The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

[FastAndFluid]

Originally Posted by coulson96

No they did not. Are you not aware of Connolly's health problems? The man has Parkinson's and cancer. The scenes where Connolly was on foot are indeed him but they had to use CGI to make him look younger (smooth his face) and to enhance his fighting so he looks real, The only full cg shots of Connolly are the ones on the Pig and some of the more extreme action as his health concerns would not allow him to practically shoot the more extravagant action sequences. I've read the new movie guide behind the scenes book and its all in there.

Weta didn't steal anything, if anything they tried their hardest to make the character's movements similar to Connolly's vocal performance for the problem scenes. That's how good an actor he is, he doesn't need his looks to hit the right comedy beats.

If you didn't like it then fine but I wonder if you'd be complaining if Dain wasn't in the film due to billy's health problems?

The abiity of fan boi's to delude themselves and concoct far-fetched reasons for utterly ridiculous decisions or behaviour never fails to amaze me. Funny how Connolly has made films after this one that came out earlier this year and there were no problems at all with his health or appearance, but heh! let's not let facts get in the way of trying to justify our silly opinions that have absolutely no basis in fact.

I pointed out several weeks ago that PJ had changed Connolly to CGI on a whim, at the last minute and hadn't even told Connolly. Back then I was apparently a liar and a Peter Jackson hater and had made the story up. Presumably this is still the case.

Hilarious!

[coulson96]

Originally Posted by FastAndFluid

The abiity of fan boi's to delude themselves and concoct far-fetched reasons for utterly ridiculous decisions or behaviour never fails to amaze me. Funny how Connolly has made films after this one that came out earlier this year and there were no problems at all with his health or appearance, but heh! let's not let facts get in the way of trying to justify our silly opinions that have absolutely no basis in fact.

I pointed out several weeks ago that PJ had changed Connolly to CGI on a whim, at the last minute and hadn't even told Connolly. Back then I was apparently a liar and a Peter Jackson hater and had made the story up. Presumably this is still the case.

Hilarious!

Why are you blaming me for others actions? So I'm a fan of the franchise, shoot me down. One simple question though, does it matter that much in the context of a the film that they had to make some cgi changes to Dain, is the character of Dain still in the film? Yes he is. In the context of the film (not the context of the book) is he that important of a character other than for two battle scenes and some amusing dialogue?

The fact of the matter is that no one actually knows the real reason as news reports and sites are hardly trustworthy and very often get the wrong end of the stick. The only people who know why they did it are Jackson and weta themselves and as none of us have the luxury of having either on speaking terms or working in production we'll not know till the appendices next year give I'm sure a perfectly good reason or if the art and design chronicle book covers it.

I have read the behind the scenes one and I'm sure there was something about that decision in there as there was a picture and some concept art and some cg breakdowns.

I only know what I read in articles and in the behind the scenes book.
I know nothing more. Perhaps I, and the book am wrong and peter Jackson basically said " I'M GONNA CUT OUT THIS AWARD WINNING ACTOR FOR NO REASON WHATSOEVER" despite the fact that peter isn't some selfish money-grabber as some people wish to paint him as. Everyone who has ever met him has said precisely the opposite.

I mean he stayed up for 36 hours before the premiere to finish the film, he is spending the next six months making an extended version of the film for US the fans just cause he cares about giving us all the options. He's spent over 14 years of his life devoted to LOTR and The Hobbit because he himself is a fan. He would NOT take the decision to replace an actor's performance lightly.

Do remember with Azog he made the original design into another character who had a reasonably substantial part in AUJ and he made the original Bolg into the torturer at Dol Guldur and used the same guy in the Battle of moria. Now if he was a selfish and careless as some seem to be under the illusion of thinking then surely he would've just booted those actors as he no longer needed them.

That's not the kind of the guy he is, he sees all people in his production as important. He's even said if this Hobbit trilogy won any Oscars he'd want them to be for his actors or other roles in production such as production design or visual effects. He's not interested in winning awards, he's interested in telling a story through six films that this generation when they are older can watch seamlessly as one story, not concerning themselves about petty time differences or "which was made first" "which is better than the other" just the story.

Now taking that into account I doubt it was an easy whim like decision to replace Connolly. He's a filmmaker not a monster. I think some people are blinded by hate, because they feel nostalgia for LOTR that they don't for the hobbit but as I have specified. These films are intended for the younger generation to watch and then look back on with their own nostalgia. This is their Lord Of The Rings.

Yes I'm a big fan of Jackson and all six Middle Earth films but why does that make my opinion less valid than those who aren't. Neither of us know the full facts behind the decision so this is all relative speculation.

I am not deluded, and to call me so I have to say makes you come across as extremely rude.

[Myshkin]

Not that I care if BC was CG or not, but hasn't he been through the illnesses and has improved in health recently. It might explain why he was ill during the filming of The Hobbit and OK for the film he did earlier this year.

[coulson96]

Originally Posted by Myshkin

Not that I care if BC was CG or not, but hasn't he been through the illnesses and has improved in health recently. It might explain why he was ill during the filming of The Hobbit and OK for the film he did earlier this year.

