The Official Energy Speakers Thread

[BigAl87]

Originally Posted by callas01

you definetly want the CC-10, it has matching tweeter and drivers, the C-C100 when I had it was an awesome center and the CC-10 when I heard it sounded very similar in terms of performance and I would never suggest anything other then the CC-10. If youre buying the CB5s for fronts then getting the CC5s as a whole 5.0 setup would be the only way Id say get the CC5. Id say spend the extra now, itll be worth it to you

Hehe I agree with you, the C-C50 was way better than the CC-5 I find in the low end. CC-5 sounds small without punch.

[PaulWog]

Originally Posted by 9883

Here is the best deal that Vann's gave me before the CB-5 went on sale for $99

Energy CF30: $199.99 each
Energy CB5: $149.99 for the pair
Energy CC5: $129.99 each
Energy ESWC10: $249.98

I'm pretty much set on the fronts,surround, and sub but I just can't make up my mind on the center. Energy uses the CC-10 in all of their HT systems even the one with the bookshelf speakers as fronts (CB-10?) but Klipsch uses the C-10 with their F-10 HT. I don't need the greater power handling of the CC-10 or the lower frequency. From the two reviews that I read (not many reviews out there for this brand) the people said that the voices coming from the CC-5 sounded like they were in a box. I don't know what to make of this because I can't hear the speakers in person. The big plus of the CC-5 for me is that it can be mounted and angled down towards the listener. For the CC-10 I will have to put up a shelf and there will be very little room between the wall and the back of the speaker so I will have to plug the port.

I'd highly recommend you shoot for the CC-10. Definitely better constructed.

As for the subwoofer: I highly recommend you don't get an ESW-C8 or ESW-C10. My dad has one in his bedroom now, and after a year of usage the dust cap came off far enough that it now makes a buzzing sound (we're going to have to use superglue or something to get it back on and that's not good). I had the ESW-C8 for a month and I returned it since it also exhibited the same problem right away.

For the subwoofer you can pick something from a different company. You don't need to sound match the sub, especially with the Connoisseur speakers. Their subwoofers aren't really matched to the speakers in some special way. I'm using the Klipsch RPW-10 sub, and after having used it for long enough, the sound is FAR superior to the low-end Energy subwoofer offerings (I ended up getting a price-match by Futureshop down to a clearance price of $200). I'm sure the higher end Energy subwoofers are much better.

But anyways, I'd highly recommend you get the CC-10.

[DMC86X]

Im thinking about getting the Energy 5.1 Take Classic Home Theater System . Im trying to figure out what the model of speakers come in this set because I would eventually like to buy two more to make it a 7.1 system. Does anyone know?? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.

[9883]

The ESW-C8 is something I would not get based on it's lack of low end frequency, the 8-inch driver, and the light weight. What bothers me with the Energy subs is that they only give you 1-year warranty on the amp, Klipsch (which is basically the same company now) gives a 2-year and Polk gives 3-year. Another sub I have considered is the YST-SW315 from Yamaha. It's got a 10-inch driver and a hefty weight of 41.9 lbs. All the controls are on the front of the sub and that's extremely handy. However, they rate the frequency response (-10 dB) as oppose to +/-3dB. They claim the sub will get as low as 20 Hz but that has to be BS considering the 10-inch size of the driver, to get that low you would probably need a 14 or 15-inch driver. For a 10-inch driver I would figure around 30 Hz is as low as it will go which is not a problem because there is very little if any movie/game content below 30 Hz and only some music (organ if I'm not mistaken).

What is your take on the fact that a lot of experts say that the tweeters of the front speakers and the center channel need to be at ear level for HT and the surrounds need to be at ear level when the listener is standing up which means above the ear when sitting down? The small 5.1 that I got now has a cradle for the center that allows you to point it up when it sits below the tv. Also, Polk centers (TSi and RTi) have an angled top and the speaker gets flipped around depending on if it's above the tv or below. The only way to achieve this with a speaker like the CC-10 (has to lay flat on shelf) would be to put the tv on the floor or way above which would make watching uncomfortable.

