Silent Hill 2 remake (TBA)

[The Apocalypse]

There are unannounced SH games in development in-house apparently, according to a few reports, so we'll see how those go.

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by The Apocalypse

There are unannounced SH games in development in-house apparently, according to a few reports, so we'll see how those go.

Thanks. That's good.

It's strange Konami is suddenly licensing/making so many Silent Hill games after a major drought since Silent Hill Downpour on PS3... Maybe all the hype they received over the "Abandoned fake Silent Hill game controversy" a couple years ago actually inspired Konami and showed them how many Silent Hill fans want a new SH game. I bet that could've had something to do with it. If true, the abandoned indie "game" Abandoned did do something good in an indirect sense.

[emailking]

Originally Posted by Weskerredfield3

Very Lost, the SH Movies change the story significantly compared to the Games they adapted. To be Fair, i thought the first movie was pretty good despite it's flaws but the 2nd movie was GARBAGE.

Please Play the games if you can, SH 1-3 Specifically. But you can play SH2 Without having played the Other games, it's a standalone story that doesn't tie into 1 or 3

I don't follow. If I can play SH2 without having played the other games then why would I be lost?

[Zivouhr]

The main theme of Silent Hill is an evil force corrupts Silent Hill generated from the hatred or pain of Alyssa (as well as evil forces/books), which is a town that enters a demonic realm of fog and rust, and people are turned into monsters or attacked by them. Then there are complex puzzles to solve to complete the story, when not fighting very difficult monsters and bosses, if the clunky tank turning controls aren't increasing the tension of trying to survive. The horror music of the series is a big part of it too with the sound effects and visuals.

Downpour I thought was very good despite some very difficult map puzzles. The controls were responsive. The cart level was really cool and a change of pace.

[Azyiu]

Originally Posted by Zivouhr

The main theme of Silent Hill is an evil force corrupts Silent Hill generated from the hatred or pain of Alyssa (as well as evil forces/books), which is a town that enters a demonic realm of fog and rust, and people are turned into monsters or attacked by them. Then there are complex puzzles to solve to complete the story, when not fighting very difficult monsters and bosses, if the clunky tank turning controls aren't increasing the tension of trying to survive. The horror music of the series is a big part of it too with the sound effects and visuals.

Downpour I thought was very good despite some very difficult map puzzles. The controls were responsive. The cart level was really cool and a change of pace.

I love the sounds, feels and melodies by Akira Yamaoka in the series, especially in the first 3 games. The songs in the 4th game The Room are mostly great, but the music ain't quite there like the earlier ones. Certain songs in the first 2 instalments still give me chills.

[NARMAK]

I feel like the clunky tank controls are a product of their time and as such, for a modern remake they would need to update the formula a bit like say Resident Evil did. However, Silent Hill is definitely an IP with its own unique spin on the horror genre and a proper update hopefully would sell just as Capcom achieved with Resident Evil 2 and 3.

The problem is Konami can't be trusted as much as say Capcom to get it over the line. I would like it if they could. Also, i didn't really play the games but rather saw trailers/gameplay and then the movie. I feel like it's always been an isolated playthrough. Maybe this time more NPCs that are surviving can appear.

[emailking]

Sounds like I can play this game ok having only seen the movies.

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I feel like the clunky tank controls are a product of their time and as such, for a modern remake they would need to update the formula a bit like say Resident Evil did. However, Silent Hill is definitely an IP with its own unique spin on the horror genre and a proper update hopefully would sell just as Capcom achieved with Resident Evil 2 and 3.

The problem is Konami can't be trusted as much as say Capcom to get it over the line. I would like it if they could. Also, i didn't really play the games but rather saw trailers/gameplay and then the movie. I feel like it's always been an isolated playthrough. Maybe this time more NPCs that are surviving can appear.

Thankfully Konami outsourced this to other developers as the only hope.
Konami now focused on gambling machines for most of their income apparently. Seeing their logo in the past on the old 16 bit and 8 bit era games meant a quality game. Those days are gone for their in-house studio, back when they dumped Kojima with MGSV. Kojima took way too long on the project, probably milking it instead of going with a strict deadline. I can understand it, but something went wrong there. I'd have to look into it more these days.

Originally Posted by emailking

Sounds like I can play this game ok having only seen the movies.

Yes, the game is mysterious right from the start, and has the player discover as they go with each game. No need to see the movies or play any of the games. They'll get players figuring it out no problem I bet.

[Zivouhr]

SILENT HILL 2 - Combat Reveal Trailer (4K:EN/PEGI) | KONAMI - YouTube

January 2024 Sony Show Case State of the Times Event. At the end, it says "Wishlist", but gives no release date. I'm pretty sure they're waiting to release it in time for the 2025 Silent Hill Returns feature film movie.