Yes that's quite correct. Billy was originally in the intended second film so he filmed the majority in 2012 but apparently parts were done in early 2013 when it became film 3. So afterwards his health may have improved but its entirely possible that during the filming of the Hobbit it was still problematic. Which film was he in earlier in the year? Just out of pure interest.

Edit. It was what we did on our holiday. This was filmed in June 2013 for 7 weeks. The Hobbit was much earlier so maybe he had problems.

[SymbioticFunction]

Originally Posted by coulson96

I mean he stayed up for 36 hours before the premiere to finish the film, he is spending the next six months making an extended version of the film for US the fans just cause he cares about giving us all the options. He's spent over 14 years of his life devoted to LOTR and The Hobbit because he himself is a fan.

Peter Jackson receives enormous financial recompense. Thinking that he's crafting extended Hobbit cuts purely out of love for the fans seems a bit naive.

[Myshkin]

He also didn't want to direct originally, not exactly a decision that would back up a "crafted out of love for Tolkien and devotion to the fans" idea.

No doubt he does love Tolkien and he is devoted to the fans (to a point) but it's also a job.

Staying up for 36 hours on the last day before the premier could be seen not so much as dedication as over-meddling, bad time management etc... I'm not coming down on any one of those theories. I love LOTR, so whatever the case it works for me but I wouldn't paint Jackson in such a pious light.

[FastAndFluid]

Originally Posted by SymbioticFunction

Peter Jackson receives enormous financial recompense. Thinking that he's crafting extended Hobbit cuts purely out of love for the fans seems a bit naive.

Thank you! These movies cost THREE TIMES what The Lord of the Rings movies "cost" even with all the wastage and reshoots on those films that were more than most blockbusters get to create a film from scratch. And yet still the farce that all three were shot at the same time is maintained (they were shot at the same time but nothing that could have been released as complete films without months of "reshoots/pickups" for Two Towers and then even more again for Return of The King was available because Jackson had spent all the cash and didn't have key scenes that were needed). This isn't rocket science. Just look at how different Gollum is in the first movie vs the second two to see how Jackson's complete inability to plan ahead or focus on the issues results in last minute changes that don't marry up.

What I find laughable is all this praise of the "hero" style of film-making that Jackson does - always leaving everything to the last minute, incapable of making basic decisions, resulting in everybody around him having to rush and pull 36 hour days to dig him out of the hole he's dug himself into because he's too busy doing stuff he wants to do (guest editing "Empire" etc) instead of getting on and finishing the ruddy film. Even when he's had years of pre-production to prepare and a film shoot that literally lasted over a year! Go back and watch those ROTK extra's. Every time he promises his staff it will "never be like this again". Every time it is. And for one very basic reason - he leaves everything to the last minute with his "laid back" approach. It's like that joke about the bad woman driver "never been in an accident - but seen hundreds happening around her".

I knew about the Billy Connelly situation because the "Making of..." book had a fantastic double-page photo of Billy in the role but just as it was about to go to press the publishers were told they couldn't use it because "we changed him to CGI". The author had spoken to Billy just the day before and he hadn't been told. My own theory is that Jackson tends to get star struck and dilly-dally and probably didn't have the shots he needed. No problem - get the wizards at Weta Digital to "build" them for you. We've got a few weeks left before we have to release the film!

On a more positive note, if the Connelly CGI is as ropy as most here are saying there is a chance that it will be improved by the time the Blu-Ray appears where the professionalism of the Weta Digital guys will probably result in them begging Jackson to let them "tidy up" things for the Blu-Ray. A similar situation happened with the "Black Rider appears to have been hiding behind a tree" scenario in the first LOTR film where the huge gap between the tree and the right edge of the frame on the theatrical release was dramatically reduced for the DVD and then removed completely for the extended edition.

[bga84]

I'm pretty sure, almost certain, that nothing about the Wraith appearing from behind the tree has ever changed.

I saw the EE of the film recently on bluray and remember the right edge of the tree still being some way from the edge of frame and the Wraith appearing from behind it.

[levcore]

Originally Posted by FastAndFluid

A similar situation happened with the "Black Rider appears to have been hiding behind a tree" scenario in the first LOTR film where the huge gap between the tree and the right edge of the frame on the theatrical release was dramatically reduced for the DVD and then removed completely for the extended edition.

There is still a gap on the right side of the tree on the extended blu ray.

[levcore]

Originally Posted by bga84

I'm pretty sure, almost certain, that nothing about the Wraith appearing from behind the tree has ever changed.

I saw the EE of the film recently on bluray and remember the right edge of the tree still being some way from the edge of frame and the Wraith appearing from behind it.

Ah you beat me to it, this!

They even discuss it in the commentary saying they wanted to do it that way so the Wraith's appear more mystical or whatever.

