Unforgiven 4K UHD (1992)

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Jumpman

Samsung 55'' 6001 1080p set.

Thanks. What player are you using, as I'd be very leery of anything but a Panasonic doing the SDR conversion.

And Kris has some wise words above. When HDR calibration is talked of as not being set, it's being able to manipulate the tracking & mapping of the EOTF that's the key issue here. We can still set things like colour & greyscale and colour temperature which but until the TV's EOTF can be properly attuned with manual intervention then the brightness (or not) of the image will still be open to question instead of knowing for sure whether it's the display or the content that's at fault (admittedly I've thrown plenty of shade at the former in this thread thus far).

Yes, this is the essence of what the dynamic systems will do, to map the content to the specific highs and lows of the respective displays, but, to take a different tack, it won't be able to overcome things like overly dark grades vs the BD equivalent if that's what's been chosen by the filmmakers. In this case, one wonders if Clint has had any input into the HDR grading, we've already had Sully (which for my money actually had raised blacks vs the Blu) which he must surely have overseen as part of the video gradings built into the post-production process, so did he get a look at Unforgiven?

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Thanks. What player are you using, as I'd be very leery of anything but a Panasonic doing the SDR conversion.

And Kris has some wise words above. When HDR calibration is talked of as not being set, it's being able to manipulate the tracking & mapping of the EOTF that's the key issue here. We can still set things like colour & greyscale and colour temperature which but until the TV's EOTF can be properly attuned with manual intervention then the brightness (or not) of the image will still be open to question instead of knowing for sure whether it's the display or the content that's at fault (admittedly I've thrown plenty of shade at the former in this thread thus far).

Yes, this is the essence of what the dynamic systems will do, to map the content to the specific highs and lows of the respective displays, but, to take a different tack, it won't be able to overcome things like overly dark grades vs the BD equivalent if that's what's been chosen by the filmmakers. In this case, one wonders if Clint has had any input into the HDR grading, we've already had Sully (which for my money actually had raised blacks vs the Blu) which he must surely have overseen as part of the video gradings built into the post-production process, so did he get a look at Unforgiven?

The Philips 1st gen player.

[Geoff D]

Interesting. I'm pretty darned sure that the Philips uses Panasonic guts as I think I've said to you before, but given how it lacks certain niceties of the actual Panasonics like the SDR conversion slider I'm wary as to the quality of its SDR conversion. Or it's spot on and Unforgiven really has been darkened down like a mofo.

[StingingVelvet]

Amazon never shipped my order so I picked this up at Best Buy this morning before getting groceries. Price matched to my $31 Amazon order, pricey but this movie is worth it. I have NOT watched the movie yet, but I did put both discs in for a quick examination. I'll rant more below, but the "tl;dr" is that the UHD is by far better.

First off, the UHD is darker, yes. However it is not too dark. Daytime scenes look appropriately bright when sunny, more overcast when not. There's not a huge difference there unless you have your backlight on very high with SDR. It's the nighttime scenes which look a lot darker in a lot of cases, but I looked hard at small details and they still were visible. Considering the climax (for example) takes place on a rainy night in a town without electricity I think the UHD looks more appropriate, very dark and fire-lit, but still all details visible.

More importantly the HDR really adds a lot of texture to this one. There is a lot of 3D style "pop" going on with people and objects due to the added depth HDR provides. There is also a nice detail boost, lots more crispness. I looked at hands, saddles, things like that and it was very obvious. Color was hard to judge on a quick skip through but I noticed the scene where Eastwood waits for the money toward the end looked MUCH more like dusk than the BD did. The opening sunset against the cabin looked MUCH more restrained than the red explosion on the BD.

To my quick eye the UHD looks much more like film and is very pleasing. I totally get why this will be a divisive disc though, because I bet having the right nits, color volume and tone mapping will matter a LOT, and how much you want your UHDs to look like film will matter a LOT too.

If anything changes when I watch the film later I'll update. There might be some scenes I didn't see that look off.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

The Martian was pretty easy to re-build because a good portion of the footage required no digital effects (a lot of indoor shots or landscapes with only digital color timing manipulation of real locations), plus they had principal photography files in 4k and 6k to work with. The biggest thing was uprezzing the 2k effects to 4k and re-comping.

Fox also had Ridley Scott breathing down their necks. He has industry clout.

This is the exception and not the rule.

You really think they went to the trouble of actually re-compositing the VFX? I didn't get that impression at all from the statement from Fox, that it was the 5K original where applicable (not 6K because the lenses they used didn't cover the entire RED sensor) and entirely uprezzed 2K shots.

[brainofj72]

Dammit, Velvet, why must you torture me?!

[Trekkie313]

Originally Posted by brainofj72

Dammit, Velvet, why must you torture me?!

Stings, doesn't it?

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

Amazon never shipped my order so I picked this up at Best Buy this morning before getting groceries. Price matched to my $31 Amazon order, pricey but this movie is worth it. I have NOT watched the movie yet, but I did put both discs in for a quick examination. I'll rant more below, but the "tl;dr" is that the UHD is by far better.

