Biamping/biwiring questions

[Twitch9]

Originally Posted by DBlackGT

That's your opinion and thats fine. But to some it makes a noticable difference and not just to those with seperate amps.

Same can be said about power conditioners and do they make a difference in picture and sound? Its all in the eye of the beholder.

It's not my opinion its fact, tested and proven by many speaker manufactures, engineers and audio companies. 115w to lows and 115 to highs will not make any difference in sound, a single cable still delivers 115w to all speakers in the cabinet. Unless you are driving huge speakers that require more watts to power them bi-wire/ bi-amping will not improve your sound overall. Speaker companies put the option on speakers for consumers who are driving them with separate amps to achieve a higher power handling, when using a standard receiver for this option will not improve your sound, it's a fact. Everyone has a different opinion on this and if you want to bi-amp and think it improves your sound go for it, if your happy that's all that matters. Now one thing to note, you may or may not notice an improvement in 2 channel stereo mode, this could be the only reason to do this straight from a standard receiver.

[DBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Twitch9

It's not my opinion its fact, tested and proven by many speaker manufactures, engineers and audio companies. 115w to lows and 115 to highs will not make any difference in sound, a single cable still delivers 115w to all speakers in the cabinet. Unless you are driving huge speakers that require more watts to power them bi-wire/ bi-amping will not improve your sound overall. Speaker companies put the option on speakers for consumers who are driving them with separate amps to achieve a higher power handling, when using a standard receiver for this option will not improve your sound, it's a fact. Everyone has a different opinion on this and if you want to bi-amp and think it improves your sound go for it, of your happy that's all that matters. Now one thing to note, you may or may not notice an improvement in 2 channel stereo mode, this could be the only reason to do this straight from a standard receiver.

Its not just about power. Its about imaging, mostly for 2 channel music listening. And thats exactly what I said in an earlier post in this thread about bi-amping.

Originally Posted by DBlackGT

I would say its more for 2 channel music listening. Thats where I noticed the biggest difference. Movies...uhhh not as much as music.

Here's a quote from audioholics.com about bi-amping. It has many more benefits than just power like you are suggesting.

A: Biamping
There are some benefits if you are biamping with identical amps in the system. By doing so, you are now driving the speaker system with dedicated amplifiers for the High Pass (HP) and Low Pass (LP) portions. This may help in bass response, dynamics, and overall fidelity. Another benefit is electrical isolation between highs and lows of the speaker system as they are independently connected to separate amplifiers. This has the potential to reduce crosstalk and mutual inductance, assuming the chokes in the crossovers are isolated and the speaker cables are well separated from each other.


There also appears to be a benefit in passive biamping of amplifiers with finite output impedance such as those found in receivers. Having a dedicated amp to drive the woofer portion and another to drive the mid/tweeters can offer a better degree of system control and linearity assuming the power supply is capable of delivering the rated power into all four channels. In most cases however, very little power is consumed in the HP portion of the speaker since music above 8 kHz in harmonic in nature with very little energy.

So you can say what you want about it but it many cases it improves sound and not just in those who use seperate amps.

[Twitch9]

I missed your post about the 2 channel, and i agree with you on that but for 5.1 i don't think it's necessary to do this. I'm not saying it's all about the power consumption of the speaker and i understand the theory behind bi-amping of separating HP-LP but for your standard HT this is just overkill. The other problem with people doing this is they could possible damage the speakers or the receiver if done incorrectly. I have seen people do this and either try it off the channel B speaker outs or not remove the jumpers from the speakers.

But do you agree power is the main reason people think this is a good idea to do, not for clarity but loudness of their speakers?

[DBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Twitch9

I missed your post about the 2 channel, and i agree with you on that but for 5.1 i don't think it's necessary to do this. I'm not saying it's all about the power consumption of the speaker and i understand the theory behind bi-amping of separating HP-LP but for your standard HT this is just overkill. The other problem with people doing this is they could possible damage the speakers or the receiver if done incorrectly. I have seen people do this and either try it off the channel B speaker outs or not remove the jumpers from the speakers.

But do you agree power is the main reason people think this is a good idea to do, not for clarity but loudness of their speakers?

Yeah if not done correctly it could possibly be fatal. And yes for the average home theater it would not be needed. But for me I listen to 2 channel constantly and thought it was necessary. And i'm glad I did because It did make an audible difference. So I guess it just depends on the user and application.

Oh and for sure most people think bi-amping is a good idea is because its going to be twice the power But I would say to most people if don't listen to 2 channel music A LOT its probably ok if you don't bi-amp.

