Any DC Comic Animated fans here able to help with an epic undertaking?

[MasterChief3624]

Originally Posted by grassmonk

I don't want to derail too much, but I'll talk a little bit about my feelings on Man of Steel. Before I go any further, let me clarify that I've never been really into comic books so the vast majority of my superhero experience comes from TV/movies, and except for Superman 1-4, I didn't even really start watching any superhero shows (even the cartoons everyone watches as a kid) until I was in my early 20s. I've read very little of the source material that a lot of these adaptations come from. Hopefully that lends some perspective on where I'm coming from.

Visually, I thought Man of Steel was spectacular. Having seen Watchmen and 300 and not being very enthused by the style, I was honestly a bit worried about Superman. But I'm glad I wasn't disappointed in that regard. The opening sequence on Krypton was really great, and I really liked the version of Lois Lane. I started to get worried when

[Show spoiler]Johnathan Kent answered, "Maybe," when Clark asked if he should have let the people on the bus die. That's just not the Johnathan Kent I know from Superman: The Movie, Smallville, or Lois & Clark. A big part of why Superman is so good is because he had good parents that taught him good values and respect for life. When that ideal was (IMO) thrown out the window early on in Man of Steel, my heart sank.

(I have kids, and I know that as a parent it's sometimes tough to give them answers to difficult questions, but--and I recognize that Superman is a fantasy world--that's not a difficult question for Johnathan Kent to answer. Part of why I love Superman is even though he's not real, his ideals give us all something to strive for.)

It got worse when Clark didn't save Johnathan from the tornado. I understand the argument that Clark was trying to show that he trusted his father about not exposing himself, but his father was wrong. Smallville (the show) was not perfect, but its Johnathan Kent sure was a much better portrayal.

Superman is also a protector. To tell everyone in Smallville to get inside the buildings and then proceed to level everything inside in the fight with the Kryptonians instead of taking the fight elsewhere isn't protecting. Leveling Metropolis isn't either. Killing Zod was just awful. Superman is incredibly powerful, and incredibly good. He could have done something else. (Except that Johnathan Kent told him that maybe it was okay to let people die. I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure all of the negative reviews I have read of Man of Steel have focused on the mass destruction in Smallville and Metropolis, and killing Zod. I haven't read anyone that mentioned the "maybe" line from Johnathan, but I really feel like that's one of the roots of the problem.)

Again, my feelings on that are largely influenced by Superman vs. The Elite. I'm not ashamed to say I teared up a little when Lois found the note that said, "Always believe."

There's also a Justice League episode (a two-parter in season 2, I think) that explores an alternate universe where Superman kills Lex Luthor, the fallout from that, and how it effects not just Superman but the Justice League as a whole. For me it was another powerful example of why Superman has his rules and has to live by them.

Sorry, I've probably rambled enough for now. I get really passionate about this subject and don't usually know when to stop. But I'm glad it got you into the wider DC universe.

Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

I see.

[Show spoiler]Another thing the Superman vs The Elite demonstrated was that he wanted to take the fight elsewhere and not put the citizens in trouble, so I can understand why that was frustratingly against his normal actions in Man of Steel, that he brought the fight to the city and put everyone in danger.

Though your comment on Johnathan Kent saying "Maybe" instead of a resounding "You definitely should have saved those kids" is quite important to what I believe was the point of the film. It didn't tear away the origins that so many people are comfortable with; it merely tweaked them just slightly enough to make us understand that this is a new Clark Kent and a new Superman universe, that might not follow the rules of the ones we know of. It's apparent in that response from his father that's not named Jor-El, the fact that Lois Lane already knows his identity basically from the beginning, the strength of Lois Lane's character (she was super strong and independent in Superman vs The Elite, but other than that I've always considered her a posterchild for the damsels in distress that are so rampant in superhero movies)... that is to say, she was so strong and always fending for herself (which is a huge plus in my book), then of course the biggest things being that he didn't take the fight elsewhere and of course he killed Zod.

I think all of these things, the subtle and the blatant, were meant to stir up controversy, and it was all deliberate. They wanted to introduce a new Superman to this post-Dark Knight world, which is a grittier and more grounded version of the superheroes we know and love.

Honestly, I hated Superman before I saw Man of Steel. I thought he was the stupidest, cheapest, most boring superhero ever, and was an amalgamation of everything that is wrong with superheroes, origin stories, supervillains, etc. Just dumb. But... then Man of Steel came out and I loved it so much. Instead of treating Clark Kent like an otherworldly foreign being from a faraway planet, they wrote him to be a struggling human just like all of us. That was the most brilliant thing for me. He was relatable. He was an alien from another planet, but they still made him so relatable, and that invested me emotionally in his character and his actions throughout the film.

While the peaceful Superman from years past would be truer to the source material, I think this was a necessary change (a necessary evil, perhaps? ) for his character to be enjoyed by today's audience. Whimsical and fun superhero doesn't cut it anymore. I hate to sound like a sheep person, but the grittiness and realism certainly pushed me into loving Superman, and now I've come to really respect him as an icon and a superhero in all of his stuff... I'm even planning on picking up the Motion Picture Anthology on Blu-ray!

Superman Returns tried to stick to the Superman formula too much. That was the problem with it. In the 70s and 80s, that worked great. But in 2005? (I think that's when it came out). It came off as silly to the general audience. So they went back to the drawing board and Christopher Nolan sprinkled his magic awesome dust on it, and voila! We have Man of Steel, which I believe to be up there with The Dark Knight Rises in terms of incredible pacing, special effects, storytelling, and thematic depth. That relentless action sequence at the end of the film, that feels like it lasted for 30 minutes straight, was just amazing... unbelievable.

Honestly I also loved seeing Metropolis be so devastated... It really was a warzone, and I could feel the heartbreak from the citizens when it is shown that the whole city was pretty much leveled. Innocent lives were lost, billions of dollars worth of damage were incurred, and the city of Metropolis is visibly shaken to its foundation, quite literally. To me, it opens the doors for a much darker sequel that will show Superman's actions have much greater consequences, as you seem to be hinting at with that Justice League 2-parter And as I said, with Batman in the picture now, I'm betting that will be a central point of focus, that Superman is careless and the only thing that separates him from being one of his nemeses is the paradigm the citizens are looking through. Such a fragile lens to see through that it will crack at any moment, but for the time being it is what they view him as: a hero, despite the atrocities he left in his wake.

Have fun with that little opinion above!

Ha! Rambling... you haven't seen rambling until you've looked at my post history I'll have to check out that episode, by the way. Thanks for the heads-up

Yeah! Back to the topic... You know what? Screw it. What about Smallville? Is that worth buying on Blu-ray? Are only a few seasons available on it at the moment?