Is Blu-ray too early? 4k tvs at reasonable prices already.

[kolasi]

westinghouse tvs wont be great at any resolution.

[Firestreak]

Could the 200 gig Blu-ray discs be enough space for those movies if they were released 10 years from now?

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by Firestreak

Could the 200 gig Blu-ray discs be enough space for those movies if they were released 10 years from now?

So far the only ones show are BD-R/RE. A replicated form would need to be created.

But, 200GB probably wouldn't be needed. Improvements in the encoders, and the compression efficiencies of real-world scenes would probably require only 100GB. LG-Hitachi showed this idea at CES2006 and in Japan last year.

And there is always the possibility of nominal improvements over time in computing power allowing yet another new codec for a next-next gen player that requires the same space/bandwidth.

At which point, of course, Sony is pushing Ultra-BD that uses BD replication, versus some foolish idea by Toshiba and all the other CE to introduce a new format.

[unreal1080p]

Originally Posted by BluSmoke

The new Westinghouse 4k is only $15,000. In 2 years, these things will probably be under $5000. Which begs the question: what happens to Blu-ray? Will it be supplanted by a 4k disc?

BluSmoke... stop blowing blu smoke up Blu-Ray fans butts

There is NOT going to be 4K media for the home. The next step is SHV/UHD and that's 8K or 33 million pixels (vs. the current 2 million pixels of 2K) and you will have to wait until sometime between 2040-2050 to see it in the home.

4K is going to be used in digital movie theaters (AFAIK not happening yet) for a decade until until 8K is ready to take over. Then, even later will come 8K broadcasts in Japan and even later a movie format for the home supporting 8K.

If you want to skip Blu-Ray and wait until somewhere between 2040-2050... be my guest.

P.S. Manufacturers will keep pushing the limits with their "prototype" displays but, even if a few of them make it to market, they will NEVER be at mass market prices because they will NEVER get mass market production runs (NO demand). Manufacturers will concentrate on 1080P HDTV's and are going to make them bigger, cheaper, leaner (slim), less power hungry, improved contrast ratios, more accurate color reproduction, better motion resolution etc...

[cj-kent]

Originally Posted by CasualCat2001

No. How much closer are you going to have to sit to see the difference?

There are already diminishing returns for current 1080P and even 720P as a lot of people don't sit close enough to benefit from the increased resolution given their screen size.

Great chart. Thanks a lot.

[Iceman_II]

From what I understand, most DLP theaters are running cinema 2K... I completely fail to see why you need a 4K display in the home

[WickyWoo]

From what I understand, most DLP theaters are running cinema 2K... I completely fail to see why you need a 4K display in the home

It's mostly just a bragging rights thing. It's like the people who load up on 3 GPUs in their PC overclocked to hell so they can run their games at 2500xwhatever despite the fact that all the assets are designed for 1600x1200 or so

No screen that will fit in 99.9999% of homes can effectively use more than 1080p

[ilsiu]

Wow, lots of love for Westinghouse

Seriously - do you guys that have such low regard for budget products (Westinghouse, Vizio, Olevia, etc) believe that Blu-ray quality is wasted on these TVs? I.e. people with these TVs (and there are a lot of them) should not even bother with HDM?

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

It's mostly just a bragging rights thing. It's like the people who load up on 3 GPUs in their PC overclocked to hell so they can run their games at 2500xwhatever despite the fact that all the assets are designed for 1600x1200 or so

No screen that will fit in 99.9999% of homes can effectively use more than 1080p

You're right for flat panels. But, I'll bet front projectors are in more than 0.0001% of homes.

Gary

[DrGonzo]

Originally Posted by HighDefChief

Ah! So I'll need a 100" TV for 1440p at 10 feet! So I guess I'd need a 130" TV for 2160p at 10 feet

ummm... the graph just happens to extend that far for aesthetic purposes and to show the fact that you'd need a ridiculously large tv to notice much of a difference. obviously it's not trying to suggest you need to buy 130" television. try using the data in the middle of the graph that's actually relevant, as opposed to just being a smart a** about it.

it's really just pointing out that the average tv viewer doesn't need to splurge on a monstrosity of a 1080p tv... actually quite relevant for those who don't have enough extra coin to buy more than 1 really nice tv every 6 or 8 years. they can see that their month's pay isn't going to get them much of an upgrade, or a noticeable one at least.

[LeoneFan]

Originally Posted by ilsiu

Wow, lots of love for Westinghouse

Seriously - do you guys that have such low regard for budget products (Westinghouse, Vizio, Olevia, etc) believe that Blu-ray quality is wasted on these TVs? I.e. people with these TVs (and there are a lot of them) should not even bother with HDM?