[coulson96]

Is there any word on a UK date for this yet? I'm gonna guess early- mid april, as The Hunger Games Mockingjay is the 23rd March and Into The Woods is 18th May, so the hobbit being in cinemas early December, you'd think would fit in somewhere in-between. I'm hoping for the closest Monday to 7th April as desolation came out Monday 7th last year. Wonder what the cover art will be like, will they go The Unexpected Journey route and just give us a photo of a battle worn bilbo like what currently adorns the TBC cover or perhaps the desolation route and give us the official one sheet of the battle currently adorning my bedroom wall

I hope when this is all confirmed they do a Boxset of all 6 theatrical films in a stylistic way, it could be really cool, they could have on the front cover The hobbit characters sort of in front of the lonely mountain in the distance and then on the back could be the LOTR characters in front of mount doom in the distance. Then after you take the cases out of the box on the Hobbit trilogy fold out case (like with agents of shield) they could just have the Arkenstone floating on an Erebor green stone background with the golden writing of "The Hobbit" in the title card style from the film. Then on the LOTR trilogy case the one ring floating on a black scorched stone with an orange glow around it with the title card text for Lord of the rings. The discs could have either characters or scenarios, like the Unexpected Journey disc could be Bag end on the front, the desolation disc could be Dol Guldur, the battle of the five armies disc could be Erebor's front gate, then the bonus disc could have Smaug on it. For Lotr fellowship's disc could have The bridge of Kazadum with Gandalf on it, the two towers disc could have Helm's deep then the final disc could have Baradur. Then the bonus disc could have Sauron in full black armor. The backs of the cases of each for Hobbit could have Smaug and then for LOTR either the eye or armored Sauron.

[Pork Chop Express]

Originally Posted by coulson96

Is there any word on a UK date for this yet? I'm gonna guess early- mid april, as The Hunger Games Mockingjay is the 23rd March and Into The Woods is 18th May, so the hobbit being in cinemas early December, you'd think would fit in somewhere in-between. I'm hoping for the closest Monday to 7th April as desolation came out Monday 7th last year. Wonder what the cover art will be like, will they go The Unexpected Journey route and just give us a photo of a battle worn bilbo like what currently adorns the TBC cover or perhaps the desolation route and give us the official one sheet of the battle currently adorning my bedroom wall

I hope when this is all confirmed they do a Boxset of all 6 theatrical films in a stylistic way, it could be really cool, they could have on the front cover The hobbit characters sort of in front of the lonely mountain in the distance and then on the back could be the LOTR characters in front of mount doom in the distance. Then after you take the cases out of the box on the Hobbit trilogy fold out case (like with agents of shield) they could just have the Arkenstone floating on an Erebor green stone background with the golden writing of "The Hobbit" in the title card style from the film. Then on the LOTR trilogy case the one ring floating on a black scorched stone with an orange glow around it with the title card text for Lord of the rings. The discs could have either characters or scenarios, like the Unexpected Journey disc could be Bag end on the front, the desolation disc could be Dol Guldur, the battle of the five armies disc could be Erebor's front gate, then the bonus disc could have Smaug on it. For Lotr fellowship's disc could have The bridge of Kazadum with Gandalf on it, the two towers disc could have Helm's deep then the final disc could have Baradur. Then the bonus disc could have Sauron in full black armor. The backs of the cases of each for Hobbit could have Smaug and then for LOTR either the eye or armored Sauron.

Wow.You've REALLY put a lot of thought into that.

[coulson96]

Originally Posted by Pork Chop Express

Wow.You've REALLY put a lot of thought into that.

Yeah...but that would be cool that scenario wouldn't it? Considering the fanfare most huge franchise box sets get, think of Star Wars and Indiana Jones, those Boxsets are fantastic, heck even Marvel's agents of shield got the star treatment from Disney and abc. Lets hope WB can follow those examples.

[Jake2104]

Any updates on a release date yet?

[Indiana Jones]

If I were a betting man I would say Monday 6th April.

[malcy30]

Also worth noting that Amazon is now cheapest to pre-order at £18 for the 3D version.

[coulson96]

Originally Posted by Indiana Jones

If I were a betting man I would say Monday 6th April.

That is a bank holiday though, easter monday, so no post isn't it. I think 13th april is a more likely date.

[Rixx]

Pre-orders for the hobbit trilogy 2D & 3D are up on Zavvi.

http://www.zavvi.com/blu-ray/the-hob.../11070271.html

http://www.zavvi.com/blu-ray/the-hob.../11070272.html


The Hobbit Trilogy - Blu-ray

The Hobbit Trilogy - 3D Blu-ray

[coulson96]

Originally Posted by Rixx

Pre-orders for the hobbit trilogy 2D & 3D are up on Zavvi.

http://www.zavvi.com/blu-ray/the-hob.../11070271.html

http://www.zavvi.com/blu-ray/the-hob.../11070272.html


The Hobbit Trilogy - Blu-ray

The Hobbit Trilogy - 3D Blu-ray

Hope that isn't the final cover, for the Hobbit i was hoping for something more comprehensive like Erebor with the characters in front of it, or the arkenstone.

[Rixx]

Originally Posted by coulson96

Hope that isn't the final cover, for the Hobbit i was hoping for something more comprehensive like Erebor with the characters in front of it, or the arkenstone.

Probably temp artwork as it's also the same as both releases of the Battle of the Five Armies.