The rumor is that Warner is coming aboard soon

[Terjyn]

Originally Posted by bluperch

I highly doubt that Warner is going to make their determination based on numbers sold.

Warner isn't stupid. The only reason to choose HD-DVD once profile 1.1 hits would be if more people were purchasing those players.

They aren't.

It's not just the numbers, it's the combination of flat out superiority AND numbers.

HD-DVD has been doomed for a long long time. The only question is would they drag Blu-Ray down with them or not.

[Esox50]

I'm only going to say one more thing. The signals have been there folks. Look at some posts from well respected Insiders here. Look at what has happened starting in August, including subsequent quotes from Ron Sanders and Dan Silverberg.

Still a rumor, but the "signals" are there...

Like Doby said, only an HD DVD "head buried in the sand" fanboy cannot see this coming. My only worry is whether M$ steps up to the plate with some ridiculous offer.

[Razzy]

Originally Posted by Terjyn

HD-DVD has been doomed for a long long time. The only question is would they drag Blu-Ray down with them or not.

You can bet the 800lb gorilla will try & extend this war as long as possible. I'v got a bad feeling their cooking up something as we speak.

[SpikesBluBlooded]

Originally Posted by bluperch

I highly doubt that Warner is going to make their determination based on numbers sold. Right now, that's miniscule (oooo, blu sold 16,000 more copies of Harry Potter ... big whoop. Those numbers mean nothing to these companies). They know that with the right support, either side could still win this thing. One question to ask is does Warner really want one format? If yes, then some decision will be made soon. If no, then they'll wait (and wait, and wait) to "decide." Why they would want dual formats is beyond me as pretty much everyone's in agreement that the normal consumer won't buy into high def until a winner is declared (unless Warner is in bed with Microsoft and secretly are supporting high def downloads by pretending to decide on a format to support).

Warner's final decision will be based on politics and under-the-table deals more than anything else. Whichever camp can make the better promise wins. I'm guessing that behind the scenes, the political maneuvering is every bit as intense as anything happening in "real" politics right now. That's how Warner is going to make their determination.

An interesting perspective, especially regarding "under-the-table" deals as being a determining factor. I disagree, though. Here's a quote from the article:

"Warner isn't talking, but people close to the situation say the studio is waiting to see which group sells more of the new-fangled DVD players this holiday season. "Warner wants one of the two sides to make a commitment to getting this format into as many hands as possible," says a studio executive with knowledge of its thinking.

So far Toshiba has eked out a lead. According to industry tracker Adams Media Research, by the end of this year as many as 578,000 U.S. households will own HD DVD players, compared with 370,000 that have Blu-ray players. Adams also estimates there are 300,000 more HD DVD players in circulation inside Microsoft Xbox game consoles. But that still pales in comparison to the estimated 4 million Blu-ray-equipped Sony PlayStation 3 consoles sold in the U.S."

That all said, the key thing to take from that is: "getting this format into as many hands as possible". $150M deals and cheap promises only goes so far. In the end, Warner is thinking long-term, and that is, what's going to sell the most product and make them the most money in the end. Remember, the whole purpose of both Blu-ray and HD DVD is to replace DVDs as the vehicle of choice for home movie viewing.

If anything, Michael Bay's comments regarding Microsoft wanting both formats to fail should have executives asking if there might be any truth to that, and if so, what would be the best course of action to ensure that it doesn't. It's pretty obvious what the answer to that question is: support the superior format.

I think it's interesting that Paramount/Dreamworks stated that their decision was based on cost and affordability. Quite frankly, I think that was a BS comment to defer from the $150M deal that was made, but even if it were true, does that sound like a smart business decision? C'mon, the reason anyone is in business is to make money, why would you want to sell something for little or no profit? Just doesn't make sense, especially since retailers are selling both formats (software side) for the same price. And from what I've read, in the end it's more a matter of pennies, not dollars, in the cost difference of production. I don't have the links, I've seen them out here, but take that comment with a grain of salt until someone provides one.

