audiophile/videophile Here To Stay discussion thread

[JTK]

Originally Posted by GTP

These can be bought cheaper than 5k(The Pearl)....but the 1080p DLP pj's are just starting to trickle out....and by this spring...there will be more to compare to.

There should also be a lot more players and movies to compare them on.

If I had to buy today....it would be the Optoma H-81 with the included outboard scaler....but they have a few issues to work out first.

I am usually one of the first to jump.....but waiting for HD optical to get going...has forced me to be more paitient when upgrading.

I want to see you look over the last couple of pages of this thread and give me your two cents on the whole subject.

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by GTP

These can be bought cheaper than 5k(The Pearl)....but the 1080p DLP pj's are just starting to trickle out....and by this spring...there will be more to compare to.

There should also be a lot more players and movies to compare them on.

If I had to buy today....it would be the Optoma H-81 with the included outboard scaler....but they have a few issues to work out first.

I am usually one of the first to jump.....but waiting for HD optical to get going...has forced me to be more paitient when upgrading.

Unfortunately I think the Optoma has more than "a few" issues to work out. It has far too many issues going on at this time to the point that I would have very little peace of mind in purchasing one. They don't even have down some very basic video settings, and this with a Gennum outboard scaler.

The Pearl has a few concerns, such as color uniformity and convergence, but these don't appear to be wide spread issues. Overall the Pearl has received excellent reviews, including the WSR review by Greg Rogers.

I do like the brightness of the HD81, but all the other issues make that pj a hard sell for me.

I have preordered the JVC RS1 LCoS (D-ILA) based largely on the posts I have read about it, as well as talking to 5 people in person who saw it at the EHexpo in Long Beach.

[JTK]

Wow. I actually got an answer from Sony in 24 hours about my question here.

See what you all make of this answer:

The PLAYSTATION(R)3 computer entertainment system will support audio technology such as Dolby
Digital 5.1 ch, DTS 5.1 ch, LPCM 7.1 ch, AAC, and others.<1> <2>

To playback sound recorded on your
DVD/software in Dolby Digital (AC-3) or DTS format to reproduce the effect of listening in a movie
theater or concert hall, you must connect to audio equipment with the ability to decode DTS or Dolby
Digital sound (sold separately).

You must connect the component via the DIGITAL OUT (OPTICAL)
connector using an optical digital cable (sold separately).

<1> A device compatible with Linear PCM 7.1 Ch. is required to output 7.1 Ch. audio, supported by
Dolby TrueHD or a similar format, from the HDMI OUT connector.

<2> This system does not support output from the DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. audio is output from
a 5.1 or lower channel.

I'm using a 5.1 setup. I hope that information is well known for people with 6.1 or 7.1 setups.


Apply this to me.

In other words: I need a receiver that probably has HDMI 1.1 at least to get all the nice audio codecs off of BD discs?

With the PS3, there's no if, ands, or buts about it otherwise.

That's the message I'm getting here.

When you connect to an audio component with a built in DTS or Dolby Digital decoder set the "DIGITAL
OUT (OPTICAL) to "On" in the "System Configuration."

To utilize the "DIGITAL OUT (OPTICAL)" feature of the PLAYSTATION(R)3 system, you should plug in
the (yellow) "Video" connectors only. You should also disconnect the Left and Right Audio (white and
red) connectors that may be installed into your television/stereo. Every setup can vary depending
upon the make and model of your equipment, so there may be exceptions to this. One such example
would be when you may be using an RFU adapter to relay the video and sound information to the
television.

Duh.

NOTE: The PLAYSTATION(R)3 system allows you to configure the audio output settings independent of
the display output settings.

You may need to make sure the correct audio out setting is selected
for your installation.
1. To choose the audio output setting go to the Settings icon.
2. Navigate down to Sounds Settings and press "X".
3. Navigate to Audio Output Settings and press "X".
4. You will be then prompted to choose from "AV Multi Out port", "Digital Out (optical) port", or
"HDMI Out port". Highlight the output port of you setup and press "X".
5. The audio output of the PLAYSTATION(R)3 system will now output audio from the port you have
selected.

