Scream 5 (January 14, 2022)

[Alice91]

Originally Posted by RustinCohle

Tell me you're racist without telling me you're racist.

I mean seriously. How do you not understand how racist you sound. Not every single movie is going to have an all white cast anymore. This is 2022 not 1922. Imagine living your life thinking things are "racist towards white people" because "the cast consisted of people of color."

I did not ask for an all white cast, you're reading what you want to read.

[DraculaHasRisen]

Originally Posted by AnthonyGG

I'm in the minority with both the new Scream film (a disappointment and my least favorite in the series) and Halloween Kills. Most fans dislike it but even with its flaws - and there ARE flaws - I actually quite enjoyed it. Andi Matichak's presence and performance alone is worth watching. Halloween 2018 was superior but I did find things to like in Kills.

I don't even fault the cast in either 'Kills' or 'Scream'. I actually felt bad that a lot of those kids we're done wrong with being so overshadowed by "legacy" characters phoning in hollowed performances for a paycheck. Just the plot and writing in either is so nonsensical.

[Guy87]

Unless a movie is making an overt political commentary about race in society, anyone who gives even the single, tiniest piece of shit how much melanin is in a cast members body...is basically a douche.

[jess1581]

Originally Posted by Alice91

I did not ask for an all white cast, you're reading what you want to read.

No, you just wanted the only POC in the film to be killed cuz it's only "fair"?

[AnthonyGG]

Originally Posted by DraculaHasRisen

I don't even fault the cast in either 'Kills' or 'Scream'. I actually felt bad that a lot of those kids we're done wrong with being so overshadowed by "legacy" characters phoning in hollowed performances for a paycheck. Just the plot and writing in either is so nonsensical.

Kills was very well cast but yes some of the writing and plotting was problematic - don't even get me started on that hospital chase scene Enough things worked, however, and David Gordon Green had a nice steady hand most of the time so I came out overall enjoying it.

The new Scream on the other hand, eh, I had some casting issues. Melissa Barrera can't hold her ground in the lead role and most of the rest of the newbies were forgettable. I definitely had problems with some of the filmmakers' decisions apart from casting as well.

[Alice91]

Originally Posted by jess1581

No, you just wanted the only POC in the film to be killed cuz it's only "fair"?

No, I have a problem with characters being used as tokes so the press can praise the movie for being "inclusive" without actually writing the characters well to give them a reason for their role, which is what's happening to Scream 5. A group of friends from high school so small in a small town being so mixed and diverse makes no sense, like really statistically, unless if presented with a good script. Simply having the movie set in a bigger town with more of a melting pot environment could've helped the movie and made the cast feel more organic.

Halloween Kills is probably the first horror movie to depict a gay couple in such a seamless and natural way which added even more tension to the home invasion kills.

Also I don't believe they didn't think this out in Scream 5, it was a deliberate choice which I think undermined the movie's surprise factor and credibility. Even Season 3 on MTV felt less woke, and that was tragic too, but at least it was coherent with the setting and plot and felt more organic.

I have nothing against diversity, but as any aspect of a movie, it has to be brought in with clever and good writing, not forced just for the sake of it. Was Wes Craven racist for having an all white cast in Scream 1? No, the casting was done according to the movie's setting. In 2 and 3 the setting was different and allowed them to cast adults and not teens only and a more diverse cast because it fit the plot and setting. A campus with students from all over the country and LA are not a little suburb in a small town. Scream 4 went back to Woodsboro so the cast was predominantly white again.

It's the writing that doesn't add up, not the actors. As a matter of fact Mindy and Chad were my favorite characters along with Tara, but were so underdeveloped and underwritten, they could have focused on them being twins but they were just tokens, there to please the woke press.

Barrera couldn't act if her life depended on it so I am confused about her casting too. Maybe they just wanted a non white final girl just for the sake of it? Clearly they forgot to write a good character and cast a skilled actress.

Tyson's part in 3 was an exact satire of this casting method, he was appalled that he was being typecasted in Stab 3 but couldn't afford to refuse the job because it was a job. A natural progression for the franchise would have been proving a horror franchise can thrive without typecasting its actors.

But I suppose it's easier to rant about racism instead of having a more complex conversation about how movies are being made.

[DraculaHasRisen]

Originally Posted by AnthonyGG

Kills was very well cast but yes some of the writing and plotting was problematic - don't even get me started on that hospital chase scene Enough things worked, however, and David Gordon Green had a nice steady hand most of the time so I came out overall enjoying it.

The new Scream on the other hand, eh, I had some casting issues. Melissa Barrera can't hold her ground in the lead role and most of the rest of the newbies were forgettable. I definitely had problems with some of the filmmakers' decisions apart from casting as well.

Hahaha. That lip filler between her and Courtney, too. My god...

