Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017)

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by Hellraiserfan

I agree with your opinion about the villains but heavily disagree with you that the Raimi trilogy will probably be better than the Sony/Marvel Studios versions. Three reasons why.

1. MS has more control then Sony has let on with that deal they made coming from insiders that have proven time and time again they have accurate sources.

2. People can say what they want about MS making dumb and mindless films but Kevin Feige has a passion for these characters and although, Yes, they do make some changes from the source material, you can tell the films are made with respect towards the comics and a lot of the time the changes aren't terrible or made just because someone felt they could do better. (Looks at Fox-Men films)

3. During that whole Sony leak one email that was leaked involved a back and forth between Kevin Feige and Amy Pascal(then major producer at Sony)in which Kevin was giving a lot of advice to them/her after reading the Amazing Spider-Man 2 script. Pretty much all of his advice was solid as s*** and would have vastly improved the movie and actually made it good, maybe even great. Of course just about all of it went ignored. (Side note) I still think Pascal shouldn't be allowed near Spider-Man. She stepped down after the emails leaked where she talked s*** about a lot of people in the industry and by stepped down I mean Sony gave her that option instead of outright being fired I imagine. Oh yeah, forgot that I have a fourth reason.

4. Sadly Pascal is still involved with making new Spider-Man films but at least they got rid of Avi Arad.

Well I love the ASM films and unlike a LOT of people, I don't like Marvel's bubble movie universe. More often than not it leads to formulaic safe movies with bland villains and too many one-liners. Spider-Man does lend himself well to one-liners so that aspect should be fine. However, he's a very dark character, even from a young age and I hope Marvel's hand-picked director can handle that. Feige tore apart the ASM films but they got SO much more right about the character than Raimi did so I still hope the new films tend more towards what Webb did.

[kamphausd1]

In regards to Amy Pascal, I really hope somebody gives that dumb ***** some toy or coloring book to play with while Feige and the other competent people at Marvel Studios do all the real creative work.

Anybody remember that episode of Family Guy where the accountant Max Weinstein gives Peter a yo-yo and says "Peter, play with this" while he takes care of the situation at hand? Yeah, hopefully somebody takes that same approach when dealing with Pascal.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Hellraiserfan

Sadly I kind of agree. I still enjoy the first two Raimi films but I kind of cringe when still to this day I see people say Spider-Man 2 is the Best superhero/comic book film to date. Same with X-men 2 as the best of the X series.

I do believe some people generally still love it on that high of a level but I think with a lot of people they haven't reached that age or point in film maturity where they realize it's ok to not like films over time that they used to love. Almost a version of nostalgia, or maybe just nostalgia outright.

I would say the opposite. It's really a shame to see people acting now like Spider-Man 2 was anything but a brilliant 10 out of 10 superhero film. Marvel release some films that get comic fans all worked up due to their faithful adaptation of the source and suddenly a brilliant film like Spider-Man 2 isn't good anymore because it had an actual filmmaker at the helm who injected his own talent and personality into it.

Same for Shane Black's Iron Man or Brian Singer's X-Men. A lot of comic fans don't want artistic filmmakers making movies, they want straight-up comic adaptations by workman directors-for-hire on Feige's leash.

[seannyd]

Originally Posted by kamphausd1

In regards to Amy Pascal, I really hope somebody gives that dumb ***** some toy or coloring book to play with while Feige and the other competent people at Marvel Studios do all the real creative work.

Anybody remember that episode of Family Guy where the accountant Max Weinstein gives Peter a yo-yo and says "Peter, play with this" while he takes care of the situation at hand? Yeah, hopefully somebody takes that same approach when dealing with Pascal.

While I don't think the name calling is necessary, I can understand where you're coming from because I think she may have had a similar mentality that Tom Rothman (now at Sony!) had at Fox back in the day. It was "push them out, don't worry about quality, appeal to everyone". Shockingly, that doesn't always translate to success. In Paschal's defense, I imagine she thought she knew what she was doing, because it's clear from a lot of the leaks that she was reaching out to people, and I don't think she was nearly as involved in the day to day as people like Avi Arad and Matt Tolmach were.

Avi Arad is the epitome of a guy who is a good businessman but has zero creative sense. He knows what HE likes and he THINKS he knows what the rest of the world will like but he clearly has no clue. I don't even deny he has a great passion for Spider-Man, but he doesn't know how to make a movie work to save his life.