In the end, I still contend that it's going to be a matter of who sells more movies. Warner doesn't manufacture players, and they're not going to make the distinction between PS3 and a stand-alone player as far as how many units are in consumers' hands, it's just going to be "how many Blu-ray players are out there?" That said, and looking at it from that perspective, Blu-ray is hands down the leader in both hardware and software, and the public at large has already started to show their preference.

Here's to the best product winning!

[GregBlu5]

Originally Posted by Esox50

I'm only going to say one more thing. The signals have been there folks. Look at some posts from well respected Insiders here. Look at what has happened starting in August, including subsequent quotes from Ron Sanders and Dan Silverberg.

Still a rumor, but the "signals" are there...

Like Doby said, only an HD DVD "head buried in the sand" fanboy cannot see this coming. My only worry is whether M$ steps up to the plate with some ridiculous offer.

I certainly agree regarding the signals. And we are seeing signals from the retail outlets that are devoting more space to Blu. And we've also heard signals that the retailers don't want two formats much longer (that is the applicable aspect of the Betamax vs VHS war that does apply here).

(At this point, any money that M$ comes up with--and if they did succeed in bribing Warners--then it would have the potential of stagnating/strangling Hi Def disks indefinitely. That's why I don't believe that Warners is gonna bite on a bribe--it also didn't really help Paramount.)

As others have pointed out, there are too many consumer fence-sitters at this point who would jump into the fray if the war were over and there was a winner declared. That's the kind of profit that I believe Warners knows is out there and could take advantage of if they went with Blu exclusively.

The HDTVs are beginning to make their way into homes in ever increasing numbers. Those homes would then be ripe for Hi Def players, not just upconverts, and those players need disks to play in them. With the war over, all sorts of possiblities for profit are open. I don't really believe that Warners is that short sighted.

-Greg

[zipbags]

You cannot discount the power of Disney over consumers. When Disney starts to release their big guns (Nemo, Lion King, Cinderella,etc) you will see the average consumer start to look at HD. And it will be blu.

Has anyone asked a mod at AVS why they would delete a legitimate magazine article?? That makes no sense.

[Razzy]

Originally Posted by zipbags

You cannot discount the power of Disney over consumers. When Disney starts to release their big guns (Nemo, Lion King, Cinderella,etc)

Can't wait for Nemo and the Toy Story movies on Blu.

[statikcat]

Originally Posted by Esox50

Like Doby said, only an HD DVD "head buried in the sand" fanboy cannot see this coming. My only worry is whether M$ steps up to the plate with some ridiculous offer.

I think Warner has too much pride to submit with money offering (bribe, etc) to Microsoft/Toshiba. At this point it would look bad and nobody is going to buy the whole "the money is for advertising" shit that Paramount gave us. Warner is a big studio with possibly the best catalog.. Paramount has a crappy catalog and is not releasing a good amount of releases either.

I am sure Sony/BDA would offer WB a GREAT deal on sales/licensing/royalties/etc. That is because Warner knows BD sells and they will benefit that way. That is good business. Paramount took 150m straight up because no offer on sales would matter because they are not selling many movies in HD. That is bad business.

[tron3]

Originally Posted by kaliraver69

Everybody should support Warner by buying their BD's. Everyone on here should know about the Amazon Warner BOGO going on right now: http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.htm...72941&plpage=1
Great movies and great prices for movies like; 300, Troy, The Departed, Blood Diamond, etc.

I am not pleased with the "Warner Effect" of them converting the HD DVD movies to BD disc. But I still have several of their movies as the 30GB content is not bad. Not great, but not bad.

STAY AWAY FROM "THE BI-POLAR EXPRESS". That was a 15 Gb translation and you can hardly tell it is hi def. Utter piece of crap. THIS is what Toshiba wanted to sell as next generation DVD!?

[Esox50]

Originally Posted by zipbags

Has anyone asked a mod at AVS why they would delete a legitimate magazine article?? That makes no sense.

A little birdie told me a while ago that it is considered fact in the industry that Microsoft "supports" that forum...

