The Little Mermaid 4K UHD (1989) (30th Anniversary Edition)

[gwfb5]

Originally Posted by IXOYE1989

Disney Movie Rewards has them available if you collect DMR points and would prefer this route over eBay:

The Little Mermaid DVD + Blu-ray

The Little Mermaid Diamond Edition Blu-ray + DVD

Would expect both of these to be the corrected discs.

While I suppose it's possible to get a corrected copy from DMRs, it would be a very big gamble.

I bought my Diamond Edition at Walmart years ago, and thankfully it was a corrected copy.
However, I also later bought the DVD-case edition from the DMC for a family member which turned out to be faulty.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

When photography was completed, cells were thrown away, or washed -- even thrown on the ground and guys would skate around the floor on them. It's the end product -- the film -- that's the original artwork.

Considering that some of the Disney folks in the old restoration featurette on the Snow White DVD literally say that the grain-reduced end product is like "looking at the original animation cel itself" then even they don't subscribe to your way of thinking, sadly - but then we knew that already about them!

[IXOYE1989]

Originally Posted by gwfb5

While I suppose it's possible to get a corrected copy from DMRs, it would be a very big gamble.

I bought my Diamond Edition at Walmart years ago, and thankfully it was a corrected copy.
However, I also later bought the DVD-case edition from the DMC for a family member which turned out to be faulty.

You didn't ask Disney for a replacement or a refund to return the faulty disc?

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Considering that some of the Disney folks in the old restoration featurette on the Snow White DVD literally say that the grain-reduced end product is like "looking at the original animation cel itself" then even they don't subscribe to your way of thinking, sadly - but then we knew that already about them!

Ollie Johnston saw the restoration of Snow White in 1993. "Nice colors." he said. "Not the colors we used in 1937, but nice colors." You can read between the lines there.

Anyway, always love Who Framed Roger Rabbit for about 100 reasons (seriously, what fan of American film doesn't love that movie?), but the whole "dip" wash of destroying the Toons was so inside-baseball (washing cell frames), that movie was hot joy on a stick when I was 18 as an animation buff.

The cels are terrific reference....but not if it escapes the context of how they were going to be photographed and presented and intended to be seen *on film*. The *film* is the end point. The production material is pencil shavings.

[Farerb]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Ollie Johnston saw the restoration of Snow White in 1993. "Nice colors." he said. "Not the colors we used in 1937, but nice colors." You can read between the lines there.

Anyway, always love Who Framed Roger Rabbit for about 100 reasons (seriously, what fan of American film doesn't love that movie?), but the whole "dip" wash of destroying the Toons was so inside-baseball, it was just hot joy on a stick when I was 18.

The cels are terrific reference....but not if it escapes the context of how they were going to be photographed and presented and intended to be seen *on film*. The *film* is the end point. The production material is pencil shavings.

However when Don Hahn or Gary Trousdale talk about the colors of Beauty and the Beast nobody believes them.

[gwfb5]

Originally Posted by IXOYE1989

You didn't ask Disney for a replacement or a refund to return the faulty disc?

I ordered it for one of my sisters around the time the Diamond Edition went out of print, so I doubt I could've gotten a replacement.
Also, even if my sister noticed any of the flaws, I highly doubt she would care.

One of my brothers also has a faulty copy of the Diamond Edition and he doesn't seem to care.

[gwfb5]

Originally Posted by farerb

However when Don Hahn or Gary Trousdale talk about the colors of Beauty and the Beast nobody believes them.

Believe them about what?

[Farerb]

Originally Posted by gwfb5

Believe them about what?

Don Hahn claimed that the 2D edition of Beauty and the Beast has the correct colors and that the film turned out to be darker than they expected on the 35mm. Gary Trousdale claimed that the 3D edition seems to have the accurate colors.

[Brian81]

If anyone has the corrected Diamond Edition BD/DVD and wants to sell...

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by farerb

However when Don Hahn or Gary Trousdale talk about the colors of Beauty and the Beast nobody believes them.

