4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[Tech-UK]

Originally Posted by KRW1

It's music that's made me more hopeful about the whole physical media thing. What did we get? We got vinyl back. The greatest of all physical formats!

Sure, the sales are tiny but the main thing is, almost every new release gets a vinyl version now - certainly wasn't that way ten years ago or so when CD was king. You really had to hunt around in those days for a vinyl edition.

Yeah, ok, you got me there. But I think vinyl has become, retro and cool to own nowadays. One day owning a PlayStation may be cool and retro. But my statement still stands in that music has gone the way of downloading and 'in the cloud', which has resulted in on average poor compression in terms of both containment and dynamic range. The second issue came about later on in the CD lifecycle and has continued to this day.

I still buy CD's, but CD's from the 80's and early 90's, due to the 'loudness war' that now occupies the majority of music.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

That's wrong. The consumers and backwards compatible Blu-ray players keep DVD alive, not the studios. ...But in any case, all the studios really care about is total sales (profits) from all formats.

yes and no. The reality is that all studios and retailers care about is profits. That is the reason DVD is still alive (and the same reason VHs was alive until 2006). There will always be people that will look at it as "I can save $" and will buy the cheaper thing, that does not mean that if the choice was taken away they would not buy anything (some might skip while others would buy the more expensive version). You add to it loads of unsold, replicated DVDs sitting around in warehouses and you have the scenario we are in today where the DVD garbage bins are overflowing with titles and they are really what is keeping DVD sales as high as they are. If you look at new releases BD usually sales more copies and some times 2 or 3 times as many copies. But when the cheap guy goes and sees a catalog title film on DVD for 3$ and the just released BD for 15$ he goes and buys the DVD and sais "those BDs are expensive"

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

Yeah, the real competition for Blu-ray's future is digital, not DVD. It's not Blu-ray vs. DVD anymore, they're on the same "team" now. It's physical vs. digital. If phasing out DVD gets some people to convert to Blu-ray, while driving most of the rest to digital (purchasing or streaming), then that won't be in Blu-ray's best interest in the long term, IMO. It will just make physical contract quicker while feeding digital's growth even more.

disagree, to paraphrase octagon

"Why should I care if somebody else buys a virtual copy?"

and your point does not make sense if Joe buys a DVD and Bob buys an iTunes copy how is there any real difference for BD? none of them bought the BD.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by Tech-UK

I agree.

I am not defending DVD as a format and I believe you aren't either, but I am defending it as a tool. I don't watch DVD's anymore, but as you said its on 'the same team', and if it helps to continue the life of physical media, I am in favour.

Streaming/downloading from the studio's point of view would be fantastic. They would reduce costs by getting rid of disc pressing, paper, packaging, distribution in terms of delivering the product to the stores etc. They wouldn't even need to setup their own distribution network as there are plenty of providers and CDN's with the knowledge and technology to supply the content to consumers. We need more people to buy physical media, period. Look what happened to music, and what did we get?

But studios can never charge the same for digital then what they do for physical. A new Blu Ray cost 25 dollars while they will never get away with charging this much for digital nobody will pay that much for a new movie in digital. So in the end studios lose money on digital. Because it has to be much cheaper than physical

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Suntory_Times

Do you really think lcd's where price competitive with plasma? I want you to finds one lcd that had pq quality comparable to the st60 (besides the sharp elite which cost a lot more) and that isn't even exactly a high end plasma. Lcds where great for bright environments or if you had static images on your screen frequently, otherwise plasma curb stomped lcd in terms of pq (especially at the same price point).

Dude, I'm not even going there. You've got your opinion, I've got mine (borne out of owning several plasma and LCD sets over the last few years).

[Cbeck]

I collect movies, not formats. I have Blu-ray, DVD , digital copies, even some laserdiscs. If 4K blu ray becomes viable and catalog releases are an option I would consider those too. If digital takes over instead I can live with that too, as long as when I purchase a movie it is mine forever, just like a disc.