The only real wild card here is: Could that multiAV port be used for multichannel analog outputs down the road or could there be a funky HDMI-multichannel analog audio adapter that could ever be made and come out?

I suspect the answer is "no" to both, but let's see what you all make of this.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...24#post8987524

We'll see where this goes.

[hyperdine]

Originally Posted by JTK

The only real wild card here is: Could that multiAV port be used for multichannel analog outputs down the road or could there be a funky HDMI-multichannel analog audio adapter that could ever be made and come out?

I suspect the answer is "no" to both, but let's see what you all make of this.

My guess is that it is technically possible to have a multichannel output via the multiAV port, but I don't think Sony would do it. I think they want to drive HDMI usage.

I'm sure we'll see Sony release an HDMI 1.3 receiver in the near future (probably at the next CES). That's just a hunch though.

[Rob Tomlin]

<1> A device compatible with Linear PCM 7.1 Ch. is required to output 7.1 Ch. audio, supported by
Dolby TrueHD or a similar format, from the HDMI OUT connector.

<2> This system does not support output from the DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. audio is output from
a 5.1 or lower channel.

So are they saying the PS3 will decode Dolby TrueHD via HDMI, but NOT DTS-HD?

I'm confused.

They say "Dolby TrueHD or similar format", which, I would think, would include DTS-HD?

[JTK]

Originally Posted by hyperdine

My guess is that it is technically possible to have a multichannel output via the multiAV port, but I don't think Sony would do it. I think they want to drive HDMI usage.

I'm sure we'll see Sony release an HDMI 1.3 receiver in the near future (probably at the next CES). That's just a hunch though.

Probably a safe one. This close to it, I probably should wait until HDMI 1.3 receivers are out there.

If I'm going to upgrade, I guess I'd really better make it count.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...73#post8988573

read post 46.


EDIT: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=738511

Great thread!

[GTP]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

Unfortunately I think the Optoma has more than "a few" issues to work out. It has far too many issues going on at this time to the point that I would have very little peace of mind in purchasing one. They don't even have down some very basic video settings, and this with a Gennum outboard scaler.

The Pearl has a few concerns, such as color uniformity and convergence, but these don't appear to be wide spread issues. Overall the Pearl has received excellent reviews, including the WSR review by Greg Rogers.

I do like the brightness of the HD81, but all the other issues make that pj a hard sell for me.

I have preordered the JVC RS1 LCoS (D-ILA) based largely on the posts I have read about it, as well as talking to 5 people in person who saw it at the EHexpo in Long Beach.

Rob....DLP still offers more pop and detail than SXRD...its as simple as that.....and I am a detail fan.
Many that upgraded from the Optoma H-78-79 have said that its more of a sideways move than a huge upgrade.....and I can get a Pearl for less than I paid for my 720p Optoma h-78.....but I will wait until more DLP's are out before choosing which one.

I have seen both the Ruby and Pearl locally....just haven't seen the H-81 yet...but you know what those that have seen both have had to say.

[GTP]

I will check out the JVC this spring if I get the chance.

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by GTP

Rob....DLP still offers more pop and detail than SXRD...its as simple as that.....and I am a detail fan.
Many that upgraded from the Optoma H-78-79 have said that its more of a sideways move than a huge upgrade.....and I can get a Pearl for less than I paid for my 720p Optoma h-78.....but I will wait until more DLP's are out before choosing which one.

I have seen both the Ruby and Pearl locally....just haven't seen the H-81 yet...but you know what those that have seen both have had to say.

After recently doing a demo of both a Ruby and a Pearl (the Ruby was ISF calibrated, the Pearl was poorly calibrated) I have to agree with you 100%!

I was very disappointed in the PQ of both units. I mostly disturbed by what you describe as "pop", or lack thereof, in the Ruby and Pearl. Put another way, they lacked "depth" to the image. They both looked quite "flat". And not as sharp as DLP.

This has placed some doubt with regard to the JVC RS1 I have preordered. However, the reviews have been pretty much unanimous that the RS1 looks "more DLP like" than other LCoS pj's, and has a lot more "pop". So, I still have some hope, but I am starting to think that I may just wait it out a while longer and go with a 1080p DLP pj.

