Ask questions to The Digital Bits team (Bill Hunt, Jeff Kleist et.al.)

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

Not directly, not. Studios will be tightening their belts considerably, the days of plenty are over for Hollywood, so unfortunately expensive remastering and processing are going to be hit. So indirectly the quality of HD classics could suffer.

[DigitalfreakNYC]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

What was ususual was that up until Top Gun, Paramount was good about putting all the extras from the DVD editions on the HD versions. They even went through the trouble of pressing another disc for Face/Off. The Jack Ryan Collection had been announced as having the SE DVD extras.

Correct.

It was their first attempt at screwing the consumer.

The only other studios who do it are Fox and Sony (who, admittedly, doesn't do it as much any more).

[blitz6speed]

Originally Posted by DigitalfreakNYC

Correct.

It was their first attempt at screwing the consumer.

The only other studios who do it are Fox and Sony (who, admittedly, doesn't do it as much any more).

Screwing what consumer? 99% of folks do not watch extras. Please do not speak on my behalf or the majority of consumers. Extras are meaningless to me and every single person i know.

[WickyWoo]

crewing what consumer? 99% of folks do not watch extras.

Not true at all. While a signifigant percentage of people ignore anything other than a gag reel or something, a much more signifigant percentage buys much more and are more likley to buy it

[SpaceDog]

Love me some extras.
My favorite method of providing extras is evident in the Lord of the Rings Extended Editions DVDs.

Best Audio and Video presentation for the films.
Extras on bonus discs.

I was even happy with Blade Runner (BD) and including DVDs for extras that were not in HD.

[ECWaenigma]

Thanks for the info! Let's see them do it sooner rather than later!

[Mr. Cinema]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

Screwing what consumer? 99% of folks do not watch extras. Please do not speak on my behalf or the majority of consumers. Extras are meaningless to me and every single person i know.

Really? 99%? What research did you do that gave you those results? It sure sounds like you're "speaking for everyone" with your post.

Here's my thing. If there is space leftover, why not throw the extras on there? Why would a studio want to alienate 1 group of consumers and only please the other group? Ya know, if extras are included on a BD, you DON'T have to watch them. Those who like extras CAN watch them. Why not please EVERYONE, and give us a BD that has the very best audio, video, and all the extras? Why is THAT so hard to do?

If "nobody cares about extras", then why do they exist? Why have they been included on dvds for over a decade? Why do they put them on BDs?

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cinema

Really? 99%? What research did you do that gave you those results? It sure sounds like you're "speaking for everyone" with your post.

Here's my thing. If there is space leftover, why not throw the extras on there? Why would a studio want to alienate 1 group of consumers and only please the other group? Ya know, if extras are included on a BD, you DON'T have to watch them. Those who like extras CAN watch them. Why not please EVERYONE, and give us a BD that has the very best audio, video, and all the extras? Why is THAT so hard to do?

If "nobody cares about extras", then why do they exist? Why have they been included on dvds for over a decade? Why do they put them on BDs?

I for one do not watch most extras unless its a film I am really into. However it is a perceived added value such as "Special Edition, Remastered, Digital Copy etc" that help sell some dvds and blu-rays. The studios like any company is finding the best way to make money. Some films do not need anything to sell and they can always double dip after they sold their first release.

[FourToedStatue]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

Screwing what consumer? 99% of folks do not watch extras. Please do not speak on my behalf or the majority of consumers. Extras are meaningless to me and every single person i know.

Do you think studios would have invested in all the amount of extras we've seen on dvds for the last decade if they weren't getting some returns on them? I doubt Warner would have done something like Matrix Box set (which was ridiculously packed with extras) if your 99% theory was true.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cinema

Here's my thing. If there is space leftover, why not throw the extras on there?

Give us more bits instead.

The extras are typically ephemeral bits of fluff. I say offload 'em to streams via the internet connectivity of profile 2.0. Keep all that clutter off the discs.

Extras come and go, but BITRATE IS FOREVER!

(Esp. on the audio side. Come on studios, for films which are heavy on music, start mastering in 24/96.)