[9883]

Originally Posted by DMC86X

Im thinking about getting the Energy 5.1 Take Classic Home Theater System . Im trying to figure out what the model of speakers come in this set because I would eventually like to buy two more to make it a 7.1 system. Does anyone know?? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.

Energy does not make those speakers outside of the 5.1 system that they sell so the only way to make it 7.1 is to get 2 more sats from a place like ebay (which would come from a broken up 5.1 system in either new or used condition). If you really want that system and have patience to wait you can get it for $300 because it periodically goes on sale in the form of money off the purchase price or giftcard (newegg.com in recent past).

You also have another option, one which I considered for myself. You can get 2 sets of CB-5's ($99 per set currently) and a CC-5 (center channel) for around $130, maybe even $100 if you get lucky and match it up with a EW-100 (can be had for around $150) or a ESW-8 (same sub as the one in the Take Classic) the high gloss version of the ESW-8 are sold in a few places but if you want to match the wood grain on the CB-5' and the CC-5 than you can pick the ESW-8 at electronics expo or around $150 (I would try to bargain for less with them). Once you want go 7.1 you can get one more set of CB-5's which you have the option of buying brand new from an authorized dealer because these speakers are sold this way unlike the sats that come in the Take Classic system. You would end up with a system that is superior to the Take Classic (at the $400 price point) for not much more money or maybe even the same $400 that you would spend on the Take Classic.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

Energy does not make those speakers outside of the 5.1 system that they sell so the only way to make it 7.1 is to get 2 more sats from a place like ebay (which would come from a broken up 5.1 system in either new or used condition). If you really want that system and have patience to wait you can get it for $300 because it periodically goes on sale in the form of money off the purchase price or giftcard (newegg.com in recent past).

You also have another option, one which I considered for myself. You can get 2 sets of CB-5's ($99 per set currently) and a CC-5 (center channel) for around $130, maybe even $100 if you get lucky and match it up with a EW-100 (can be had for around $150) or a ESW-8 (same sub as the one in the Take Classic) the high gloss version of the ESW-8 are sold in a few places but if you want to match the wood grain on the CB-5' and the CC-5 than you can pick the ESW-8 at electronics expo or around $150 (I would try to bargain for less with them). Once you want go 7.1 you can get one more set of CB-5's which you have the option of buying brand new from an authorized dealer because these speakers are sold this way unlike the sats that come in the Take Classic system. You would end up with a system that is superior to the Take Classic (at the $400 price point) for not much more money or maybe even the same $400 that you would spend on the Take Classic.

+1 very well said.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

The ESW-C8 is something I would not get based on it's lack of low end frequency, the 8-inch driver, and the light weight. What bothers me with the Energy subs is that they only give you 1-year warranty on the amp, Klipsch (which is basically the same company now) gives a 2-year and Polk gives 3-year. Another sub I have considered is the YST-SW315 from Yamaha. It's got a 10-inch driver and a hefty weight of 41.9 lbs. All the controls are on the front of the sub and that's extremely handy. However, they rate the frequency response (-10 dB) as oppose to +/-3dB. They claim the sub will get as low as 20 Hz but that has to be BS considering the 10-inch size of the driver, to get that low you would probably need a 14 or 15-inch driver. For a 10-inch driver I would figure around 30 Hz is as low as it will go which is not a problem because there is very little if any movie/game content below 30 Hz and only some music (organ if I'm not mistaken).

What is your take on the fact that a lot of experts say that the tweeters of the front speakers and the center channel need to be at ear level for HT and the surrounds need to be at ear level when the listener is standing up which means above the ear when sitting down? The small 5.1 that I got now has a cradle for the center that allows you to point it up when it sits below the tv. Also, Polk centers (TSi and RTi) have an angled top and the speaker gets flipped around depending on if it's above the tv or below. The only way to achieve this with a speaker like the CC-10 (has to lay flat on shelf) would be to put the tv on the floor or way above which would make watching uncomfortable.

I have said for a while that since they stopped selling the S-series subs, that would be the S8.3, S10.3 and S12.3 and that they have no real good subs in the price range they list them for. Even the S series I have always thought were overly priced at their list.

