Once Upon a Time in America (1984) (Extended Director's Cut)

[Todd Tomorrow]

Originally Posted by Fitzcarraldo

Having seen 35mm projections of the film a number of times, I can tell you that the 229m edition falls far short of what's possible on blu-ray in terms of both detail (it comes from an aged scan) and compression. It cries out for an upgrade.

You are not the only one who has seen the film on film several times. Nobody said that there wasn't room for improvement, but exaggerating the problems doesn't do anybody favours either.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by SymbioticFunction

I think it's a bit cheeky for the packaging to describe this latest blu-ray as a "director's cut," since he had no intention of ever releasing a 251 minute version.

Agreed, no doubt Warner has succumbed to its share of BS tactics lately.

[Rich Pure Doom]

Can anyone post some screenshots of the new disc? I'm surprised there is none of this out yet. The official website review completely dropped the ball in that regard.

[The Great Owl]

Originally Posted by Rich Pure Doom

Can anyone post some screenshots of the new disc? I'm surprised there is none of this out yet. The official website review completely dropped the ball in that regard.

I posted a link to a review with the new screenshots a few pages back.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Rich Pure Doom

Can anyone post some screenshots of the new disc? I'm surprised there is none of this out yet. The official website review completely dropped the ball in that regard.

Hopefully I'll get my copy in a few days and I'll see about doing some comparisons between the new cut, the Italian version and also the original Blu-ray.

[shamus]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Hopefully I'll get my copy in a few days and I'll see about doing some comparisons between the new cut, the Italian version and also the original Blu-ray.

thank you

[Rich Pure Doom]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Hopefully I'll get my copy in a few days and I'll see about doing some comparisons between the new cut, the Italian version and also the original Blu-ray.

Thanks. It would be most appreciated.

[chris1234]

I've now had a better look the the new combo box set. The 229 minute BD is to all intents and purposes the same as that issued by WB in 2011.

The 32 page booklet is o.k. but doesn't contain anything new as far as I could see and the letter from Scorsese is the same as the letter in the press kit when the Italian Extended Edition was announced.

Menus and scene/chapter selection in the new Extended Director's Cut seem better than those on the Italian Extended Edition.

Regrettably both extended versions have a similar color tint but the new Extended Director's Cut may have less visible compression artifacts.

Comparison caps at:

http://www.lb2121.webspace.virginmedia.com/comp.htm


The new Extended Director's Cut may be a slight improvement on the Italian Extended Edition but it is only a slight improvement.

WB's 2011 BD and the new Extended Director's Cut are slightly zoomed in whilst the Italian Extended Edition is full frame, with extra detail at the sides and black bars top and bottom.

Ideally the 229 min version should be updated with the 4K scan and correct color timing applied to the extended versions. All versions would benefit from being on 2 discs and a new commentary is needed together with details of the missing 19 minutes and the reasons why these can't at present be released.

[Geoff D]

Yep, the US extended has been cropped to 1.78 from the 1.85 on the Italian extended (got my US cut today). Boo-urns.

Quick comparison:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/96914

[Filmmaker]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yep, the US extended has been cropped to 1.78 from the 1.85 on the Italian extended (got my US cut today). Boo-urns.

Quick comparison:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/96914

But compression and color are greatly (IMO) improved on the U.S. version, so either is a compromise of sorts.

[Rich Pure Doom]

I actually bought and just got done scanning through the disc. IMO the biggest problem with it is compression. While it is greatly improved from the horrid Italian disc, you can still see compression issues on a large screen and these are things that could've easily been alleviated by Warner.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Filmmaker

But compression and color are greatly (IMO) improved on the U.S. version, so either is a compromise of sorts.

Absolutely, yeah. The compression on the Italian one is so wretched (even though it's got a HIGHER bitrate than the US version!) and the density is so poor that I'll take the slightly cropped US edition any day, but I do prefer the 1.85 framing.

Originally Posted by Rich Pure Doom

I actually bought and just got done scanning through the disc. IMO the biggest problem with it is compression. While it is greatly improved from the horrid Italian disc, you can still see compression issues on a large screen and these are things that could've easily been alleviated by Warner.

They still didn't max out the encode either, as the US video file still only takes up about 35GB (average video bitrate is a mere 14982 kb/s). When you've got 50GB to play with and the movie is over 4 hours long, why not fill up the disc? Warners are STILL being so miserly with their bitrates it's unbelievable, you'd think they were being charged by the byte or something.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

They still didn't max out the encode either, as the US video file still only takes up about 35GB (average video bitrate is a mere 14982 kb/s). When you've got 50GB to play with and the movie is over 4 hours long, why not fill up the disc? Warners are STILL being so miserly with their bitrates it's unbelievable, you'd think they were being charged by the byte or something.

I have no idea if actually true, but several years back I had actually heard they were being charged for it!

[warrian]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I have no idea if actually true, but several years back I had actually heard they were being charged for it!

It would explain a lot.

[MichaelR]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

They still didn't max out the encode either, as the US video file still only takes up about 35GB (average video bitrate is a mere 14982 kb/s). When you've got 50GB to play with and the movie is over 4 hours long, why not fill up the disc? Warners are STILL being so miserly with their bitrates it's unbelievable, you'd think they were being charged by the byte or something.

Are you sure about that measurement? I get 41.8 GB for the video file, 43.2 for the entire disc.

That still leaves unused space, but not nearly as much.

[Geoff D]

I get 43GB for the entire disc, yep, but I believe that your video file measurement includes the audio tracks as well. The video encode - just the video alone - is 35GB.

[Geoff D]

Just got done watching the US BD. I'm still not sold on the colour which is nothing like the gorgeous 229 minute BD, and what is it with these latest 4K Leone restorations having blacks that are so milky and washed out? Still, the improvement in detail over the regular BD is extremely impressive thanks to the new scan (it's also much more stable than that jittery telecine) and the compression holds up very well. I thought that they might've cleaned up all those hairs in the gate which are visible at the bottom of the frame in the Italian BD, but no, they're here too. The quality of the extended footage is variable to say the least, but there's some enlightening stuff in there so if you're a fan it's well worth picking up. I'll get cracking on some more caps tomorrow.

[MichaelR]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I get 43GB for the entire disc, yep, but I believe that your video file measurement includes the audio tracks as well. The video encode - just the video alone - is 35GB.

Correct. I did include the audio, because, after all, it has to be there.

[shamus]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Just got done watching the US BD. I'm still not sold on the colour which is nothing like the gorgeous 229 minute BD, and what is it with these latest 4K Leone restorations having blacks that are so milky and washed out? Still, the improvement in detail over the regular BD is extremely impressive thanks to the new scan (it's also much more stable than that jittery telecine) and the compression holds up very well. I thought that they might've cleaned up all those hairs in the gate which are visible at the bottom of the frame in the Italian BD, but no, they're here too. The quality of the extended footage is variable to say the least, but there's some enlightening stuff in there so if you're a fan it's well worth picking up. I'll get cracking on some more caps tomorrow.

any differences with the 229 cut compared to the old US blu?

[Geoff D]

No, I didn't buy the 2-disc version. I do believe that it's the exact same disc anyway.