Take this with a grain of salt, because there are so many factors at play by the time an audience actually see a projected print (we're down to lamp temperatures and screen hues, folks, if you want to go down that rabbit hole), but...Beauty and the Beast on digital media doesn't resemble what I saw in Austin, TX in 1991. Maybe Gary and Don wanted it to look like it does today on home video, and all power to them if that's their wishes -- we're the audience, after all, not the artists -- but what's on Blu is definitely not what I saw in 1991. Ditto The Little Mermaid. It *really* doesn't look like it's presentation in 1989.

But I'm a hypocrite because I absolutely loved the 3D version of Mernaid, because it looks like the film was shot on the old multiplane camera ("glasses-free 3D in the late 30's" using planes of artwork with hand-painted animation layers changed manually frame by frame -- are you freaking kidding me...), and I would have soiled myself in 1989 if Mermaid came to cinemas looking like it does in 3D today, so...not going to die on an absolutionist hill.

[Farerb]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Take this with a grain of salt, because there are so many factors at play by the time an audience actually see a projected print (we're down to lamp temperatures and screen hues, folks, if you want to go down that rabbit hole), but...Beauty and the Beast on digital media doesn't resemble what I saw in Austin, TX in 1991. Maybe Gary and Don wanted it to look like it does today on home video, and all power to them if that's their wishes -- we're the audience, after all, not the artists -- but what's on Blu is definitely not what I saw in 1991.

I agree the film on blu ray looks very different than what it does on 35mm. We know this because Disney themselves provided a PIP of the 35mm scan of the Work-in-Progress edition. What they ment is probably how the film looked on the CAPS monitor. I believe Hahn when he said that the film looked darker than they expected because it is, sometimes you can barely see the backgrounds. I also believe Trousdale when he said that the 3D edition seems to have the accurate colors (to the CAPS files, not the 35mm), but it is the same question of what is more accurate - animation cels/CAPS files or the 35mm? and who decides this? To me it seems that this matter is really subjective, it's just a shame that Disney can't provide both versions of a film.

[dbear]

This admitteldy isn’t one of my favourites and I’m not well versed enough to know what colour Ariel’s tail is supposed to be. All I know is I somehow wound up with an under-the-counter Super 8mm “reduction” of a 35mm British singalong trailer and the colour timing on this print looks lovely projected (some terrible iPad shots here if anyone cares: https://imgur.com/gallery/xdjbMdw)

Would be nice to see what an original release print looks like projected but doubt I’d get a chance anytime soon. Not impressed with grain smoothing on the new downscaled Blu-ray vs. the Diamond im those caps...

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Take this with a grain of salt, because there are so many factors at play by the time an audience actually see a projected print (we're down to lamp temperatures and screen hues, folks, if you want to go down that rabbit hole), but...Beauty and the Beast on digital media doesn't resemble what I saw in Austin, TX in 1991. Maybe Gary and Don wanted it to look like it does today on home video, and all power to them if that's their wishes -- we're the audience, after all, not the artists -- but what's on Blu is definitely not what I saw in 1991.

Someone over the DVDizzy forums saw an original 70mm release print as part of a 25th Anniversary retrospective screening a while back. The fellow claimed the only official home video release that looked remotely close to what he saw was the very dark looking completed sections on the Work-in-Progress picture-in-picture stream on the Diamond Edition blu-ray. I don’t think we’ll ever see anything remotely close to what audiences saw in 1991 on an official release...

[KubrickKurasawa]

Originally Posted by Hardback247

The many negative reactions here are puzzling, considering how positive the Blu-Ray.com review is.

Well if you buy a cheap 4k tv the HDR and light behind the screen sucks.

[KubrickKurasawa]

Originally Posted by dbear

This admitteldy isn’t one of my favourites and I’m not well versed enough to know what colour Ariel’s tail is supposed to be. All I know is I somehow wound up with an under-the-counter Super 8mm “reduction” of a 35mm British singalong trailer and the colour timing on this print looks lovely projected (some terrible iPad shots here if anyone cares: https://imgur.com/gallery/xdjbMdw)

Would be nice to see what an original release print looks like projected but doubt I’d get a chance anytime soon. Not impressed with grain smoothing on the new downscaled Blu-ray vs. the Diamond im those caps...



