Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I've always said it's all Digital, that 1:1 is coming for Streaming Video. I have done it with DVD and Blu-ray, Kaleidescape has done it with 4K so it's not impossible. If you have the Bandwidth and are set up properly. I don't experience the Buffering or Degradation with Bitrates in the 16Mbps range. So Streaming is only going to get better, and it will catch up to Disc very soon!

I don’t see the evidence it is getting better.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Ok, let’s go over this one final time. Quality doesn’t come into it. It’s IDENTICAL in A/V quality. Secondly, you can’t buy 60% of the store’s VR games on disc. FACT.

Fine. Then the other 40% should always be bought on disc when the option exists. If not, then that is hypocrisy on your part.

Your ‘across the board’ argument is silly. I buy groceries digitally, I advertised my previous home digitally, I write up reports digitally, I order Pizza digitally, I buy some Christmas presents digitally etc..

Some of those will be forced in years to come.

Your argument is flawed, face it.

Your comparisons here are extremely flawed. You aren't buying "digital" groceries. You are buying physical groceries by placing an order online. That is completely different than buying a product that is inherently digital. Come on, you are better than this ridiculous argument.

You may as well be arguing that there is no difference between purchasing a movie download or ordering a disc from Amazon, since in both cases the transaction was made digitally. And we know you aren't on board with that thought process.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Fine. Then the other 40% should always be bought on disc when the option exists. If not, then that is hypocrisy on your part.



Your comparisons here are extremely flawed. You aren't buying "digital" groceries. You are buying physical groceries by placing on order online. That is completely different than buying a product that is inherently digital. Come on, you are better than this ridiculous argument.

You may as well be arguing that there is no difference between purchasing a movie download or ordering a disc from Amazon, since in both cases the transaction was made digitally. And we know you aren't on board with that through process.

Yeah, that would work IF those titles were the ones I want. Kind of a problem if not.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yeah, that would work IF those titles were the ones I want. Kind of a problem if not.

Then that's one thing. I'm not saying that you have to buy games that you simply don't want.

In past posts on this topic, you've made it sound like there are at least some VR games that you have bought digitally that do have physical copies available due to convenience and not having to take off your headset to swap out discs.

If I am mistaken on that, and the only games that you buy digitally are those that are only available digitally, then I digress. But you didn't make it sound like that in past posts, if that is in fact the case.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Then that's one thing. I'm not saying that you have to buy games that you simply don't want.

In past posts on this topic, you've made it sound like there are at least some VR games that you have bought digitally that do have physical copies available due to convenience and not having to take off your headset to swap out discs.

If I am mistaken on that, and the only games that you buy digitally are those that are only available digitally, then I digress. But you didn't make it sound like that in past posts, if that is in fact the case.

Often games are released later than the digital store version. However, there is no way of knowing that at the time. It all depends on successful sales obviously. I bought two games on disc when I first got it. It’s just not practical to keep taking the headset off especially with more demanding games where you are moving about a lot. You have to be really careful with dizziness and nausea. Multiply that by the 20 VR games I buy each year and it would get ridiculous.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I've always said it's all Digital, that 1:1 is coming for Streaming Video. I have done it with DVD and Blu-ray, Kaleidescape has done it with 4K so it's not impossible. If you have the Bandwidth and are set up properly. I don't experience the Buffering or Degradation with Bitrates in the 16Mbps range. So Streaming is only going to get better, and it will catch up to Disc very soon!

Because it needs to! While streaming likely will improve someday, so, too, will physical media. Discs have always led the way in quality while streaming always lags behind.

There is no evidence that streaming is improving. Bitrates with streaming have been frozen for over 3 years. The engineer I quoted from Vudu said that the streaming bitrates he listed for Vudu have not changed since 2015. Streaming providers in general have not raised their internet speed requirements in years, either, because their bitrates are UNCHANGED.

Ripping a DVD, or even a blu-ray, to a hard drive has NOTHING to do with streaming nor is it any great display of computing skill to do so. Anyone can do this. Anyone.

Kaleidescape is an incorrect example as it is NOT a streaming service. Kaleidescape is a download service and it is a pricey one at that. The Kaleidescape media players start at $3500 for the Strato C and they go up to $13,000 for the 10Tb Terra model. Talk about overpriced hard drives and conventional ones at that! Prices are from Best Buy as of today. This is not exactly a consumer friendly option at these prices.

"Unlike streaming services, each movie is downloaded and stored on a hard drive on either a Kaleidescape Terra movie server or a Kaleidescape Alto or Strato movie player."

We have been able to download large files for many years; Kaleidescape is just a proprietary and very expensive way to download gigantic movie files. Who here wants to pay $3500+ for what is little more than a conventional hard drive?

Kaleidescape has NOTHING to do with streaming!

https://www.kaleidescape.com/strato-movie-player/

Kaleidescape no longer even lists the Alto model, their former entry level $2500 "bargain" model.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchp...=960&keys=keys

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I've always said it's all Digital, that 1:1 is coming for Streaming Video. I have done it with DVD and Blu-ray, Kaleidescape has done it with 4K so it's not impossible. If you have the Bandwidth and are set up properly. I don't experience the Buffering or Degradation with Bitrates in the 16Mbps range. So Streaming is only going to get better, and it will catch up to Disc very soon!