Looks good, but the trailer rock music takes away some of the horror and makes it seem more like an action film.

[joshsquash729]

I think it looks pretty good. Seems to be taking a page from recent Resident Evil games, at least in terms of look/combat, which I don't know how I feel. Combat was never really a big part of the original- it was even possible to do more or less a pacifist run of it- so it seems odd that they're focusing so heavy on it. Guess it doesn't mean the choice isn't still there.

The monsters look pretty good though. Appropriately icky, and seemingly more fluid, whereas they were rather jittery before, which I liked- think it added to the creepiness. But I'm not gonna judge too heavily off a few quick shots. I'm interested to know more about why some of the monsters seem to have little bits on them- almost look like big teeth or mushrooms or something- if it indicates a stronger version of the enemy, or if it's just cosmetic to add a little flair. You see it on a couple Nurses, and one of the Patient Demons.

I remain cautiously optimistic. It looks pretty good.

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by joshsquash729

I think it looks pretty good. Seems to be taking a page from recent Resident Evil games, at least in terms of look/combat, which I don't know how I feel. Combat was never really a big part of the original- it was even possible to do more or less a pacifist run of it- so it seems odd that they're focusing so heavy on it. Guess it doesn't mean the choice isn't still there.

The monsters look pretty good though. Appropriately icky, and seemingly more fluid, whereas they were rather jittery before, which I liked- think it added to the creepiness. But I'm not gonna judge too heavily off a few quick shots. I'm interested to know more about why some of the monsters seem to have little bits on them- almost look like big teeth or mushrooms or something- if it indicates a stronger version of the enemy, or if it's just cosmetic to add a little flair. You see it on a couple Nurses, and one of the Patient Demons.

I remain cautiously optimistic. It looks pretty good.

Yes, good points. I hope they expand the town a little bit. Then again, the game works where certain sections have to be unlocked with puzzle solving, so that's the formula to the Silent Hill games.

One of the reasons the first games were scary is because they make the hero weak and barely able to defeat many of the enemies. But thankfully not to the extreme of Silent Hill Homecoming. That game's enemies were brutally difficult to defeat and I never made it through after a bad glitch that broke the game on PS3.

[emailking]

I still have this pre-ordered. I wonder when it will come.

[BladeRunner2007]

This looks like a fan remake at best. Yikes. I've seen 10$ steam games that look better.

[Modren]

I just don't think Bloober Team has the storytelling or combat design chops to make this work. Their games completely lack subtlety and grace when it comes to the topics SH2 deals with (particularly their handling of mental illness), and they've never done a game with combat before. And you can really tell from that trailer.

Fortunately, the fans have already given SH2 an excellent remaster for PC that goes above and beyond anything Konami would've done with it. Save your money and go play this instead.
https://enhanced.townofsilenthill.com/SH2/

[Zivouhr]

Bloober Team developers have their work cut out for them already, they just have to piece it together since the story and game design is already created. Should be a reasonably good remake of Silent Hill 2 I think.

Silent Hill 2 (2001) - PC (Fan Remaster) vs. Xbox Series X (HD Collection) Side by Side - YouTube

For that SH2 remaster by fans, it looks nice with sharper textures and fog effects.
I need to remind myself that this game won't be about great scenery, since most of it is covered in fog or darkness until you're right on top of it.

[Glorian]

Originally Posted by Modren

I just don't think Bloober Team has the storytelling or combat design chops to make this work. Their games completely lack subtlety and grace when it comes to the topics SH2 deals with (particularly their handling of mental illness), and they've never done a game with combat before. And you can really tell from that trailer.

Fortunately, the fans have already given SH2 an excellent remaster for PC that goes above and beyond anything Konami would've done with it. Save your money and go play this instead.
https://enhanced.townofsilenthill.com/SH2/

Their lack of experience with combat is a valid concern, but the storytelling has already been done for them. So that shouldn't be an issue unless they're stupid enough to change the story around, which for a game like this, would cause massive blowback. Hopefully they're not that stupid; "wonky combat but the same story and improved graphics" might still do okay, but "altered, worse version of the story" might be bad enough to hurt their sales, and they'd deserve it.

[Modren]

Originally Posted by Glorian

Their lack of experience with combat is a valid concern, but the storytelling has already been done for them. So that shouldn't be an issue unless they're stupid enough to change the story around, which for a game like this, would cause massive blowback.