There are a few subs out there that are priced well enough that you can get a great product at a reduced price. My favorite is the eD A2-300 the one I own, its $415. The other entry level sub they make is the eD A3S-250 for $350 or the A2-250 and you can look at the subs galleries for their frequency response graphs.

If those are out of your budget, then let me suggest that you look at the BIC H-100 for $230. Or the Premier Acoustic PA120 for $260.

Both of these are within your price range and far better subs. Don't worry about brand matching subs.

OK, when I had the C-C100 center channel in my setup, it was below my TV and about a good foot or two below ear level. However I never once had an issue with dialog or sweeping sounds even when listening off axis. YES, ideally, if you could get everything at ear level that would be the best, but many of us do not have the luxary to even get that accomplished. If you look at my gallery you can see that the empty spot below my TV is where the center used to sit and that is about the same height as the couch that I would sit on, so there is no way it was close to ear level. The towers for me where about ear level, but my current speakers are just above and I have no problems with things sounding excellent. Eventually I will get a TV stand that can hang the TV on it like it was wall mounted, and that will raise the Center up about a foot, but until that day, Im not even concerned.

Also, look at BigAls setup, his Center is above the TV, angled down some, and he doesn't complain. Point is, make the best of your situation.

[BigAl87]

Originally Posted by callas01

I have said for a while that since they stopped selling the S-series subs, that would be the S8.3, S10.3 and S12.3 and that they have no real good subs in the price range they list them for. Even the S series I have always thought were overly priced at their list.

There are a few subs out there that are priced well enough that you can get a great product at a reduced price. My favorite is the eD A2-300 the one I own, its $415. The other entry level sub they make is the eD A3S-250 for $350 or the A2-250 and you can look at the subs galleries for their frequency response graphs.

If those are out of your budget, then let me suggest that you look at the BIC H-100 for $230. Or the Premier Acoustic PA120 for $260.

Both of these are within your price range and far better subs. Don't worry about brand matching subs.

OK, when I had the C-C100 center channel in my setup, it was below my TV and about a good foot or two below ear level. However I never once had an issue with dialog or sweeping sounds even when listening off axis. YES, ideally, if you could get everything at ear level that would be the best, but many of us do not have the luxary to even get that accomplished. If you look at my gallery you can see that the empty spot below my TV is where the center used to sit and that is about the same height as the couch that I would sit on, so there is no way it was close to ear level. The towers for me where about ear level, but my current speakers are just above and I have no problems with things sounding excellent. Eventually I will get a TV stand that can hang the TV on it like it was wall mounted, and that will raise the Center up about a foot, but until that day, Im not even concerned.

Also, look at BigAls setup, his Center is above the TV, angled down some, and he doesn't complain. Point is, make the best of your situation.

Indeed, as per THX recommendation the angle should not be more than 15 degrees from the main listening area wheter it's above or below the TV, they also recommend using 2 centers one above and one below to get perfect vertical imaging, the other thing nowadays most center are horizontal so technically they shoud have a very good vertical dispersion so it's hard to find out whether the sound is coming from the top or botom. A good speaker should do the trick.
My Rainmaker center is amazing at this and my energy C-100 was doing quite well also.

[9883]

Just got a response from Energy and they pretty much say that the only use for CC-5 is in combination with CB-5 fronts and surrounds, not even CB-10. I'm going with the CC-10 as center, it won't be that much higher than my head when above the tv and if it becomes an issue I will try to mitigate it somehow.
They also said that the CB-5's are just fine as replacement for the CR-10.


Have any of you come across issues with automatic speaker calibration when using bipole/dipole speakers like the CR-10? The manual that came with my receiver states that automatic calibration can not be performed correctly/won't be performed at all with bipole/dipole speakers in the system.

Somebody suggested that I should get the BIC F12 for sub. I wonder if the warranty (5-years) is for both the driver and the amp because 5-years seems a bit too generous for a sub in this class. Just for comparison I looked at the higher end VK-12 and the warranty on that is 7-years driver and 2-year amp.
The 1-year that Energy gives on the amp worries me.