[Hellraiserfan]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

I would say the opposite. It's really a shame to see people acting now like Spider-Man 2 was anything but a brilliant 10 out of 10 superhero film. Marvel release some films that get comic fans all worked up due to their faithful adaptation of the source and suddenly a brilliant film like Spider-Man 2 isn't good anymore because it had an actual filmmaker at the helm who injected his own talent and personality into it.

Same for Shane Black's Iron Man or Brian Singer's X-Men. A lot of comic fans don't want artistic filmmakers making movies, they want straight-up comic adaptations by workman directors-for-hire on Feige's leash.

I still really like Spider-Man 2 and rank it up there amongst the really good or great superhero films but I hope Sony's next version does things a bit different. Like some of the advice Fiege gave to Amy Pascal about not keeping the focus throughout the entire franchise on the love/relationship part of his life.

Also, that's some bs with the "actual filmmaker" line. Jon Favreau had already made a number of films before Iron Man, as well as Joe Johnston who did Captain America: The First Avenger and especially Kenneth Branagh.

The generalization that "a lot of" fans don't want artistic filmmakers to make these films I heavily disagree with as well. I must have missed the flooding of posts from superhero fans saying they don't want this or that "artistic" filmmaker near a MS film. Only thing I've ever read are when some fans have reservations about a particular rumored director who might not be the right "fit" for this or that character.

[MechaGodzilla]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

I would say the opposite. It's really a shame to see people acting now like Spider-Man 2 was anything but a brilliant 10 out of 10 superhero film. Marvel release some films that get comic fans all worked up due to their faithful adaptation of the source and suddenly a brilliant film like Spider-Man 2 isn't good anymore because it had an actual filmmaker at the helm who injected his own talent and personality into it.

Reminds me of how it was suddenly cool to hate on Burton's Batman movies when Nolan's were the latest thing.

[Hellraiserfan]

Originally Posted by MechaGodzilla

Reminds me of how it was suddenly cool to hate on Burton's Batman movies when Nolan's were the latest thing.

I remember all that backlash and the same is happening with Nolan's films now that the DCU version of Batman is coming out.

Some people may be like that, crapping on the old for the shiny new toy but a lot of people had complaints about Raimi's Spider-man series from the beginning.

I have his first two Spidey films on Blu-ray and enjoy watching them from time to time, I'm just crossing my fingers the next verson will try to be better than both the past two versions Sony has released.

[seannyd]

Originally Posted by Hellraiserfan

I still really like Spider-Man 2 and rank it up there amongst the really good or great superhero films but I hope Sony's next version does things a bit different. Like some of the advice Fiege gave to Amy Pascal about not keeping the focus throughout the entire franchise on the love/relationship part of his life.

Also, that's some bs with the "actual filmmaker" line. Jon Favreau had already made a number of films before Iron Man, as well as Joe Johnston who did Captain America: The First Avenger and especially Kenneth Branagh.

The generalization that "a lot of" fans don't want artistic filmmakers to make these films I heavily disagree with as well. I must have missed the flooding of posts from superhero fans saying they don't want this or that "artistic" filmmaker near a MS film. Only thing I've ever read are when some fans have reservations about a particular rumored director who might not be the right "fit" for this or that character.

Just because they've made movies before doesn't necessarily mean they have a strong point of view.

Now, you're definitely right, a lot of the Marvel directors in the past have been strong filmmakers in their own right. Favreau was solid and he definitely wasn't a for hire director as he and Downey Jr. pretty much single-handedly set the tone for the entire Marvel universe. Avengers has been quintessentially Whedon but you can see the Marvel cracks starting to show a little bit in Age of Ultron. James Gunn seems to be given free reign for the most part because his movies aren't really infringing on anything in the larger universe (save for Thanos). When they picked him, I was pretty shocked because there are few people who are more bonkers when it comes to movies than him.

But then you have filmmakers that do have interesting perspectives like Patty Jenkins or Edgar Wright essentially not fitting into the whole Marvel thing and aren't being allowed to make the movies they want to make so they walk. And you also have people like Alan Taylor who was very disenfranchised by the treatment he was given in post on Thor 2 (although after seeing Genisys and how proud he is of that movie, I think I might understand Marvel's perspective a little better).

The problem is that the more continuity heavy they get on these, the more directors have to fit their style within an increasingly complicated framework and that becomes more difficult for someone to put his or her individual stamp on the material. There becomes a lot of "Well you can't do that because this." I mean, hell, even though I get it and it's kind of cool, they still had to walk back Shane Black's take on the Mandarin in their "All Hail the King" one-shot.