First off, the UHD is darker, yes. However it is not too dark. Daytime scenes look appropriately bright when sunny, more overcast when not. There's not a huge difference there unless you have your backlight on very high with SDR. It's the nighttime scenes which look a lot darker in a lot of cases, but I looked hard at small details and they still were visible. Considering the climax (for example) takes place on a rainy night in a town without electricity I think the UHD looks more appropriate, very dark and fire-lit, but still all details visible.

More importantly the HDR really adds a lot of texture to this one. There is a lot of 3D style "pop" going on with people and objects due to the added depth HDR provides. There is also a nice detail boost, lots more crispness. I looked at hands, saddles, things like that and it was very obvious. Color was hard to judge on a quick skip through but I noticed the scene where Eastwood waits for the money toward the end looked MUCH more like dusk than the BD did. The opening sunset against the cabin looked MUCH more restrained than the red explosion on the BD.

To my quick eye the UHD looks much more like film and is very pleasing. I totally get why this will be a divisive disc though, because I bet having the right nits, color volume and tone mapping will matter a LOT, and how much you want your UHDs to look like film will matter a LOT too.

If anything changes when I watch the film later I'll update. There might be some scenes I didn't see that look off.

That's what got me while watching this on my 1080p set. While, again, I really liked the "pop" of the BD, the UHD does look more naturalistic/film-like. That's just undeniable. It's the reason why I said that I was having a hard time deciding which one I liked the most because I can see the merits of each disc.

[ncraft]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

Amazon never shipped my order so I picked this up at Best Buy this morning before getting groceries. Price matched to my $31 Amazon order, pricey but this movie is worth it. I have NOT watched the movie yet, but I did put both discs in for a quick examination. I'll rant more below, but the "tl;dr" is that the UHD is by far better.

First off, the UHD is darker, yes. However it is not too dark. Daytime scenes look appropriately bright when sunny, more overcast when not. There's not a huge difference there unless you have your backlight on very high with SDR. It's the nighttime scenes which look a lot darker in a lot of cases, but I looked hard at small details and they still were visible. Considering the climax (for example) takes place on a rainy night in a town without electricity I think the UHD looks more appropriate, very dark and fire-lit, but still all details visible.

More importantly the HDR really adds a lot of texture to this one. There is a lot of 3D style "pop" going on with people and objects due to the added depth HDR provides. There is also a nice detail boost, lots more crispness. I looked at hands, saddles, things like that and it was very obvious. Color was hard to judge on a quick skip through but I noticed the scene where Eastwood waits for the money toward the end looked MUCH more like dusk than the BD did. The opening sunset against the cabin looked MUCH more restrained than the red explosion on the BD.

To my quick eye the UHD looks much more like film and is very pleasing. I totally get why this will be a divisive disc though, because I bet having the right nits, color volume and tone mapping will matter a LOT, and how much you want your UHDs to look like film will matter a LOT too.

If anything changes when I watch the film later I'll update. There might be some scenes I didn't see that look off.

I did the same as you. Got lucky as they only got in 2 copies and snagged one of them. Also picked up The Mummy set for $39.99.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Jumpman

That's what got me while watching this on my 1080p set. While, again, I really liked the "pop" of the BD, the UHD does look more naturalistic/film-like. That's just undeniable. It's the reason why I said that I was having a hard time deciding which one I liked the most because I can see the merits of each disc.

It's funny because I compared 3:10 to Yuma a couple days ago and the UHD there was a lot more restrained and natural looking too, but I preferred the BD because it looked more unique and was the only way I ever saw the movie. This time I firmly believe Unforgiven is supposed to look natural and film-like, and the UHD accomplishes that much better if my quick scan is to be trusted.

[Havenbull]

Amazon just notified me an hour ago my order was delayed indefinitely... Anyone else get this?

[ncraft]

Originally Posted by Havenbull

Amazon just notified me an hour ago my order was delayed indefinitely... Anyone else get this?

My email said June 13th. With an easy cancel button on the email,which is what I did.

[Pieter V]

Amazon Canada has also low stock. Three copies left.

[HDMan72]

Originally Posted by Havenbull

Amazon just notified me an hour ago my order was delayed indefinitely... Anyone else get this?

Same here, but they wanted my approval to keep the order by June 15th. My guess is they'll have more copies next week.

[tyrok]

Wow. WB really messed up this release. Its next to impossible to find and they never bothered to drop the price to $30. They should have just delayed it.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by tyrok

Wow. WB really messed up this release. Its next to impossible to find and they never bothered to drop the price to $30. They should have just delayed it.

They're certainly making sure this format stays niche.

[Doctorossi]

Reminds me of the LD days, when I'd hit every LD store in town on release day and not only would none of them have that day's new release I was looking for, they wouldn't even know it was being released.

"UHD: shop with nostalgia!"

[Dreamliner330]

Well I got my copy of Unforgiven 4K. Selling the Digital Copy in the DC thread if anyone wants it.

I picked up a different UHD player too, we'll see how it looks.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

It's funny because I compared 3:10 to Yuma a couple days ago and the UHD there was a lot more restrained and natural looking too, but I preferred the BD because it looked more unique and was the only way I ever saw the movie. This time I firmly believe Unforgiven is supposed to look natural and film-like, and the UHD accomplishes that much better if my quick scan is to be trusted.

You might be right.

[Havenbull]

Also just cancelled my pre-order and drove to Best Buy during lunch, had them price match one of only two copies they had.