[RustinCohle]

Originally Posted by Alice91

No, I have a problem with characters being used as tokes so the press can praise the movie for being "inclusive" without actually writing the characters well to give them a reason for their role, which is what's happening to Scream 5. A group of friends from high school so small in a small town being so mixed and diverse makes no sense, like really statistically, unless if presented with a good script. Simply having the movie set in a bigger town with more of a melting pot environment could've helped the movie and made the cast feel more organic.

Halloween Kills is probably the first horror movie to depict a gay couple in such a seamless and natural way which added even more tension to the home invasion kills.

Also I don't believe they didn't think this out in Scream 5, it was a deliberate choice which I think undermined the movie's surprise factor and credibility. Even Season 3 on MTV felt less woke, and that was tragic too, but at least it was coherent with the setting and plot and felt more organic.

I have nothing against diversity, but as any aspect of a movie, it has to be brought in with clever and good writing, not forced just for the sake of it. Was Wes Craven racist for having an all white cast in Scream 1? No, the casting was done according to the movie's setting. In 2 and 3 the setting was different and allowed them to cast adults and not teens only and a more diverse cast because it fit the plot and setting. A campus with students from all over the country and LA are not a little suburb in a small town. Scream 4 went back to Woodsboro so the cast was predominantly white again.

It's the writing that doesn't add up, not the actors. As a matter of fact Mindy and Chad were my favorite characters along with Tara, but were so underdeveloped and underwritten, they could have focused on them being twins but they were just tokens, there to please the woke press.

Barrera couldn't act if her life depended on it so I am confused about her casting too. Maybe they just wanted a non white final girl just for the sake of it? Clearly they forgot to write a good character and cast a skilled actress.

Tyson's part in 3 was an exact satire of this casting method, he was appalled that he was being typecasted in Stab 3 but couldn't afford to refuse the job because it was a job. A natural progression for the franchise would have been proving a horror franchise can thrive without typecasting its actors.

But I suppose it's easier to rant about racism instead of having a more complex conversation about how movies are being made.

Now that you mention it.. the "small town" I grew up in had black people, hispanic people, and gay people, but they really shouldn't have been living there. Small towns are for straight white people only.

[AnthonyGG]

Originally Posted by DraculaHasRisen

Hahaha. That lip filler between her and Courtney, too. My god...

Poor Courtney though. The scene between her and Arquette was one of the better parts of the film.

[joshsquash729]

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and I do my best to respect all of them, even the ones I don't agree with, but I'm just gonna say- some of the opinions I've seen of this movie (both on this forum and off) are just proving the movie's point on toxic fandom.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by AnthonyGG

I'm in the minority with both the new Scream film (a disappointment and my least favorite in the series) and Halloween Kills. Most fans dislike it but even with its flaws - and there ARE flaws - I actually quite enjoyed it. Andi Matichak's presence and performance alone is worth watching. Halloween 2018 was superior but I did find things to like in Kills.

The soundtrack in HK absolutely rocked. Had my first viewing in my HT yesterday and they really knocked the music out of the park.

[jess1581]

Originally Posted by Alice91

No, I have a problem with characters being used as tokes so the press can praise the movie for being "inclusive" without actually writing the characters well to give them a reason for their role, which is what's happening to Scream 5. A group of friends from high school so small in a small town being so mixed and diverse makes no sense, like really statistically, unless if presented with a good script. Simply having the movie set in a bigger town with more of a melting pot environment could've helped the movie and made the cast feel more organic.

Halloween Kills is probably the first horror movie to depict a gay couple in such a seamless and natural way which added even more tension to the home invasion kills.

Also I don't believe they didn't think this out in Scream 5, it was a deliberate choice which I think undermined the movie's surprise factor and credibility. Even Season 3 on MTV felt less woke, and that was tragic too, but at least it was coherent with the setting and plot and felt more organic.

I have nothing against diversity, but as any aspect of a movie, it has to be brought in with clever and good writing, not forced just for the sake of it. Was Wes Craven racist for having an all white cast in Scream 1? No, the casting was done according to the movie's setting. In 2 and 3 the setting was different and allowed them to cast adults and not teens only and a more diverse cast because it fit the plot and setting. A campus with students from all over the country and LA are not a little suburb in a small town. Scream 4 went back to Woodsboro so the cast was predominantly white again.

It's the writing that doesn't add up, not the actors. As a matter of fact Mindy and Chad were my favorite characters along with Tara, but were so underdeveloped and underwritten, they could have focused on them being twins but they were just tokens, there to please the woke press.

Barrera couldn't act if her life depended on it so I am confused about her casting too. Maybe they just wanted a non white final girl just for the sake of it? Clearly they forgot to write a good character and cast a skilled actress.

Tyson's part in 3 was an exact satire of this casting method, he was appalled that he was being typecasted in Stab 3 but couldn't afford to refuse the job because it was a job. A natural progression for the franchise would have been proving a horror franchise can thrive without typecasting its actors.

But I suppose it's easier to rant about racism instead of having a more complex conversation about how movies are being made.