Greg Rogers has his hands on the Optoma HD81 as we speak. Depending on how that review turns out, the Optoma may be back in the running for me.

I am also considering the Sharp Z20000, I just wish it was a tad brighter and didn't have such a long throw.

[Deciazulado]

depth is mostly a result of simultaneous contrast (ANSI) and MTF (full amplitude sharpness till the limits of resolution (high frequencies))
Most test reviewers don't test this things proper or at all...
(For example the current way to test simultaneous contrast (ANSI Contrast) actually does not gives results that correlate that close with an average scene) (I always have to do weird headache inducing Decicalculations using their on/off numbers in conjuction with the ANSI numbers in a special 11 spices secret formula to have an idea for my purposes). And for MTF, test results like: "reproduces the one pixel wide lines as somewhat dark gray" don't tell you what's the attenuation so you can compare models!! *sigh.. aaah the good old days of Stereo Review and Audio magazine test reports that told you the micron displacement of a LP groove.. )

HDTV buying and comparing is much more difficult than it should be..

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

depth is mostly a result of simultaneous contrast (ANSI) and MTF (full amplitude sharpness till the limits of resolution (high frequencies))
Most test reviewers don't test this things proper or at all...
(For example the current way to test simultaneous contrast (ANSI Contrast) actually does not gives results that correlate that close with an average scene) (I always have to do weird headache inducing Decicalculations using their on/off numbers in conjuction with the ANSI numbers in a special 11 spices secret formula to have an idea for my purposes). And for MTF, test results like: "reproduces the one pixel wide lines as somewhat dark gray" don't tell you what's the attenuation so you can compare models!! *sigh.. aaah the good old days of Stereo Review and Audio magazine test reports that told you the micron displacement of a LP groove.. )

HDTV buying and comparing is much more difficult than it should be..

Greg Rogers utilizes a modified test for ANSI contrast for just the reasons that you state.

It is apparently the low ANSI contrast of the Sony SXRD's that are the main reason that I saw a lack of depth or pop to them.

[GTP]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

After recently doing a demo of both a Ruby and a Pearl (the Ruby was ISF calibrated, the Pearl was poorly calibrated) I have to agree with you 100%!

I was very disappointed in the PQ of both units. I mostly disturbed by what you describe as "pop", or lack thereof, in the Ruby and Pearl. Put another way, they lacked "depth" to the image. They both looked quite "flat". And not as sharp as DLP.

This has placed some doubt with regard to the JVC RS1 I have preordered. However, the reviews have been pretty much unanimous that the RS1 looks "more DLP like" than other LCoS pj's, and has a lot more "pop". So, I still have some hope, but I am starting to think that I may just wait it out a while longer and go with a 1080p DLP pj.

Greg Rogers has his hands on the Optoma HD81 as we speak. Depending on how that review turns out, the Optoma may be back in the running for me.

I am also considering the Sharp Z20000, I just wish it was a tad brighter and didn't have such a long throw.

Yes pop = perceived depth....and yes the PJ's both looked on the soft side even with all those extra pixels.

I will be interested in knowing what Greg has to say....if anything...in regards to SXRD vs the H-81.
And of course I am interested in what he may find overall with the H-81.....very much so.

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by GTP

Yes pop = perceived depth....and yes the PJ's both looked on the soft side even with all those extra pixels.

I will be interested in knowing what Greg has to say....if anything...in regards to SXRD vs the H-81.
And of course I am interested in what he may find overall with the H-81.....very much so.

Yep. This projector situation is difficult enough to try and figure out on our own. Having a trusted reviewer like Greg Rogers giving these the once over is invaluable!

[Psiweaver]

Yeah I'm not a huge fan of the sony's either for the reasons stated above. It doesn't help that they can't get a very accurate color temperature and color points either. I'm ISF certified as a calibrator and so when the color is off I get very very annoyed. DLP really is the best looking projectors out there right now. I really like the new Runco 1080p projectors.