Someone over the DVDizzy forums saw an original 70mm release print as part of a 25th Anniversary retrospective screening a while back. The fellow claimed the only official home video release that looked remotely close to what he saw was the very dark looking completed sections on the Work-in-Progress picture-in-picture stream on the Diamond Edition blu-ray. I don’t think we’ll ever see anything remotely close to what audiences saw in 1991 on an official release...

The Little Mermaid is an 80's movie. Nice bait do you always bait people with mis information? I saw it on release and it's a low quality animated film by source.

[Chernobog]

Originally Posted by farerb

I agree the film on blu ray looks very different than what it does on 35mm. We know this because Disney themselves provided a PIP of the 35mm scan of the Work-in-Progress edition. What they ment is probably how the film looked on the CAPS monitor. I believe Hahn when he said that the film looked darker than they expected because it is, sometimes you can barely see the backgrounds. I also believe Trousdale when he said that the 3D edition seems to have the accurate colors (to the CAPS files, not the 35mm), but it is the same question of what is more accurate - animation cels/CAPS files or the 35mm? and who decides this? To me it seems that this matter is really subjective, it's just a shame that Disney can't provide both versions of a film.

Totally agree, once the Disney movies started to be done with CAPS there two "original" and valid versions: the original digital CAPS files and the 35mm print. Yes, it would be great to have both versions available in home media releases.

[bradnoyes]

Bearing in mind that the only prior time I've ever seen this movie was on VHS back when Mikhail Gorbachev was still in power, I thought this looked great. I'm not sure how accurate the colors are but what's here is very vibrant and nuanced. And I'm not familiar with the grain field from the older releases but it is very fine here indeed, so it makes sense that there's been some management. But based solely on how this looks to my unconditioned eyes, this looks lovely. And the audio is superb. One of the better Atmos mixes from Disney with a dense soundfield and some very crisp and deep bass.

I just wasn't into Disney animation back in the 80's and 90's so I don't have the same familiarity as a lot of folks do with these releases. Maybe that's to my benefit, since I'm really happy with this.

[y2jman]

correct me if i'm wrong the 4k and the signature bluray both are fixed version that diamond edtion bluray didn't and had to get a recall

I kindof sold the correct bluray diamond edtion this afternoon game exchange and wondering if I made a mistake need to get it back or not

[WBMakeVMarsMovieNOW]

Originally Posted by jh901

Disney must be concerned with complaints from the ill informed. Surely they sell much greater volume to the masses than a typical live action release from Sony or Paramount, etc.

For whatever reason, I'm not as bothered by shortcomings with animated film transfers as I am with live action. That said, it's a shame that the "pro review" on this site isn't critical. It would also be cool if we could track down a contact at Disney who would hear out concerns.

yeah, I was just thinking today, that if there is ONE type of film I could sort of handle DNR, it would be a particular type of CEL animation which was basically pure solid colors and not textured paint looking, in some ways I suppose you might argue this is closer to what it would look like viewing the original CELs flipping in front of you

DNR still tends to rob stuff though and I've seen screen caps before where their DNR even went so far as erase solid black lines and other key details so hopefully this one has none of that at all and as little of the more minor stuff as possible


anyway, I suppose for this, it's maybe the one time it is maybe not an utter disaster to go the DNR route, but I don't know....

[cynatnite]

This is one of the UHD's I chose not to upgrade. I already have the Diamond Edition anyway. It's not a favorite Disney film of mine at all. Reading the comments from those I trust regarding PQ says it was the right decision for me.

[bytor]

Originally Posted by bradnoyes

Bearing in mind that the only prior time I've ever seen this movie was on VHS back when Mikhail Gorbachev was still in power, I thought this looked great. I'm not sure how accurate the colors are but what's here is very vibrant and nuanced. And I'm not familiar with the grain field from the older releases but it is very fine here indeed, so it makes sense that there's been some management. But based solely on how this looks to my unconditioned eyes, this looks lovely. And the audio is superb. One of the better Atmos mixes from Disney with a dense soundfield and some very crisp and deep bass.

I'm in the same boat and have only seen the VHS back in the early 90's. I overall really love the look of this UHD too. There are plenty of shots that look 4k, but then a lot of shots that are less defined/out of focus looking. I don't think it's because of DNR, it seems like that's just how they will look regardless.