[Living Near Shamu]

Originally Posted by Razzy

You can bet the 800lb gorilla will try & extend this war as long as possible. I'v got a bad feeling their cooking up something as we speak.

If the news are true, and they are leaked out like they were, Toshiba will do anything to prevent Warner from going blu-exclusive.

Expect to hear somewhat of a 1/2 billion dollar payment.

[joeorc]

Originally Posted by SpikesBluBlooded

An interesting perspective, especially regarding "under-the-table" deals as being a determining factor. I disagree, though. Here's a quote from the article:

"Warner isn't talking, but people close to the situation say the studio is waiting to see which group sells more of the new-fangled DVD players this holiday season. "Warner wants one of the two sides to make a commitment to getting this format into as many hands as possible," says a studio executive with knowledge of its thinking.

So far Toshiba has eked out a lead. According to industry tracker Adams Media Research, by the end of this year as many as 578,000 U.S. households will own HD DVD players, compared with 370,000 that have Blu-ray players. Adams also estimates there are 300,000 more HD DVD players in circulation inside Microsoft Xbox game consoles. But that still pales in comparison to the estimated 4 million Blu-ray-equipped Sony PlayStation 3 consoles sold in the U.S."

That all said, the key thing to take from that is: "getting this format into as many hands as possible". $150M deals and cheap promises only goes so far. In the end, Warner is thinking long-term, and that is, what's going to sell the most product and make them the most money in the end. Remember, the whole purpose of both Blu-ray and HD DVD is to replace DVDs as the vehicle of choice for home movie viewing.

If anything, Michael Bay's comments regarding Microsoft wanting both formats to fail should have executives asking if there might be any truth to that, and if so, what would be the best course of action to ensure that it doesn't. It's pretty obvious what the answer to that question is: support the superior format.

I think it's interesting that Paramount/Dreamworks stated that their decision was based on cost and affordability. Quite frankly, I think that was a BS comment to defer from the $150M deal that was made, but even if it were true, does that sound like a smart business decision? C'mon, the reason anyone is in business is to make money, why would you want to sell something for little or no profit? Just doesn't make sense, especially since retailers are selling both formats (software side) for the same price. And from what I've read, in the end it's more a matter of pennies, not dollars, in the cost difference of production. I don't have the links, I've seen them out here, but take that comment with a grain of salt until someone provides one.

In the end, I still contend that it's going to be a matter of who sells more movies. Warner doesn't manufacture players, and they're not going to make the distinction between PS3 and a stand-alone player as far as how many units are in consumers' hands, it's just going to be "how many Blu-ray players are out there?" That said, and looking at it from that perspective, Blu-ray is hands down the leader in both hardware and software, and the public at large has already started to show their preference.

Here's to the best product winning!

SpikesBluBlooded you are 100% correct in my Opinion due to the fact that Warner wants to sell the D@mn disc's the more disc's it can sell of a format the better., already Warner Bros. know outside of just Movies Warner Bros. can sell more Disc's with Blu-Ray than HD DVD why. because only Blu-Ray out of the two formats is in also PC SOFTWARE, and also PLAYSTATION 3 game software Warner Bros. game studios get to sell more Software on Blu-Ray. yes they still will be selling on DVD..so people may ask what has the Software side outside of Blu-Ray movies have to do with the format war. plenty i might add.

The more disc's you sell of a format the cheaper that format will be to produce content on that format. the disc's themselves will be cheaper the more produced to be sold with content providers paying less per disc to put their content on the disc's. the faster they can do that the more $$ they can make because they do not have to pay as much per disc. and with Blu-Ray already being in multiple markets outside of Movies the BDA will be able to move more disc's which is the entire goal anyway for "CONTENT PRODUCERS"

SUCH AS Warner Bros.

