. And you want a real night and day difference get 4 of the biggest baddest subs u can think of and install a seatbelt in ur listening chair

Btw if you do think more power helps, one Crown xls 2000 bridged wil put out over a thousand wattts. Two of those will cost less than one xpa1

A one thousand dollar saving makes ME sing!!

[Yahzi]

Originally Posted by deltatube

with a denon x4000 you will need some external amps if you want good sound quality... that model has that same power as the old 3313 ci
125wpc for 2 channels only 5 channels is 80wpc
you need lost of power for a great sounding system..

That I need an external amp is an assumption. How do you know what my listening levels are, how far I'm seated from my speakers or what my room size is? Or what content I'm listening to? How much power a speaker needs is dependent on all these things and you have NO idea how loud I listen in my room. No idea at all.

Here are some facts for you. I'll be sitting 2 meters away from the speakers. I live in a flat. The Studio 20's are easy speakers to drive. The Denon X4000 produces around 120-130 watts into an 8 ohm load. That is plenty.

The idea that you NEED an external amp is based on what? If you don't listen at high volumes then you don't need high power because the speakers will never require it. Another fact for you is that I don't listen at high volume levels. Even 50 watts would push me over 100 dB at my seated distance and that's loud!

The final fact for you is that all channels driven is a simulated load - ie there is NEVER a case where an amplifier is delivering equal power into all channels simultaneously. Not one. Amplifiers on a test bench using sine waves for all channels is not a true reflection of what kind of power will be used under normal conditions, using normal music and/or movies.

So please, get your facts in order before you dictate to me what you think I NEED. People who just assert themselves and make ridiculous claims demonstrate how poorly informed they are. I don't NEED a power amp based on MY requirements. Perhaps you NEED it, based on yours, but certainly not based on mine.

[Yahzi]

Originally Posted by deltatube

125wpc for 2 channels only 5 channels is 80wpc

So what? Power is logarithmic, so even if all channels driven produced less power, give me one single example in a movie that requires simultaneous high power in all channels. Just one. Please find me the source material for this.

People who look at these all channels driven tests thinking that THAT is a true reflection of reality are in over their heads. Movies and music are not steady state sine waves. The amp is not constantly putting out high power into all channels, there is nowhere NEAR that amount of stress while using movies and/or music. In fact I'd wager typical content stresses an amplifier out 3-4x LESS than what you see on the test bench in amplifier reviews. They are simulated tests, not indicative of real world performance using real world content.

Also, another little fact for you. I'll be using bass management in my system - ie I will be using a subwoofer that will do all the heavy lifting as far as power goes. So my power requirements are cut down DRAMATICALLY since the all power sucking deep bass is redirected to the subwoofer.

So when you consider all these variables, don't you think it's absolutely and utterly SILLY to tell me how much power I actually need? Because you have no clue what I need.

[GAWD]

Yahzi check ur pms

[deltadube]

Originally Posted by Yahzi

That I need an external amp is an assumption. How do you know what my listening levels are, how far I'm seated from my speakers or what my room size is? Or what content I'm listening to? How much power a speaker needs is dependent on all these things and you have NO idea how loud I listen in my room. No idea at all.

Here are some facts for you. I'll be sitting 2 meters away from the speakers. I live in a flat. The Studio 20's are easy speakers to drive. The Denon X4000 produces around 120-130 watts into an 8 ohm load. That is plenty.

The idea that you NEED an external amp is based on what? If you don't listen at high volumes then you don't need high power because the speakers will never require it. Another fact for you is that I don't listen at high volume levels. Even 50 watts would push me over 100 dB at my seated distance and that's loud!

The final fact for you is that all channels driven is a simulated load - ie there is NEVER a case where an amplifier is delivering equal power into all channels simultaneously. Not one. Amplifiers on a test bench using sine waves for all channels is not a true reflection of what kind of power will be used under normal conditions, using normal music and/or movies.

So please, get your facts in order before you dictate to me what you think I NEED. People who just assert themselves and make ridiculous claims demonstrate how poorly informed they are. I don't NEED a power amp based on MY requirements. Perhaps you NEED it, based on yours, but certainly not based on mine.

ive got all the facts... you need lots of power for great sound period
the x4000 dont cut it trust me..

[sandman922]

Originally Posted by deltadube

Had a great visit with a Paradigm Manager at my house..

liked sound of my system..

asked me if i would like to become a paradigm beta test.. for sure!

Told me Paradigm is bringing out a new high end speaker line out
top pair around the 20k mark..

375 lbs each..

like to try those out !

cheers

i want to be a beta tester wtf? sounds like a lot of fun let us know how it works out for you .

[GAWD]

Originally Posted by deltadube

ive got all the facts... you need lots of power for great sound period
the x4000 dont cut it trust me..

Ill stay out of this arguement. Moving right along yahzi when are you getting ur speakers?

Do you already buy the Denon or buying it? Just curious why you went with that one. Not in a bad way I just love shopping for new gear
What made u go with Denon over Onkyo, Marantz, Anthem?

[deltadube]

Originally Posted by sandman922

i want to be a beta tester wtf? sounds like a lot of fun let us know how it works out for you .

have heard about any products to test yet only been 10 days or so..

gave me a paradigm pbk for letting them come over.. but they forgot the
sub 15 to go with it lol....

you have a nice system there.. im looking at some svs subs pc plus or ultras too maybe for christmas time... sub 15s would be great too.. always something ..

cheers

[Yahzi]

Originally Posted by GAWD

Ill stay out of this arguement. Moving right along yahzi when are you getting ur speakers?

Do you already buy the Denon or buying it? Just curious why you went with that one. Not in a bad way I just love shopping for new gear
What made u go with Denon over Onkyo, Marantz, Anthem?

In the next few weeks. There was no stock on the piano black cc690, so I'll have to wait a little longer. As far the choice on the X4000, I guess because it's the latest piece of tech.

I really wanted XT32 as well, in addition to all the other goodies and the build quality and GUI of the Denon is brilliant, in my opinion. I'm buying it next week, getting a good deal on it.

I could have bought an Onkyo, or a Yamaha, or a Marantz - I just like Denon. The Onkyo receivers have taken a step backwards as their new NR828 has dropped XT32 altogether. It's a shame though.

[Yahzi]

Originally Posted by deltatube

ive got all the facts... you need lots of power for great sound period

There is no evidence for this - it's just in your mind. Go study up on wattage, current and speaker sensitivity and while you're at it, look at the relationship between power and speaker distance. Also read up on "Bass Management" as that has escaped you as well.

the x4000 dont cut it trust me..

I don't trust a word that comes out of your mouth based on how poorly informed you are. It's frightening how little you actually know and I feel sorry for other members who are steered in the wrong direction. Best thing you can do is actually inform yourself and do some research.