I think they might be stupid enough to try that, yeah. At the very least I don't expect their cutscene and voice direction to stack up to the original, and that they'll try to "update" the script in some way. And after The Medium ended with the conclusion that

[Show spoiler]the only way to "help" rape survivors with PTSD is to kill them

, I have zero confidence that they'll handle Angela's character well.

[jimidini]

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I feel like the clunky tank controls are a product of their time

In Silent Hill games made by Team Silent as well as Resident Evil games as well as Tomb Raider games - all these games had camera changes built in and when you do these, you simply need to use "tank" controls.There is no other way.

Let's say you do a pre-rendered backgrounds game like Resident Evil.
The player moves forwards from a door, towards the camera, so player presses up on the stick. You switch to a different view, which now shows the back of the character.

Now what happens with "tank" controls, the game goes on, the character keeps on moving into that direction, because nothing changed. You tell the game to move forward, relative to the character.
With "modern" controls, you would instantly turn around and back to the original position, because it's relative to the camera and the position of the camera changed.

Resident Evil 4 had "tank" controls too and it was all intentional and well made and well designed and it played incredibly well.
Just like the Core Tomb Raider games too.
The Core Tomb Raider games had controls that were PRECISE, something these so called "modern" controls aren't, because the game somewhat plays itself. Compare Tomb Raider 2013 with Core Tomb Raiders. In the former you are not really in control. You jump, the jump is magnetic and helps you out. In Core Tomb Raider it's the opposite. If you fail a jump, that's on you. If you succeed, that's also on you. and the levels were designed around the grid based system.

[NARMAK]

Originally Posted by jimidini

In Silent Hill games made by Team Silent as well as Resident Evil games as well as Tomb Raider games - all these games had camera changes built in and when you do these, you simply need to use "tank" controls.There is no other way.

Let's say you do a pre-rendered backgrounds game like Resident Evil.
The player moves forwards from a door, towards the camera, so player presses up on the stick. You switch to a different view, which now shows the back of the character.

Now what happens with "tank" controls, the game goes on, the character keeps on moving into that direction, because nothing changed. You tell the game to move forward, relative to the character.
With "modern" controls, you would instantly turn around and back to the original position, because it's relative to the camera and the position of the camera changed.

Resident Evil 4 had "tank" controls too and it was all intentional and well made and well designed and it played incredibly well.
Just like the Core Tomb Raider games too.
The Core Tomb Raider games had controls that were PRECISE, something these so called "modern" controls aren't, because the game somewhat plays itself. Compare Tomb Raider 2013 with Core Tomb Raiders. In the former you are not really in control. You jump, the jump is magnetic and helps you out. In Core Tomb Raider it's the opposite. If you fail a jump, that's on you. If you succeed, that's also on you. and the levels were designed around the grid based system.

Thanks for the breakdown but for me, i stand by feeling Tank Controls were specifically there due to the hardware limitations. They offered the best balance of using those pre-rendered backgrounds to look much higher quality than they were and also served as a way to ratchet up tension by hiding zombies and so on around a corner or just out of sight to create a more heightened horror element to the games.

Nowadays, we can see how Resident Evil from RE5 onwards adapted to more modern standards and controls to still deliver a really effective horror atmosphere the IPs are known for.

Personally i feel like it's nice to see how we have had an evolution in game design over time and the ingenuity with which creators have worked to overcome past limitations to deliver their vision. Dare i say, modern day games have fewer limitations and the biggest issue now is actual creativity within the industry. All sorts of "samey" games vying for big budget AAA launches and sales, or free to play MTX models to cash in at times. Albeit we fo still have some variety, there's still very much similar feels to most games.

The parts i did see in the State of Play for Silent Hill looked like the devs know what they're doing to capture the IPs specific atmosphere and design whilst updating it to a modern control look/feel.

[Zivouhr]

The different still camera angles per scene were a great reason for tank controls, that is a very good point.

Once things went to free roam 3D space however, I agree tank controls for moving a character around were no longer necessary. Tomb Raider 1 was still struggling to break out of the tank control era, as was Silent Hill 1 and 2.

What does work though, is those clunky tank controls and clunky, poor combat in Silent Hill 1 made the game that much more tense and alarming. Half the time, the player is struggling to figure out the controls or waiting for them to respond to run out of there by time he turns around, while the monsters were nearly there. Definitely true that clunky controls in a horror game increase tension.

I wouldn't mind an option for tank controls to see the difference in this remake, but I will prefer modern 3rd person controls primarily.

One thing I'm not a fan of, tank controls for overhead racing car games. Like Atari's Sprint, or those driving games. I would prefer being able to just point to where I want the car to go, much easier.