Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[The_Donster]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Come off it, we could all cherry pick a few words and then claim some insult or back up to a insult.

You guys know I wouldn’t intentionally do that, ever.

But isn’t that what you are doing? You seem to justify your actions based on how you’ve perceived others have treated you in this thread in the past.

[avs commenter]

I think the bottom line is, IF you deeply care about a particular movie, buy it on disc. If just a casual fan of a movie, there is no harm going digital and saving a few bucks.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

This is a purposely extreme, exaggerated comparison, but on some level this thought process of justification is almost like saying, "Well, he did rape me, but that's okay because I was probably going to sleep with him anyway!"

Some stranger might have had a couple movies removed from an online account and we're talking about it in terms of home invasion and now rape?

Okay

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

This is a purposely extreme, exaggerated comparison, but on some level this thought process of justification is almost like saying, "Well, he did rape me, but that's okay because I was probably going to sleep with him anyway!"

Pretty sure I'd have a problem with a random man sticking his dick in my vagina more than I would a digital copy disappearing that I can buy again. A digital item that I knew from the outset could disappear at some future time. Not well, he's nice maybe on the third date I'll bang him...but nah, surprise date rape.

Come on, dude.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

The point is that in order for someone to take something physical from you that you keep in your home, they have to enter your home to do so. In the digital realm, it can be done remotely. But in both scenarios, something has been taken from your that you purchased. Justifying one form of it just because it can be done from afar and doesn't require them to enter your property is ridiculous.

No, the comparisons are ridiculous. Home invasion and rape are not consensual. Clicking an EULA is.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Let's suppose that a movie is removed, but is available through another service for 5 bucks. You apparently say "okay, no big deal." But if someone were to hack your bank account and take any amount of money (be is $5 or $5,000), somehow I doubt you'd be nearly as flippant about it.

Again, no. Hacking is not consensual.

A more apt comparison would be, I don't know, my bank charging me for an online bill payment that was previously free. I might be surprised to see the charge. I might be annoyed that they're whacking me for something that used to be free. I might even consider changing banks.

What I wouldn't do is whinge about being violated because, well, that would be dumb.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Hence is being an exaggerated, extreme comparison. Did you miss that part of the statement?

Some people around here really need to work on their reading comprehension.

The statement you made about it being extreme but on some level the same?

Yeah, I read it.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

And missed the point. Congrats.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

A new release is typically $3-5 cheaper on digital.

If you buy 20 movies a year, you are potentially saving $100. So you can easily buy back some of those movies again if you want to. Or just be $100 richer.

And if you are willing to buy used those movies can go for 50 cents to a dollar (at least thats the rate i hear digital people saying they sold their collections for ) so you could potentially be saving 3 or 4 hundred dollars.

It really comes down to will power if you can wait and not buy stuff on day one physical media tends to have sales or you can buy used which makes it as cheap or cheaper then digital media while also giving you ownership.

That's the thing about the used market its either great for the buyers market or the sellers market either way somebody is getting a good deal possibly even both.


Anyway I would be curious to compare any digital buyers collection to my own and what they spend on average per year compared to mine. With physical media my collection normally grows by about 80 to 100 titles per year and my spending is around break even to negative.

[Groot]

I resell my digital movies for bananas and apricot seeds. It’s like bitcoin but bananas.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

I personally I think they should be called EULUs.... End User License Ultimatums. Or even more accurately, it's legalized black mail. Yes, people click on them. But in order to buy the digital good, there is no other option. It's anti-consumer IMO.

If you want access to somebody else's stuff you have to meet their terms. There are various limits but by and large that's how marketplaces work and (again, by and large) it works well.

If somebody who owns a song or a game or a movie wants to give you virtually unrestricted use of that song or game or movie that's their call. And if they want to put restrictions on your access to their song or game or movie that's their call too.

And for your part you get to decide if their terms are acceptable or not.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

And even if it is by way of said agreement, I still see it as simply wrong for purchased content to be taken away.

So you don't care if people agree to these terms, it's still a violation akin to home invasion or hacking or rape.

Yeah, I don't see it that way.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

It's really ridiculous for those things to even be legally enforceable (taking away content with no recourse for the consumer). With all of the different digital related services, etc. that are out there and a part of our day to day lives that we sign up for, get updated versions of, etc. , there are these constant long-ass "contracts" that the average person does not reasonably have the time to fully read, but otherwise has to agree to in order to navigate the world today.

tldr as a legal defense? Well, if nothing else that's...novel

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Those agreements are a huge amount of BS.

And defending them is the height of stupidity.

I'm defending the right of suppliers to put pretty much whatever terms they want on the stuff they own. I think that's a Good Thing. It doesn't always cut my way but as a general principle I'm in favor of letting people dispose of their own property as they see fit.