[blitz6speed]

To the extras fans:

IMO, it is perceived value. Again, ive asked EVERY single person i know who purchases movies, not a SINGLE one has ever watched an extra. But the percieved value of getting a bunch of crap when you make the purchases helps people justify the price.. "ITS GOT 4 HOURS OF EXTRAS!" and then they never watch them. But it helps justify the price. And of course the rare person out there who actually watches them.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

IMO, it is perceived value. Again, ive asked EVERY single person i know who purchases movies, not a SINGLE one has ever watched an extra. But the percieved value of getting a bunch of crap when you make the purchases helps people justify the price.. "ITS GOT 4 HOURS OF EXTRAS!" and then they never watch them. But it helps justify the price. And of course the rare person out there who actually watches them.

I agree. I'm not saying axe 'em, just offer 'em as streams instead of precious-disc-space-eater-uppers. What difference does it make to the consumer who wants the perceived added value whether the extras are on the disc or drip-fed via the internet? Either way they get all those features they'll never watch.

[blitz6speed]

Originally Posted by Teazle

I agree. I'm not saying axe 'em, just offer 'em as streams instead of precious-disc-space-eater-uppers. What difference does it make to the consumer who wants the perceived added value whether the extras are on the disc or drip-fed via the internet? Either way they get all those features they'll never watch.

Exactly. Max out bitrates and then make the rest downloadable. Not only does EVERYONE win, but the studios find out 100% if people care about extras or not. Sounds like a good case study.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

Anyway, there are more important things at stake for all of the studios. The latest financial crisis has people like me from doing our jobs effectively, and until the credit markets loosen up a bit the actual output from Hollywood will decrease at an alarming rate, or we will see movies get more realistic budgets.

Credit crisis?

Are movies made with debt or investment?

Gary

[Geoff Gibson]

I would guess much of the money is financed -- which is investment by debt. Not unlike many other american businesses! America's hottest new product - DEBT - if you don't allready have it you will . . . .

[WickyWoo]

Exactly. Max out bitrates and then make the rest downloadable. Not only does EVERYONE win, but the studios find out 100% if people care about extras or not. Sounds like a good case study.

Bitrates can be maxed with plenty of room for extras

40mbps video=18GB/hour
48/24 5.1 audio 2.7GB/hr

2.41 hours on a BD50 maxed bitrate CBR

So given that most movies are 2 hours or less, and that with VBR you can probably reduce that a solid 40% , there's still plenty of room for extras and the additional dub tracks they insist on

[Mr. Cinema]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Bitrates can be maxed with plenty of room for extras

40mbps video=18GB/hour
48/24 5.1 audio 2.7GB/hr

2.41 hours on a BD50 maxed bitrate CBR

So given that most movies are 2 hours or less, and that with VBR you can probably reduce that a solid 40% , there's still plenty of room for extras and the additional dub tracks they insist on

Thank you. There's plenty of room on a BD50 to include the above plus the extras. Including the extras doesn't alienate anyone. Those who despise them (for whatever reason) can freely ignore that "special features" menu option. The rest of us can click away.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cinema

Thank you. There's plenty of room on a BD50 to include the above plus the extras. Including the extras doesn't alienate anyone. Those who despise them (for whatever reason) can freely ignore that "special features" menu option. The rest of us can click away.

I dunno, I'm a 24/96 agitator (for some titles which would benefit). With six or eight channels that starts to take some space.


EDIT: Of course, the theatrical masters themselves aren't usually 24/96 so I'm a wild-eyed revolutionary on this. I just want the music to sound better, I don't care if the gunfire, explosions and dialogue which mainly consists of people yelling "Noo!" "Get down!" "She's gonna blow!" etc etc are 48 or 96khz.

[DigitalfreakNYC]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

To the extras fans:

IMO, it is perceived value. Again, ive asked EVERY single person i know who purchases movies, not a SINGLE one has ever watched an extra. But the percieved value of getting a bunch of crap when you make the purchases helps people justify the price.. "ITS GOT 4 HOURS OF EXTRAS!" and then they never watch them. But it helps justify the price. And of course the rare person out there who actually watches them.

So because all of your so-called friends don't watch them, that means your "majority" means more than anyone else's opinion?

Nice to know you haven't changed.

I've never said PQ/AQ should ever suffer because of extras. There is no excuse for that. Put it on a damn second disc if FIFTY GIGS isn't enough.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

Credit crisis?

Are movies made with debt or investment?

Gary

Soft investments.

Pro-B