So now, after Age of Ultron being a little messier than it should have been and things not working out with interesting directors like Ava DuVernay for Black Panther, coupled with the hiring of a director with very little experience on this Spider-Man movie, it's a little cause for concern because we have no idea what his voice is and early reaction to Cop Car isn't "This is a guy to watch!" Granted, it's not saying throw him to the wolves just yet, but it's certainly not hiring a Sam Raimi circa 2000 caliber director.

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by MechaGodzilla

Reminds me of how it was suddenly cool to hate on Burton's Batman movies when Nolan's were the latest thing.

I never hated Burton's films, I still don't think Nolan has captured the character and his universe as well as Burton did. Schumacher's were poorly done but still good fun. Spider-Man NEEDS to become like Bond, the upside to Marvel having control is they probably realize this and we may start getting a Spider-Man film every 3 years, possibly with a spin-off as well from time to time. Still a decent chance this will be the first Spider-Man film I skip in theatres unless the trailers just knock me right on me bum.

[Dalekbuster523Bluray]

Originally Posted by Darth Anakin

Spider-Man is not supposed to be constantly crying or so depressingly poor all the time. He's also not supposed to be the butt of jokes all the time. Besides I really don't care if you get it or not, the Raimi trilogy will ALWAYS be inferior to the Amazing films in my eyes, nothing will ever change that.

He's not supposed to be British either. I don't see you complaining about that.

[dgoswald]

Spider-man should be the crown jewels for Marvel. Despite primarily being a Batman comics reader as a kid and teen I'd dabble in Marvel when I needed a respite from the darkness of Gotham, and my go-to comics would always be the Spider-man ones. Granted, I'm no expert on Spidey, but even I appreciated he was on-par with Superman and Batman in terms of recognisability and grandeur if that makes sense.

Raimi's interpretation of the character may not have been to everyone's liking, but he seemed to understand that Spider-man was a pretty big deal (and he delivered with the first 2; the 3rd was apparently heavily interfered with). Marvel (the publishers) had FF, X-Men, etc, but for me, Spidey was always numero uno for them. It would be nice if he got a film or two that reflected that status. I don't like the fact that Sony have their grubby mitts on the Spidey property, but they will never let him go.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by seannyd

Avi Arad is the epitome of a guy who is a good businessman but has zero creative sense. He knows what HE likes and he THINKS he knows what the rest of the world will like but he clearly has no clue. I don't even deny he has a great passion for Spider-Man, but he doesn't know how to make a movie work to save his life.

Yep. While Arad takes the credit for brokering the deal which got the MCU up and running, he has no goddamned clue about what makes a good movie. In the leaked emails it was hilarious how he was basically pleading with Pascal to shoehorn Venom (or was it Carnage?) into the ASM movies just because of all the merch that the character sells.

[jsobko]

Lets home Marvel makes a movie universally liked by all.

[Hellraiserfan]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yep. While Arad takes the credit for brokering the deal which got the MCU up and running, he has no goddamned clue about what makes a good movie. In the leaked emails it was hilarious how he was basically pleading with Pascal to shoehorn Venom (or was it Carnage?) into the ASM movies just because of all the merch that the character sells.

Are you serious?? There were so many of those emails that leaked that I couldn't read them all and haven't heard about that one.

One thing that brings a smile to my face is how him and Feige don't like each other. I remember a number of years back a lot of fans were praising Arad because he was the one that basically saved Marvel with those deals in the 90s when they were going bankrupt. I'm over like, "yeah, thinks for that Arad, now get the hell out of the picture." Which he has, and it's glorious.

[Geoff D]

Just do a search for Arad pascal venom emails and you'll find loads of sites reporting it, though I was wrong about Arad wanting Venom in the ASM line - he was begging for a whole Venom movie from Pascal!

[seannyd]

Non Marvel projects that Arad has produced:
Robosapien: Rebooted
Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures
Bratz
The Killing Floor

Clearly he knows hits when he sees them.

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by seannyd

Non Marvel projects that Arad has produced:
Robosapien: Rebooted
Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures
Bratz
The Killing Floor

Clearly he knows hits when he sees them.

Yeah, they should all be nominated for best film of all time.

[DisneyBlu]

Tom Holland posted the following picture, with the caption "gym time."

[jsobko]

Originally Posted by DisneyBlu

Tom Holland posted the following picture, with the caption "gym time."

Just noticed he had the mole on his chin removed.

[Bullseye]

Marisa Tomei to play Aunt May
https://variety.com/2015/film/news/m...an-1201536080/