DVD is not going anywhere and as a movie collector I am glad for that. I have bought 4 new DVDs this month. None of the titles are on Blu-ray, or likely will ever be. Many movies are not going to get the money invested for a Blu-ray release. In the case of some older films, the elements are not in good enough shape to even benefit very much from a Blu-ray release.

The best DVDs can look very good upscaled even by today's standards. I find them totally suitable for watching some films. For people who are more casual viewers I can see why the upgrade is something they find hard to justify.

To each their own.

[Tech-UK]

Originally Posted by mredman

But studios can never charge the same for digital then what they do for physical. A new Blu Ray cost 25 dollars while they will never get away with charging this much for digital nobody will pay that much for a new movie in digital. So in the end studios lose money on digital. Because it has to be much cheaper than physical

Not if digital is the only way to obtain a movie. Have you seen the prices that Steam charge for games? That doesn't stop people from purchasing it at that price, because it offers the content instantly (well, the time it takes to download but the average connection speed is increasing and is much quicker than mail order or quicker than going to the shops even).

And again, studio's can cut out on all the physical work that goes in to producing physical media for example; pressing, testing, packaging, shipping, etc.

[PenguinMaster]

Originally Posted by Tech-UK

Not if digital is the only way to obtain a movie. Have you seen the prices that Steam charge for games? That doesn't stop people from purchasing it at that price, because it offers the content instantly (well, the time it takes to download but the average connection speed is increasing and is much quicker than mail order or quicker than going to the shops even).

You can already see this with TV shows. Seasons rarely drop below $20 and are often $30-$40. With TV shows on Blu-ray and DVD sales happen much more frequently and the used market keeps prices down even when there aren't any current sales. Various shows are only available digitally and their prices have remained consistently high.

By the way, the majority of new releases that are available on Steam have the same DRM in the disc-based PC version so the only advantage of buying a disc is if you have a slow internet connection or bandwidth limits. With current PC games you never have control, so I never buy them.

In both cases what drives prices down is competition. Studios will charge whatever they think will make them the most money regardless of how cheap or expensive it is to provide the content.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by Tech-UK

Not if digital is the only way to obtain a movie. Have you seen the prices that Steam charge for games? That doesn't stop people from purchasing it at that price, because it offers the content instantly (well, the time it takes to download but the average connection speed is increasing and is much quicker than mail order or quicker than going to the shops even).

And again, studio's can cut out on all the physical work that goes in to producing physical media for example; pressing, testing, packaging, shipping, etc.

Don't be absurd do you really think studios is gonna do that and say goodbye to billions of dollars

Also don't count MANY people will download it illegal from the net and then studios will get nothing. Also if studios cut away physical media then they will lose BILLIONS of dollars a year and that alone in US then comes ALL the foreign countries. And goodnight movie studios.

[PenguinMaster]

Originally Posted by mredman

Don't be absurd do you really think studios is gonna do that and say goodbye to billions of dollars

Also don't count MANY people will download it illegal from the net and then studios will get nothing. Also if studios cut away physical media then they will lose BILLIONS of dollars a year and that alone in US then comes ALL the foreign countries. And goodnight movie studios.

I don't expect any studios to completely give up on physical media. I expect them to give up on physical media for unpopular content, they've already started doing this.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by PenguinMaster

I don't expect any studios to completely give up on physical media. I expect them to give up on physical media for unpopular content, they've already started doing this.

Yeah i do not believe that either it would be insane to throw billions away from any studio they exist to make money to make movies.
When you say unpopular content what do you mean?

[PenguinMaster]

Originally Posted by mredman

Yeah i do not believe that either it would be insane to throw billion away
When you say unpopular content what do you mean?

The most common example is TV shows that were cancelled in the first or second season. Each episode only had a million or two viewers and a lot less than that would likely buy a Blu-ray or DVD, so they don't bother making them. A few years ago a lot more of those shows came out on physical media (though usually just DVD), now most of them are only available digitally.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by PenguinMaster

The most common example is TV shows that were cancelled in the first or second season. Each episode only had a million or two viewers and a lot less than that would likely buy a Blu-ray or DVD, so they don't bother making them. A few years ago a lot more of those shows came out on physical media (though usually just DVD), now most of them are only available digitally.

i see. I also think not many is gonna buy a show that isn't even complete on any format incl digital

[PenguinMaster]

Originally Posted by mredman

i see. I also think not many is gonna buy a show that isn't even complete on any format incl digital

I think that's the defining characteristic of unpopular: not many will buy it.