Does the cross over on the sub work like the one on the receiver meaning you can only change it up and down in 10Hz increments?
Would it be ok to run the cf-30 as large and turn the cross over on the sub to 40Hz?

[BigAl87]

Originally Posted by 9883

Just got a response from Energy and they pretty much say that the only use for CC-5 is in combination with CB-5 fronts and surrounds, not even CB-10. I'm going with the CC-10 as center, it won't be that much higher than my head when above the tv and if it becomes an issue I will try to mitigate it somehow.
They also said that the CB-5's are just fine as replacement for the CR-10.


Have any of you come across issues with automatic speaker calibration when using bipole/dipole speakers like the CR-10? The manual that came with my receiver states that automatic calibration can not be performed correctly/won't be performed at all with bipole/dipole speakers in the system.

Somebody suggested that I should get the BIC F12 for sub. I wonder if the warranty (5-years) is for both the driver and the amp because 5-years seems a bit too generous for a sub in this class. Just for comparison I looked at the higher end VK-12 and the warranty on that is 7-years driver and 2-year amp.
The 1-year that Energy gives on the amp worries me.

Does the cross over on the sub work like the one on the receiver meaning you can only change it up and down in 10Hz increments?
Would it be ok to run the cf-30 as large and turn the cross over on the sub to 40Hz?

I am not sure the CF-30 are the right speaker to do this and why would you want to use 40 hz with those I would use 60hz and use the Bass Mangement of the receiver rather than the sub, 40hz, I hope that sub goes in the low 20 or lower cause you will find that alot of bass is missing if you set you fronts to 40 or to large and BTW the frequency response at +/-3 db of the CF-30 is 43hz. Your center does not go so low so use 70 to 80hz X-over with it and hopefully your receiver can use seperate X-over for L/R and center or otherwise you will have to go 70hz X-over.

Most sub have gradual potentiometer that allows you to increase gradually the X-oer but again those have different accuracy depending on the quality. If you want to listen to music at full range with out the sub then use the analog out of you player to you multichannel input of yu receiver and enjoy full range like that. Thats the way I do it and Analog sound more natural to me.

I use 40 hz but my little fellas handle it quite well and my sub goes below 20hz, 21hz at +/-3db so it's all good. I used 60 hz with my previous Energy setup and I found it to be really nice. (C-500 and C-C100)

[9883]

I misunderstood what I read in the receiver manual. I was under the impression that cutting the bass with the cross over will have a negative effect on the sound coming out of the front speakers. The receiver has a seperate cross over for front, center, and surround and the lowest point is 40Hz. So if I set the cross over at 40Hz (small front speakers) for the cf-30 and the sub picks up at 40hz than I will loose 42Hz and 41Hz so to avoid that I have to go 50Hz on the cf-30 and then it won't matter what the sub is set at because it will not get signals higher than 50Hz. I was plannig on setting the cross over for CC-10 at 60Hz and at 70Hz for the CB-5's (I know the spec is 71Hz -/+ 3dB but is it worth going up all the way to 80Hz).

[BigAl87]

Originally Posted by 9883

I misunderstood what I read in the receiver manual. I was under the impression that cutting the bass with the cross over will have a negative effect on the sound coming out of the front speakers. The receiver has a seperate cross over for front, center, and surround and the lowest point is 40Hz. So if I set the cross over at 40Hz (small front speakers) for the cf-30 and the sub picks up at 40hz than I will loose 42Hz and 41Hz so to avoid that I have to go 50Hz on the cf-30 and then it won't matter what the sub is set at because it will not get signals higher than 50Hz. I was plannig on setting the cross over for CC-10 at 60Hz and at 70Hz for the CB-5's (I know the spec is 71Hz -/+ 3dB but is it worth going up all the way to 80Hz).

Yes cause you might have some rolloff and BTW in any HT setups THX recommends 80hz for all speaker regardless of your sepakers but this is just a guideline if you ask me.

You would not nececessarly lose 42 and 41 hz but they would not be reproduced well and could be quite weak. CB-5 as surrounds will be just fine at 80hz you can trust me on that and it,s not like surrounds has a lot of LFE going there.

