Caligula 4K UHD (1979/2023) [Unobstructed View Exclusive]

[gates70]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

Imagine thinking Army of Darkness is "so bad it's good."

Nobody cares that you dislike Caligula. A lot of people do. It's more your snooty "these films are beneath me and anybody who thinks they have artistic merit are kidding themselves" attitude which is grating.

You're beneath me, so stop looking at my posts!

[Gacivory]

Originally Posted by gates70

You're beneath me, so stop looking at my posts!

I never expected Dally to be a top.

[gates70]

Originally Posted by Gacivory

I never expected Dally to be a top.

I lol'd for real

[Grethiwha]

Originally Posted by IdeaOfEvil

So, uh... this is a movie worth watching, then? lol

lol. Everybody is arguing about the artistic merits of the 1979 Caligula. It is quite an infamous film obviously that was widely panned at the time of its release and disowned by many involved in the production, though it has its fans and could be considered something of a "cult classic".

I believe that the 2023 Ultimate Cut doesn't contain a single shot that was in the 1979 version. It's an extremely ambitious reconstruction. A snippet from the wikipedia page:

"Producer Thomas Negovan announced a different reconstruction of the film in 2020, seeking to more closely follow Gore Vidal's original screenplay (rather than the visions of either Brass or Guccione)[...] McDowell responded positively to this version, writing on Instagram: "Because of the brilliant work of Thomas Negovan – one of my best performances has finally come to light after 47 years!"

I haven't seen any version of Caligula but I am extremely intrigued by the Ultimate Cut, enough to probably give this version a blind-buy.

Few have actually seen the Ultimate Cut yet, not many can really opine if it's "worth watching". What seems to be clear is that it's a completely different film, so peoples' opinions of the 1979 film are neither here nor there!

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by Grethiwha

Hardly anyone has actually seen the Ultimate Cut yet, probably no-one in this thread...

I've seen it, lol.

[Grethiwha]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

I've seen it, lol.

lol. Cool. What'dja think?

It's only played at Cannes, right?

[sfmarine]

[oddbox83]

Originally Posted by Grethiwha

lol. Cool. What'dja think?

It's only played at Cannes, right?

It's out already on Spanish BD.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by Grethiwha

lol. Cool. What'dja think?

It's only played at Cannes, right?

I won't bore everyone with my thoughts but if you're interested, I posted my review in the thread that's in the movies sub-forum.

It's had other screenings since its Cannes premiere, but it also had a Spanish Blu-ray release in January.

[avmdeluca]

I've seen all versions, including The Ultimate Cut. The movie is a 70s extravaganza with great performances, amazing production design and a mischievous sense of humor. It's not a good movie per se, especially for its paper-thin plot stretched to 180 minutes, let's say it's an artsy exploitation blockbuster.

The Ultimate Cut is probably the most acceptable version, be aware though a couple of scenes are vastly inferior to what was available before: not because there's something missing or whatever, it's the editing that is quite clunkier in a couple of spots. It's very far from perfect, but a much better way to understand what they were going for.

I hope one of the three cuts included in whatever edition will feature the scene that was cut in this 2023 edit, as it looks quite stunning from what we've seen.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by avmdeluca

I hope one of the three cuts included in whatever edition will feature the scene that was cut in this 2023 edit, as it looks quite stunning from what we've seen.

Which scene's that?

[GaragePoet]

anyone who says that porn ain't art is disqualified from the conversation

[avmdeluca]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

Which scene's that?

The sacrifice to the gods/coin collecting scene, which should come just before the imperial brothel.
A very crude edit was included in the extras of a DVD boxset, in this 2023 cut there's a few shots rapid shots which were never seen before and look gorgeous.

Oh that and the pyramid of power scene. I get that it's too on the nose for modern tastes, but it's not supposed to be made for modern tastes.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by avmdeluca

The sacrifice to the gods/coin collecting scene, which should come just before the imperial brothel.
A very crude edit was included in the extras of a DVD boxset, in this 2023 cut there's a few shots rapid shots which were never seen before and look gorgeous.

Oh that and the pyramid of power scene. I get that it's too on the nose for modern tastes, but it's not supposed to be made for modern tastes.

I spoke to Thomas Negovan about the temple scene and he said there wasn't enough coverage and that the shot of the hammer hitting the priest didn't look convincing. Says it's much better in stills than in motion.

As for the pyramid scene, yeah, I was said to see it go. The initial version of The Ultimate Cut was closer to four hours and they were determined to get it under three, so I guess a few eggs had to be broken.

[nekromantik]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

I spoke to Thomas Negovan about the temple scene and he said there wasn't enough coverage and that the shot of the hammer hitting the priest didn't look convincing. Says it's much better in stills than in motion.

As for the pyramid scene, yeah, I was said to see it go. The initial version of The Ultimate Cut was closer to four hours and they were determined to get it under three, so I guess a few eggs had to be broken.

I hope the scenes cut from the 4 hour cut are included as deleted scenes.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by nekromantik

I hope the scenes cut from the 4 hour cut are included as deleted scenes.

Same. I want to see E V E R Y T H I N G.

[avmdeluca]

Originally Posted by nekromantik

I hope the scenes cut from the 4 hour cut are included as deleted scenes.

Or better yet, a comprehensive cut. We are in an era of expensive multi-disc editions, we'll never see this footage again if it won't happen now.

[russweiss1]

Originally Posted by Grethiwha

Hardly anyone has actually seen the Ultimate Cut yet, probably no-one in this thread, so no-one here can really opine if it's "worth watching". What seems to be clear is that it's a completely different film, so peoples' opinions of the 1979 film are neither here nor there!

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

I've seen it, lol.

I've seen it as well. I purchased the Spanish release from Amazon Spain.

I've never been a big fan of the film but it will always have a place in my memory as the only film I ever walked out of a theater without watching the whole film. The girl I went with saw about 1/2 an hour and said she couldn't watch anymore.

I don't consider this to be a completely different film. Most of the ultimate cut is just alternate takes. Some things were removed

[Show spoiler](John Gielgud's death was less complete)

such as the porn but I didn't notice a lot of "new" material. At the end of the day it's a 5/10 film for me.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by russweiss1

I don't consider this to be a completely different film. Most of the ultimate cut is just alternate takes. Some things were removed

[Show spoiler](John Gielgud's death was less complete)

such as the porn but I didn't notice a lot of "new" material. At the end of the day it's a 5/10 film for me.

Most of the new scenes are in the third act. Caligula and Caesonia's argument where she questions why he can't be happy with what he's got, Caligula making a consul of Incitatus, Caligula replacing the heads of the statues and showcasing his new march to Longinus, his breakdown in the Temple of Jupiter, the "Caesar says" routine... none of that's in the theatrical version.

[russweiss1]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

Most of the new scenes are in the third act. Caligula and Caesonia's argument where she questions why he can't be happy with what he's got, Caligula making a consul of Incitatus, Caligula replacing the heads of the statues and showcasing his new march to Longinus, his breakdown in the Temple of Jupiter, the "Caesar says" routine... none of that's in the theatrical version.

I know there are some differences. It has been a few decades since I watched the film and when I watched the ultimate cut most of it was very familiar. That was my main reasoning behind saying it's not a different film.