[Twitch9]

Cool so will leave it at that, at least readers who don't know will understand the reasons to bi-amp after reading this thread or the other hundred on blu-ray.com

Later DBlackGT and happy listening

[Steve]

Originally Posted by Twitch9

Cool so will leave it at that, at least readers who don't know will understand the reasons to bi-amp after reading this thread or the other hundred on blu-ray.com

Later DBlackGT and happy listening

I think I have a better understanding of it now, and since my system is used almost exclusively for HT, I don't think I'll bother with it. I appreciate all you guys had to say about it.

[DBlackGT]

Originally Posted by fireman325

I think I have a better understanding of it now, and since my system is used almost exclusively for HT, I don't think I'll bother with it. I appreciate all you guys had to say about it.

That is a freaking sweet coffee table/chest you have there. Where did you get it?

[DBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Twitch9

Cool so will leave it at that, at least readers who don't know will understand the reasons to bi-amp after reading this thread or the other hundred on blu-ray.com

Later DBlackGT and happy listening

Yeah no biggie. Yeah hopefully we made it clear enough what its for and not for haha. Later

[Steve]

Originally Posted by DBlackGT

That is a freaking sweet coffee table/chest you have there. Where did you get it?

Thank you. It's made by Ashley furniture, and it is a storage chest. It even has hidden rollers under it, so it's easy to roll out of the way for playing Wii. You'd probably have to look through a catalog to find it though. The coffee table, end table next to my sub, and sofa table against the wall by the right surround are all matching tables. Luckily we were able to find an ET stand that matches pretty well as far as color and wood grain go. Anyway we got it at a Orange Park Furniture in Orange Park Furniture. My wife works there.

[Audiophile_At_Birth]

For music, Bi-amping made a considerable difference. Like I said, it opened up the highs and added seperation between the mids and highs, and the mids and lows. The lows seemed tighter as well.

For movies, I can't really say it makes a considerable difference as seen in music. You can certainly tell that the highs match the center more and don't seem dull and skimped out on.

[zombie77]

i have mine biamped and i can tell a huge difference. i dont have a sub atm but the bass that some movies produce shakes the wall now, and as said above the highs are alot cleaner.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by Audiophile_At_Birth

For music, Bi-amping made a considerable difference. Like I said, it opened up the highs and added seperation between the mids and highs, and the mids and lows. The lows seemed tighter as well.

For movies, I can't really say it makes a considerable difference as seen in music. You can certainly tell that the highs match the center more and don't seem dull and skimped out on.

Originally Posted by zombie77

i have mine biamped and i can tell a huge difference. i dont have a sub atm but the bass that some movies produce shakes the wall now, and as said above the highs are alot cleaner.

Thanks. I'm trying to squeeze every last little bit out of my system I can right now, so I guess I will give it a try after all. What have I got to lose right? Unfortunately I'm out of money so I'm trying to make the very most of what I have.

[Johnny Vinyl]

Originally Posted by fireman325

Thanks. I'm trying to squeeze every last little bit out of my system I can right now, so I guess I will give it a try after all. What have I got to lose right? Unfortunately I'm out of money so I'm trying to make the very most of what I have.

Welcome to my world Steve!

John

[Steve]

Originally Posted by John72953

Welcome to my world Steve!

John

You must be my long lost brother!! LOL

[Steve]

Well I just bi-amped my mains and re-ran my Audyssey setup (using the same seating positions of course). It just so happens I watched The Incredible Hulk blu-ray last night, so I put that movie back in and went to the final showdown at the end. I set the volume to the same level and let it play while sitting in the same seat. It seems to me that the bi-amping did make a difference. The highs seemed crisper and better defined. And I know, this could just be because I expect to hear something different, so I think I hear something different. I'll leave that to you guys to debate. Either way, I'm happier with it, whether the effect is real or not. I'll be leaving it this way.

[Go Blue]

So, a speaker must have 4 terminals in the back to be bi-amped, correct?

[Steve]

Originally Posted by schultz

So, a speaker must have 4 terminals in the back to be bi-amped, correct?

Yes.

[Go Blue]

Originally Posted by fireman325

Yes.

Did you do all of yours, or just your 2 fronts?

[AintNoSin]

Originally Posted by schultz

Did you do all of yours, or just your 2 fronts?

Front speakers are the only ones that are usually bi-amped.

[naturephoto1]

I have all of my 5 speakers bi-wired in my 5.1 system. The front L, R, and C channel have 2 sets of cables feeding each speaker. My rear 2 channels have a single wire set set up as a bi-wire. I believe that it had a definite positive affect on the sound, but in my case I am using a high end system of electronics, power amps, speakers, and wiring (including speaker cables). When I go to a 7.1 system, both my side and rear speakers will be set up with a single wire set set-up for bi-wiring.

Rich