Experience 70hz Center, 60 hz L/R and 80hz surrounds it should sound really nice.

[9883]

Is there any point of going with the CF-50 to gain the few low end Hz over the CF-30. Both of them are 2.5 way but the 50 have some more power handing. I know that with the CF-30 the low end of the midrange is handle by one woofer and the uper end by the other. How are those duties assigned in the CF-50?

[9883]

You are right, the surrounds don't have a lot of LFE going on. The CR-10 that Energy uses are almost the same in the low end as the CB-5. For some period of time I wanted foolishly to get the CB-10 for surround.

[9883]

Those subs from Elemental Designs look great. I like the clean look and the coating. I just looked at the specs for one of them and they just had the RMS listed and not the attention grabbing dynamic I read somewhere that that's a mark of quality and integrity.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

Those subs from Elemental Designs look great. I like the clean look and the coating. I just looked at the specs for one of them and they just had the RMS listed and not the attention grabbing dynamic I read somewhere that that's a mark of quality and integrity.

what is the mark of integrity and quality?

I have an eD sub, and let me tell you they produce a lot of depth and power. I have heard Hsu, Martin Logan, Def Tech, B&W, Energy, Velodyne, Dali, Polk, Klipsch, REL and a slew of other subs, and the eDs are easily in the same class and more bang for the buck of any of them. Otherwise i would have sold it already and went and bought the Hsu sub.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

Is there any point of going with the CF-50 to gain the few low end Hz over the CF-30. Both of them are 2.5 way but the 50 have some more power handing. I know that with the CF-30 the low end of the midrange is handle by one woofer and the uper end by the other. How are those duties assigned in the CF-50?

the CF-50s have more output and bass. They do sound fuller and IMO are a better speaker because of it. The CF-50s were the ones I was gonna get until I got the deal for the C-300s.

Both the CF-30s and CF-50s have a single mid-range driver, but the CF-50 has the extra woofer, that adds output and bass as i stated above.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

I misunderstood what I read in the receiver manual. I was under the impression that cutting the bass with the cross over will have a negative effect on the sound coming out of the front speakers. The receiver has a seperate cross over for front, center, and surround and the lowest point is 40Hz. So if I set the cross over at 40Hz (small front speakers) for the cf-30 and the sub picks up at 40hz than I will loose 42Hz and 41Hz so to avoid that I have to go 50Hz on the cf-30 and then it won't matter what the sub is set at because it will not get signals higher than 50Hz. I was plannig on setting the cross over for CC-10 at 60Hz and at 70Hz for the CB-5's (I know the spec is 71Hz -/+ 3dB but is it worth going up all the way to 80Hz).

The CF-30s do not have the ability to put out bass at the level of a sub, and therefore should be crossed over no lower, IMO, then 70 hz, I think if you crossover the center and fronts at 70 hz you will get a better seemless transition from the center and fronts as you won't get different bass output levels across the front sound stage. For the CB5s I suggest that you cross them over at 80 at the lowest and 90 prefered.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by 9883

You are right, the surrounds don't have a lot of LFE going on. The CR-10 that Energy uses are almost the same in the low end as the CB-5. For some period of time I wanted foolishly to get the CB-10 for surround.

There is nothing foolish about using the CB-10s as surrounds. I used the C-100s as surrounds and loved them.... they were the one speaker I didn't want to sell. The bigger driver will have more output and move more air, you will get a greater sense of impact from those being surrounds then the CB5s.

I have a C-50 as a back surround and it does a good job, but it never did as much as the C-100s.

[9883]

But if I don't have an amp that can power the Cf-50's to their full potential and the sub is taking care of the low end than what's the point. When people say that speakers sound fuller I don't think that can be quantified and is highly subjective and especially misleading when comparing speakers of different brands. When people rate the next model up as being better how much of that is influenced by the expectation of the speaker to be better because of the price and rank. I'm just looking strictly at the specs and I fail to see a big difference like I would when comparing the CF-30 to the Cf-70 or the CF-50 to the CF-70. I hope this does not sound too convoluted.