Hooking up a Blu-ray player to one of those "budget" brands is like putting racing fuel in a kia.

[Dadds]

whats wrong with westinghouse tvs??

the pq is great at 1080p

so the contrast is only 1000 - 1 but it is still a great tv for the best price

in fact the 37' was the gaming tv of 2007

[HighDefChief]

Originally Posted by DrGonzo

ummm... the graph just happens to extend that far for aesthetic purposes and to show the fact that you'd need a ridiculously large tv to notice much of a difference. obviously it's not trying to suggest you need to buy 130" television. try using the data in the middle of the graph that's actually relevant, as opposed to just being a smart a** about it.

it's really just pointing out that the average tv viewer doesn't need to splurge on a monstrosity of a 1080p tv... actually quite relevant for those who don't have enough extra coin to buy more than 1 really nice tv every 6 or 8 years. they can see that their month's pay isn't going to get them much of an upgrade, or a noticeable one at least.

Graphs like the one posted are a joke. They are there to try to get people to buy the largest (and most expensive hmm...) TV in the store. Coincidence? Give me a break. I can clearly see how HD is better than SD at further viewing distances than that chart says for various sized TVs.

And yes when I am presented with data, such as a graph I am going to look at the whole graph, not just "the middle" then again I guess I am a smarta** for looking at all the data

[soright903]

Originally Posted by Elandyll

"Only" 15k ? lol.

Thats it, damn well then I'll take two!!! LOL

[Bricktop]

So, because we are limited to a 1080p source for now, and we all think Blu-Ray is the best thing ever, we have no need for inovation and better products? I have see posts time and again lambasting those who do not care, nor see any difference between HD and SD, so why does that not apply now? Not evereyone can afford this, and truth is I cannot see spending that kind of green on a TV any time soon, but technology gets cheap fast. 3 years ago the only 1080p TVs were around 5 grand, but look now.

All, I'm saying is, why need always look for better. What most of us have now will not be close to cutting edge 3 or 4 years from now. Now a 4K TV may not be the end all, but just think of a 4K PJ with a 100+" screen. Before HD was availible, upscaling on a higher res TV made DVDs that much better, why not HD? Just saying.

No if the only real issue is the price for the $, then yes, I agree.

[Midnightsailor]

Originally Posted by kolasi

westinghouse tvs wont be great at any resolution.

I've seen some good-looking Westinghouse tv's...personally.

[Noshame]

Originally Posted by BluSmoke

The new Westinghouse 4k is only $15,000. In 2 years, these things will probably be under $5000. Which begs the question: what happens to Blu-ray? Will it be supplanted by a 4k disc?

i do not think so...4K now is used just to scan film negatives to transfer them to the highest videores possible. Blade runner has been scanned on 4k and brought back to negative for the theatrical re release, so they do with most of the movies now after the editing, they create of a digital intermediate at 4k and go back to 35mm.
I believe we could get 4k on disc when the experimental multi layered BDs will be available for consumers.

[krinkle]

3-4 years from now I will probably have upgraded to:

A new 4K projector for my current 159" theater
A Blu-ray player that upconverts to 4K


In 4 years we will be arguing how much differnence there is between upconverted Blu-ray and native 4K.

It is exciting to have the potential of 4K at home!

[IvanDrago]

Easy on the Westinghouse Hate guys. They do make very good LCDs and the best sets for the price. My second HDTV is a 47" 1080p Westy set that I got for about $800, which would be about half the cost of a Sharp or a $2000 less than a Sony.

Granted the Sharp or Sony would look slightly better, but $2000 buys a whole lot of Blu Rays.

[unreal1080p]

Originally Posted by krinkle

3-4 years from now I will probably have upgraded to:

A new 4K projector for my current 159" theater
A Blu-ray player that upconverts to 4K


In 4 years we will be arguing how much differnence there is between upconverted Blu-ray and native 4K.

It is exciting to have the potential of 4K at home!

You are NOT going to get 4K media for the home. Hollywood is desperatly trying to keep movie theaters alive and they are hoping 4K digital in movie theaters will help them acheive their goal. There is NO chance that the studios agree to release their content in 4K for the home... NO chance.

The next improvement in media for the home will go hand-in-hand with the next broadcast standard for the home. Considering we are barely scratching the surface with 1080 HDTV broadcasts... this is several decades away (think 2040-2050).

IMHO, it's better to faithfully represent the native format of the media (1080P24) then to attempt upconverting it. IMHO, a 4K projector for the home would be a COMPLETE waste of money.