You are ignoring the very real possibility that 5G may just encourage more households to lose the TV set if they can get broadcast tv and everything else through a 5G mobile signal. You think fibre will be the answer to everything but I actually think it will be 5G that could potentially bring down home cinema. Money is tight and will be going forward. If people can get broadcast and Netflix etc all through one contract on their phone (increased mobile data) that may be all she wrote.

I insist that digital is bad for home cinema.

[Groot]

5G won't bring down the TV. Data caps are gonna be a thing regardless of the speed. Money may be tight but people will still be out beating the shit out of each other after Thanksgiving for TVs. We're good.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You are ignoring the very real possibility that 5G may just encourage more households to lose the TV set if they can get broadcast tv and everything else through a 5G mobile signal. You think fibre will be the answer to everything but I actually think it will be 5G that could potentially bring down home cinema. Money is tight and will be going forward. If people can get broadcast and Netflix etc all through one contract on their phone (increased mobile data) that may be all she wrote.

I insist that digital is bad for home cinema.

5G will do nothing to make watching a movie on a 5" screen preferable to watching it on a TV. No one will be getting rid of their 65" TV in favor of a 5" phone screen. No one believes this silliness but you.

5G might get me to drop my ISP, but that is about all it will potentially impact.

You think nearly everything is bad for movies and TVs.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Groot

5G won't bring down the TV. Data caps are gonna be a thing regardless of the speed. Money may be tight but people will still be out beating the shit out of each other after Thanksgiving for TVs. We're good.

Data caps can be bypassed if a company decides to offer a service free (Netflix or HBO for example) if you sign up with them. That would make people switch to mobile.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Data caps can be bypassed if a company decides to offer a service free (Netflix or HBO for example) if you sign up with them. That would make people switch to mobile.

People ALREADY have mobile and the same theoretical waiving of data caps for Netflix are just as possible no matter how you access that service. Netflix could strike such a deal with cell services and ISPs alike. Unlimited data or not, no one will prefer to watch a movie on a phone over a TV or a projector.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You are ignoring the very real possibility that 5G may just encourage more households to lose the TV set if they can get broadcast tv and everything else through a 5G mobile signal. You think fibre will be the answer to everything but I actually think it will be 5G that could potentially bring down home cinema. Money is tight and will be going forward. If people can get broadcast and Netflix etc all through one contract on their phone (increased mobile data) that may be all she wrote.

I insist that digital is bad for home cinema.

People love their Wireless, but Fixed 5G is not the answer to High Speed Broadband to the home:

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/1...ns-facing-high

You're right for Mobile Devices 5G will work great, but FTTH is needed for the Bandwidth of Streaming and Cloud Services. That Rude Awakening is starting to happen, and you're too late because it's All Digital!

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I insist that digital is bad for home cinema.

To continue in English press one, para Español oprimo dos.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by alchav21

...and you're too late because it's All Digital!

Kevin McCarthy - Invasion of the Body Snatchers end - YouTube

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

People love their Wireless, but Fixed 5G is not the answer to High Speed Broadband to the home:

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/1...ns-facing-high

You're right for Mobile Devices 5G will work great, but FTTH is needed for the Bandwidth of Streaming and Cloud Services. That Rude Awakening is starting to happen, and you're too late because it's All Digital!

I already stream, a little, and my download speeds exceed yours, so what "awakening" are we waiting for? And if that "awakening" is half as wonderful as you claim, what would be "rude" about it? Your saying that everything is "all digital" is as nonsensical as ever. My ebooks are all digital; my compact discs are digital, my stored documents are all digital, my dvds are all digital, and on and on, is there even a point to your repeating this silly blanket phrase over and over?

[dcx4610]

Even if streaming becomes 1:1 with physical media, not actually owning the content will always be my sticking point.

You are basically purchasing a long-term rental with all of the streaming services. From movies, games and music. We've already seen a huge number of these companies come and go.

I know that 10 or even 20 years from now, (unless something catastrophic happens), I will be able to pull a 4K movie off my shelf and watch it at anytime. I can't say the same thing about digital copies or streaming services.

To me, if you truly care about something, you want to physically own and want the best version possible.

Unless streaming gets to a point where I can download a a 1:1 copy on to a hard drive and keep that file forever without DRM, I'm not interested.

I'm not anti-digital. I just want to be in control of the content. I purchase FLAC audio files pretty frequently because I know I can copy them, back them up, etc. I actually own and control the files and it's a 1:1 copy of the audio CD. I can't say the same thing about movies or games.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I've always said it's all Digital, that 1:1 is coming for Streaming Video.

So you believe a 64 Kbps MP3 is the same as a 320 Kbps MP3 because they are both binary (digital)?

BTW, its not ALL digital, live audio and video is sourced from analog signals, as in microphones, CCD or MOS pickup devices. A lot of digital music devices has sounds that were sampled from analog sounds.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Groot

5G won't bring down the TV. Data caps are gonna be a thing regardless of the speed. Money may be tight but people will still be out beating the shit out of each other after Thanksgiving for TVs. We're good.

Oh hell, that's only a month away. I need to decide on a set pretty soon.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by octagon

Oh hell, that's only a month away. I need to decide on a set pretty soon.

I have been recently told that unless you own a projector, you don't have a "dedicated" home theater. You might wanna get one of those so as to be legit.

Don't forget the bottle of bubbly to do the dedicating with, either.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I have been recently told that unless you own a projector, you don't have a "dedicated" home theater. You might wanna get one of those so as to be legit.

Don't forget the bottle of bubbly to do the dedicating with, either.

Who told you that?