When the entire market was physical unpopular shows still got released, a small number of people buying them is still profitable. But when most of the (small) fanbase is willing to buy them digitally, the studio has no reason to bother with a physical release.

[Taygan315]

Originally Posted by lagunaseca

Great news! I'll be buying a 4k TV after the 4k blurays are released.

Originally Posted by bailey1987

Me too.

Avengers 2: Age Of Ultron, Ant Man, Star Wars: Episode VII ????

[GenPion]

Disney should make the original unaltered Star Wars a 4K Blu-ray exclusive. That would be one way to get everyone interested.

Only partially serious of course, I know a lot of people would be upset by that. It would be amazing for them to get 4K Blu-ray's though!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Canada

I will listen to Joe Kane

Good luck

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Kane initially pooh-poohed DVD (staunch LaserDisc die-hard) and I also think he backed HD DVD over Blu-ray (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

“Backed” is an understatement, he went even further, as he publiclly condemned Blu-ray as being all about greed despite the fact that Sony was intending to use the AVC video codec once it had been fully baked. This is irrefutable fact as evidenced by the comments made by a Sony V.P. during the D5 master/Blu-ray demo with avforums membership in the U.K. back in-the-day. Read the link, it’s still viable.

If some people feel the need for 2nd party official collaborative proof, then one day when I get more time I’ll search through a ton of my old emails prior to the date of the posting of that interview to the French A/V press by Joe and post an exact quote from the then President Worldwide Home Entertainment, Digital Distribution and Product Acquisitions at Sony Pictures, Ben Feingold, in communications to me attesting to the fact that AVC encoding was on its way to Blu-ray discs.

Personally, I’m beginning to think that all Joe’s recent appearances are to increase public awareness to his presence again in the A/V community as a build-up to marketing a new UHD/4K product such as a calibration tool, etc. But, I guess, until fully retired, everyone’s compelled to somehow make a buck in order to put food on the table.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by Cbeck

I collect movies, not formats. I have Blu-ray, DVD , digital copies, even some laserdiscs. If 4K blu ray becomes viable and catalog releases are an option I would consider those too. If digital takes over instead I can live with that too, as long as when I purchase a movie it is mine forever, just like a disc.

Actually you are completely wrong about digital there buddy. With digital its not yours forever. Service you have it stored on can go down, codes expire after some years, they can suddenly charge you everytime you wanna see it.
Or you get to have access to it 3 times and then you have to buy it again. Read up on the fear situations revolving digital purchase i assure you they are real there is even many here on this board about people not being able to watch or get access to what they purchased over a period of time.

Its a ruse you have no real control over what you buy so the studios can do whatever they want and they will so they can earn more money from you.

Physical is forever yours of course and you can watch it as many times as you want and they come with countless of bonus material and you can watch it every place that has a blu ray player, tv, pc, projector,dvd. You can borrow it out to friends and family ect.

[Spike M.]

Originally Posted by mredman

Actually you are completely wrong about digital there buddy. With digital its not yours forever. Service you have it stored on can go down, codes expire after some years, they can suddenly charge you everytime you wanna see it.
Or you get to have access to it 3 times and then you have to buy it again. Read up on the fear situations revolving digital purchase i assure you they are real there is even many here on this board about people not being able to watch or get access to what they purchased over a period of time.

Its a ruse you have no real control over what you buy so the studios can do whatever they want and they will so they can earn more money from you.

Physical is forever yours of course and you can watch it as many times as you want and they come with countless of bonus material and you can watch it every place that has a blu ray player, tv, pc, projector,dvd. You can borrow it out to friends and family ect.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but if you're even mildly clever you can save the file in a format that will stick with you until your hard drive dies.