There's nothing complex about making presumptuous claims about small town communities. The Meeks twins were mixed race, one of them is gay, and from the look of it Tara and Sam are latino(per the actresses playing them)... in a small California town in 2022. That's about all the diversity there was yet that strikes you as forced and unrealistic. I live in Mass, in a smaller town, where almost half the population is Capeverdian or Portuguese. In California, there is no doubt a latino influence... so Tara and Sam would not be unusual.

Again, you're struggling to justify a nothing burger issue and only exposing yourself.

[spanky87]

What’s most unusual is that quite a number of serial killers have come from Woodsboro and there’s been 3 different series of killings involving their high school students.

[spanky87]

Woodsboro is almost up there with Sunnydale as being the most dangerous fictional town to live in.

[DraculaHasRisen]

Originally Posted by joshsquash729

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and I do my best to respect all of them, even the ones I don't agree with, but I'm just gonna say- some of the opinions I've seen of this movie (both on this forum and off) are just proving the movie's point on toxic fandom.

An educated opinion as a film fan doesn't make anyone toxic. Which is where it stops for me. It's not like I'm going around preaching it to everyone, expecting them to dislike it because I did. Nor am I going to a con to berede any of the actors about it. Is it toxic to be passionate or just care? I mean, is that not a huge reason we are here, on a movie forum?

[jess1581]

Originally Posted by DraculaHasRisen

An educated opinion as a film fan doesn't make anyone toxic. Which is where it stops for me. It's not like I'm going around preaching it to everyone, expecting them to dislike it because I did. Nor am I going to a con to berede any of the actors about it. Is it toxic to be passionate or just care? I mean, is that not a huge reason we are here, on a movie forum?

Toxic fandom is just as mythical as cancel culture, both of which were created, sensationalized, and perpetuated by the media. They took the irrationality of the few and put all of fandom in that box. Another issue I took with this film, as it decided to bandwagon a trendy subject that doesn't have legit grounds as a basis.

Are there toxic fans out there? Sure, but not nearly on a scale that merits the attention.

[joshsquash729]

Originally Posted by DraculaHasRisen

An educated opinion as a film fan doesn't make anyone toxic. Which is where it stops for me. It's not like I'm going around preaching it to everyone, expecting them to dislike it because I did. Nor am I going to a con to berede any of the actors about it. Is it toxic to be passionate or just care? I mean, is that not a huge reason we are here, on a movie forum?

Well, as Richie says "How can fandom be toxic? It's about love!"

I ain't gonna argue any points. Like I said, anyone and everyone is welcome to their opinion. I don't even think you were one of the folks I was directing my post toward. Having an "educated opinion" is completely fine- welcome, even! It's when that opinion of a movie starts to come across or is disguised as a politcally/racially motivated attack on the movie and/or those who enjoyed it that there's a problem, at least in my eyes. Those "toxic" fans are definitely the minority, I'll admit, but as we've learned in recent years, the minority is often the most vocal.

[DraculaHasRisen]

Originally Posted by joshsquash729

Well, as Richie says "How can fandom be toxic? It's about love!"

I ain't gonna argue any points. Like I said, anyone and everyone is welcome to their opinion. I don't even think you were one of the folks I was directing my post toward. Having an "educated opinion" is completely fine- welcome, even! It's when that opinion of a movie starts to come across or is disguised as a politcally/racially motivated attack on the movie and/or those who enjoyed it that there's a problem, at least in my eyes. Those "toxic" fans are definitely the minority, I'll admit, but as we've learned in recent years, the minority is often the most vocal.

I see what you're saying.

[Alice91]

Originally Posted by jess1581

There's nothing complex about making presumptuous claims about small town communities. The Meeks twins were mixed race, one of them is gay, and from the look of it Tara and Sam are latino(per the actresses playing them)... in a small California town in 2022. That's about all the diversity there was yet that strikes you as forced and unrealistic. I live in Mass, in a smaller town, where almost half the population is Capeverdian or Portuguese. In California, there is no doubt a latino influence... so Tara and Sam would not be unusual.

Again, you're struggling to justify a nothing burger issue and only exposing yourself.

That's your interpretation of my opinion, again I have nothing wrong with a diverse cast, I actually welcome it as a positive thing, my issue is that they sold it to the press as a bonus point for the movie like "look, we're diverse, we're correct, say good things about us" but forgot to give these characters (and actors) any dignity in their roles. Plus the acting was bad all across the board.

Also now we've been talking about this way too much and it seems I'm making a big deal out of this which is not the case. The movie sucks for many other reasons in my opinion, which I hope you're taking for what it is, a carefree personal opinion on a work of fiction, not as The Ultitmate Word Of Truth.

And speaking of diversity, I was the one yelling for male's butt cheeks during the shower scene at the theatre but guessed they played it safe there as well....movies aren't just fun to watch anymore. Again... my useless 2 cents.

[samlop10]

Watched this for a 3rd time yesterday. What a great ‘requel’. The more I watch it the more I like it. Not perfect, but I still think it’s the best sequel in the franchise.