I'm old-fashioned that way.

If I don't like their terms I don't have to accept them.

And if that means I don't get to play their game or watch their movie or listen to their song then so be it.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Groot

I resell my digital movies for bananas and apricot seeds. It’s like bitcoin but bananas.

Most people sell them for peanuts.

hahahaaaaaaaahahahahahaha, ah geez, I kill me


ooooooohboy

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by octagon

Most people sell them for peanuts.

hahahaaaaaaaahahahahahaha, ah geez, I kill me


ooooooohboy

And you can split the difference.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You could. Or you could give a shit about your HT and buy 4K and Blu-ray Disc.

Which you talk about more than you actually do

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

Which you talk about more than you actually do

Slow build, it’s how I play it. All good things.......

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by avs commenter

A new release is typically $3-5 cheaper on digital.

Went to the UHD Software section, started left to right in the banner and selected the first 6 titles. Compared the price of the disc from Amazon, digital from Amazon and VUDU. Only one title (Hotel Transylvania 3) has a higher price on disc and that is a pre-order price.

Title                 BD        Amazon     VUDU
Jack Ryan 5 4K        $47.19    $47.19     $59.99
The Big Lebowski     $14.72     $13.99     $14.99
Labyrinth             $7.75      $13.99     $13.99
Hotel Transylvania 3 $22.96    $18.99      $19.99
Predator 4K            $19.99    N/A          N/A
Hereditary 4K         $24.96    $24.96      N/A

Sorry for the alignment, this site will not let me post tables.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Slow build, it’s how I play it. All good things.......

How does someone order a batch of 50 movies that they won't get until next year?

I do not understand that at all. Does not compute.

[avs commenter]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Went to the UHD Software section, started left to right in the banner and selected the first 6 titles. Compared the price of the disc from Amazon, digital from Amazon and VUDU. Only one title (Hotel Transylvania 3) has a higher price on disc and that is a pre-order price.

Title                 BD        Amazon     VUDU
Jack Ryan 5 4K        $47.19    $47.19     $59.99
The Big Lebowski     $14.72     $13.99     $14.99
Labyrinth             $7.75      $13.99     $13.99
Hotel Transylvania 3 $22.96    $18.99      $19.99
Predator 4K            $19.99    N/A          N/A
Hereditary 4K         $24.96    $24.96      N/A

Sorry for the alignment, this site will not let me post tables.

And only HT3 is a new release. Rest are catalog titles. My point stands for NEW films

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Went to the UHD Software section, started left to right in the banner and selected the first 6 titles. Compared the price of the disc from Amazon, digital from Amazon and VUDU. Only one title (Hotel Transylvania 3) has a higher price on disc and that is a pre-order price.

Title                 BD        Amazon     VUDU
Jack Ryan 5 4K        $47.19    $47.19     $59.99
The Big Lebowski     $14.72     $13.99     $14.99
Labyrinth             $7.75      $13.99     $13.99
Hotel Transylvania 3 $22.96    $18.99      $19.99
Predator 4K            $19.99    N/A          N/A
Hereditary 4K         $24.96    $24.96      N/A

Sorry for the alignment, this site will not let me post tables.

Try posting some Warner films. Especially right after they release on 4K disc.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

How does someone order a batch of 50 movies that they won't get until next year?

I do not understand that at all. Does not compute.

Ok, I have around 15 films left to watch this year, ok so far?

That will take me to Christmas more or less.

In the meantime, my new batch will arrive. I will put them all in my cabinet still wrapped until I watch them.

Next, I will watch 7 films in 7 days over Christmas (week off work) and then watch 1 film every movie night for the next 52 weeks. I love the idea of watching films blind.

I also have a few catalogue titles to watch at random times next year.

[Vilya]

I object to the EULAs governing digital video purchases, thus I have not agreed to any. As much as I dislike them, other people are free to agree to them if they so choose. If they agree to them blindly, the responsibility for their decision is still entirely their own.

Analogies can be quite useful, even humorous, when debating a subject. However, personally, I would not use being raped as an analogy in any situation.

Rape is a traumatic and violent crime and using it in an analogy trivializes it. Anyone who has been a victim of rape, or knows such a victim, is all but guaranteed to take offense. There are far better ways to make an argument than to invoke thoughts, possibly memories, of such a horrific criminal act.

Beyond that, it is not even an apt analogy as no one would ever be okay with being raped. Rape is not comparable whatsoever to consensual sex. Having a couple of $15 movies deleted from an account is in no way similar to being the victim of a violent sexual assault. To say that the former is inconsequential compared to the latter would be a gross understatement.

I am not saying anyone here condones rape or considers it to be trivial, but using it as an analogy is, in my opinion at least, in very poor taste. Such an analogy has great potential to offend and has almost no chance of convincing anyone of anything.