[stockstar1138]

one thing that i get out of this article for sure, is that there was, for certain a payoff between HD DVD and Paramount/DW and it is for 18 months.

intresting sony didn't comment, only time they havn't commented in the past was in the case of a new psp and ps3 price cuts tosh certainly did seem reassuring, i'd expect something out of them like, "warner has released more titles on hd dvd, it seems to us they favor us," but nothing like that was said from them. it'll be intresting in the next few days if warner is silent about this or denys it. its still a rumor, but with recent comments from Warner in the past few months, it sure seems like they are bracing the hd dvd fanboys for something bad.

what else is good, is that business week is pretty big, so a lot of people are going to see this. and even if it is just a rumor and warner doesn't do anything, a lot of people have gotten the idea not to buy into hd dud despite cheap prices from this.

[HeavyHitter]

Wow, very interesting read. If I were a Toshiba/MS HD DUD-FUD boy, I'd be a bit scared in the back of my mind. I agree too about this article coming from business week is notable.

[surfdude12]

Originally Posted by Jack

Right, the gap in sales increased but even with a 25% market, warner IS making money with HD DVD. I don't think they simply watch soft- and hardware sales and decide. Sure, BDA is in huge advantage (software sales, PS3+Player sales) and has a momentum, but to really convince Warner to go exclusive, they need to offer them royalties and/or money to compensate the (few) losses they will make by abandoning the red side. By the way, we need to buy more of those Harry Potter movies on blu

exactly. as much as we'd like to hope, warner cares first and foremost about making $$$$, not loyalty to one format. if they'll make more money to go blu, they will, if not, they won't. if they go exclusive, they'll have (at least temporarily) a smaller customer base until the HD-DVD fanboys smarten up and throw in the towel (which could be never as we already know).

[Underdog]

A tune keeps poping up in my head, in the rythm of Santa claus is coming to town..

Warner Bros is cooomiiiing tooo Bluuuuu!

[Razzy]

Originally Posted by Living Near Shamu

If the news are true, and they are leaked out like they were, Toshiba will do anything to prevent Warner from going blu-exclusive.

Expect to hear somewhat of a 1/2 billion dollar payment.

That's why I think execs should keep quiet until it actually happens. They've opened the door a crack for the gorilla and now he can come barging it.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by Razzy

That's why I think execs should keep quiet until it actually happens. They've opened the door a crack for the gorilla and now he can come barging it.

Its just rumors...

*gives gorilla a banana with tranquilizer*

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by Razzy

That's why I think execs should keep quiet until it actually happens. They've opened the door a crack for the gorilla and now he can come barging it.

You don't really think that the gorillas don't already know everything going on, do you? I doubt some LGF executive saying something about it changes a thing in that regard.

What it could do is throw cold water on HD DVD sales this season. It could even be engineered for that.

Gary

P.S. Another thing to consider is, that without someone credible putting this possibility on the table, wouldn't Warner be open to a class action from new HD DVD purchasers feel betrayed that they weren't informed of this possibility?

[stockstar1138]

Originally Posted by surfdude12

exactly. as much as we'd like to hope, warner cares first and foremost about making $$$$, not loyalty to one format. if they'll make more money to go blu, they will, if not, they won't. if they go exclusive, they'll have (at least temporarily) a smaller customer base until the HD-DVD fanboys smarten up and throw in the towel (which could be never as we already know).

warner owns both royalties in hd dvd and blu-ray disc. in order for them to make the big bucks, one of the formats they have royalties in is going to have to loss, so that mass adoption can take place. if they go hd dvd exclusive, they know they are going to kill both formats and get nothing out of their royalties, if they go blu-ray, the war is over within months (universal will go neutral), and warner can make some major dough off blu-ray. this is why they are going blu-ray exclusive, this is why a date still hasn't been set for movies like hairspray on hd dvd from their sister company, new line, and this is why billion dollar bribes are not going to influence decisions. yeah, MS offers them a billion, the get a billion now and loss out in 5 billion dollars of long term royalty and sales profit, they aren't stupid, its a bad business decision for them to go with hd dvd. anything over a billion dollars offered from MS, the shareholders will go up in arms about, so a massive, massive check isn't something to really fear.